where's the thrtead about the green paper on sen? Statements to go?

[grumpypants]

got to go to work, but are we discussing this? Link please if we are?

[Agga]

Just going through statementing, and preparing for fight surrounded by piles of legal books on disability, SEN and education. And it's just the beggining...

IPSEA SEN survey on the Green Paper:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/media_nonmember_requests/1223354-Special-Educational-Needs-Your-views-please?msgid=25753549#25753549

hope the link works

[Mumfun]

Kat Couldnt have put it better myself.

And I would be worried if School Action plus for example is removed and schools can do their own thing, many will simply do nothing or the absolute minimum.

[kat2504]

I think it's terrible. Although 1 in 5 might be on the SEN register, the vast majority are on school action or school action plus. Not statemented. Therefore the school is providing and funding their support. The small minority of pupils with a statement really need that level of support that a school can not afford to fund. Better teaching won't help a visually impaired child who needs funding for appropriate resources. Or a disabled child who needs mobility aids. Or a child with Down's Syndrome who needs one to one help in a mainstream school. The list is endless. Better teaching or even better parenting would not take those problems away. Those children deserve the extra help and funding and often their parents have had to fight long and hard for it.
Another example of government cost-cutting hitting the most vulnerable members of society.

[vesela]

Consultation is still open -www.libdemvoice.org/sarah-teather-mp-writes-seeking-your-views-on-special-educational-needs-proposals-23352.html

[grumpypants]

but the green paper says that the care plan will hold as much statutory weight as a statement. i am avoiding reading the papers and have read the actual paper to get the detail (as much as there is) - there's still a consultation period now i think.

[grumpypants]

exactly aunteveil - there is already a lot of cohesion in the system - multi agency meetings/ CAFs/ etc - I don't know that allocating a key worker will help (does this mean that they read and disseminate info from professionals?)and how are you going to reduce the number of assessments? Is it just going to be one day or something? Leonie - i don't think existing statements will be replaced, it looks like the idea is to phase in this care plan.

[auntevil]

Yes, i think these are my concerns grumpypants. How are they going to massage the figures to show whatever it is that the government want to show.
I think that if the real issue was to streamline the whole process for the benefit of the child - and parent - with early diagnosis and interventions, then they would not be looking to 'reduce' the numbers that fall into the category of needing extra support.
Regardless of the reason behind any additional need, if a school believes that extra help is required to push a child along to try to reach an accepted level for their peer group, then they have educational needs. Skimming the numbers receiving help will not mean that the numbers needing help have disappeared, they just won't achieve. How does this help UKplc exactly.

[grumpypants]

it's all happening by 2014 as far as i can see- the main changes will be a streamlining of school action and sa plus into one assessment, and combining the assessments into a 'plan' for the most 'needy' (for want of a better word, sorry) rather than a statement. and better choice of schools, but i can't see what the difference is. not sure what i think - do have concerns over how they will reduce the sen fig$ures.

[startail]

auntevil your concerns echo mine exactly, I have a bright dyslexic daughter, who's ability to get things down on paper falls woefully short of her understanding. At present the high-school SEN department are able to give her an hour a weeks literacy help and a social mentor,
The later is probably the most valuable because, like many dyslexics, she was socially immature at primary and had no idea how to make friends. Although she's grown up a great deal, she still finds her self excluded and an easy target for petty, unpleasant bullying.
The school can't make people be friendly, nor sadly do much about teenage bitchiness, but at present the SEN dept. can provide a place to go and someone to talk to.
Clearly if the Green Paper is a backdoor way of justifying staff cuts, I fear that those who remain just won't have the time to help those like DD and auntevil's DS.

[GKlimt]

Agree auntevil NICE guidelines for diagnosing & treating ADHD are very clear, now and have been for sometime. The guidelines take into account parenting strategies.

maypole aren't the children for whom you provide respite a very selected sample ? And your views biassed by this particular group of children. It's like someone working in child protection saying there's a lot of abusive parenting about

FWIW from my reading the green paper it's teachers not parents who are the current scapegoats for 'mis-classifying' SN.

[TheMaleyDail]

1. The percentage of children with statements of SEN is 2%.
   
   
2. Statements are statements of needs, not statements of funding. Very few statements come with funding. Most simply come with directions to the school about how they are to adapt their teaching.
   
