If your dc has had an offer for Oxbridge, what grades did they get in a levels and g.c.s.e's?

[DrMadelineMaxwell]

Just gauging the 'average' level of successful applicants. Dd is applying for Cambridge and I'm curious as to what makes a successful applicant.

TIA.

[LoniceraJaponica]

Also, his coursework and HAT went amazingly well, and so did the interviews. He could talk about history until the cows come home. Unfortunately DD is not as passionate as that about any of her subjects. If she could get an interview for a Harry Potter or You Tube degree that would be a different matter

[ImagoLuna]

Goodbyestranger, you make a very valid point. I hear you. I think it's just getting to me a bit at present that just because I was at a school that had never thought to try to send anyone to Oxbridge - until me - I was then offered a place, although my O Levels were no better than DDs GCSEs.

Just because of her school cohort, DD is in the lower half of her year in academic performance and it's the top of the top who get the best chance to pursue Oxbridge, not people like her. She may not even try to apply, although she'd love to have had the experience of the tutorial system. It's a pity that other universities don't offer anything like the one-to-one teaching you get at Oxbridge.

[goodbyestranger]

ImagoLuna I hear you too but - speaking from direct experience with some of my own DC - don't let the contextual thing put your DD off at all. It really computes as a tiny weeny thing even though it doesn't sound like that when described. If you think your DD would suit Oxford, then strongly encourage her to apply - especially if you think the school fixates on the top end only of their cohort, as measured in grades. Schools quite often get it wrong.

[goodbyestranger]

I'm conscious we're talking about two different contexts here, as in a) between schools and b) within them.

[brizzledrizzle]

A*, 6 As and two Bs
A*AA at A level

Offer from Oxford which was turned down.

[AnnDerry]

DD is doing History at Cambridge. She has 10 A 1A 1B at GCSE, 4A 1B at AS. Her offer was AAA and she got A A A plus A* EPQ .

[CornflakeMum]

High grades are no guarantee though. DS had 11 As at GCSE and is predicted AAAA for A levels. Good personal statement, lots of relevant information/ experience etc. He didn't even get an interview for Oxford.
His friend, who has had A in every single exam he's ever taken, didn't get an offer (after interview) at Cambridge.

However they are at an Independent School, so this probably worked against them. Also, the offer rate for DS's course was only 8% so we always knew the odds were against him.

[HingleMcCringleberry]

I don’t think being at an Independent School works against applicants, does it?

[goodbyestranger]

Not if you put into the pot the fact that independent kids are supposed to have an advantaged education and that they're over represented, on any measure, at Oxford and Cambridge.

On the other hand one does hear some of them say that they're discriminated against, but it does come across as slightly peevish.

[BasiliskStare]

Ds was an independent school candidate for Oxford. He would in no way say he was discriminated against. Nor did he think he was a shoe in - he was a bit nervous when going for interview.

So 1) at an Open day he was told