   
3. The rare statements that come with funding, do not come with funding for the child, it is for the school, to spend as they see fit, included to pay off last years debts.
   
   
4. If the statement is written very carefully indeed, by having parents so incredibly switched-on with untold time to educate themselves and buy in legal advice (no your 'usual' low ability parent) then it is possible to have the statement written in such a way that the only way a school can fulfil it is by using the rare funds that the LA give, for that child only.
   
   maypole It is lovely to have your 'opinion' on this thread but try to be aware of the damage you can cause by puting forward arguements that have no evidence base.

[auntevil]

To those that believe that medically diagnosed conditions - by highly trained professionals - such as ASD or ADHD - are on the increase due to 'bad parenting', could i also point out the following. Diagnosis of other medical conditions such as allergies, hayfever and asthma are also on the increase. If i had of realised that this too must be due to 'bad parenting' - i would have tried so much harder, rather than watch my son gasping for breathe.
The truth is that parents who are finding their babies/children's behaviour difficult to understand go to medical professionals to find answers and help in order to become better at parenting their children.
No, i am not naive. I live in an area of London that has the tag of a 'deprived' area. I see examples of bad parenting styles all around me. There has been, and always will be 'bad parenting' - and it will affect their access to education when they start school. Schools do need to work more intensively with these children.
I do not live in an adopted reality. My concerns over this paper are genuine. My DS has a dx of dyspraxia. He is a good student, works hard, academically bright - but struggles to write. If numbers are to be cut as to those that are on SA and SA+, will it affect the support that he is given? Will he be an 'easy' target to reduce numbers? What happens then? Does his OT and physio stop too? Will i have to apply for a statement in order for the treatment and exercises that he needs, that are currently given under the SA+? Or, as i have the sinking feeling will happen, he be 'signed off' and allowed to educationally suffer in order for the targets to be met? Which of course i would not let happen, so we would use the family budget to have the same service privately - which in the end is what i believe the ultimate target really is. Kerching kerching kerching.

[lisad123isasnuttyasaboxoffrogs]

do go and jump off your horse Maypole and come and live here with my 2 girls with autism, you have no clue love!

And sorry to say I have attended a consultation in Herts this week and things are going to be changed in a massive way, and its not for our benifit but for the benfit of their pockets!!

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

Cant do anything but laugh at people who suggest the DXs of the SN parents on here are just an 'adopted reality' really,

[AfternoonsandCoffeespoons]

It's telling that some posters on here are responding in the way that they are. Defensiveness is often an indicator that a poster knows their adopted 'reality' has been exposed as a sham.

Or maybe its just an indicator that they are fed up with being told time and time again that they are lying? That any problem with their child is their own fault? Trust me, if you hear that sort of thing often enough; if you're always fighting to be heard, you'd be feeling a bit defensive too

[grumpypants]

Sorry, I didn't mean to ignore you maria i just don't want to engage in the old mudslinging debate about naughty kids just having rubbish parents.

[grumpypants]

I think, for me, the interesting things are the attempts to the involve the voluntary sector in assessments and support - where does that leave the professionals? What if you are in London - fantastic or a tiny village - not so great if there's only a Cats Protection League shop... and the doing away with the stages of SEN. Also, the attempt to remove children from SEN - you need to really sure it's poor teaching to do that.

[mariamagdalena]

My ds has an autistic spectrum disorder and ADHD. My parenting started out average but is now very effective. Because of more practice, more training, more criticism and more incentive to 'get things right'. I would hope that if he went to maypole's for tea, she would be amazed at how well trained he is.

20 years ago, I worked with children from a special school. Most were said to have 'mild brain damage', although a few had been removed from exceptionally abusive homes. Those children were just like my son, but the terms used have changed over the years.

My child genuinely has a moderate disability and significant special educational needs. Just like the kids I used to work with. But since that special school doesn't exist any more, he has to manage in mainstream. And I must be a bad parent who is being defensive about his bad behaviour and manufactured symptoms.

[amberleaf]

Oh do fuck off!

[majordanjarvis]

I think Maypole raises some interesting points.

It's telling that some posters on here are responding in the way that they are. Defensiveness is often an indicator that a poster knows their adopted 'reality' has been exposed as a sham.

"ADHD" and the 'chemical cosh' are some of the worst developments in recent years. Aldous Huxley would be spinning in his grave!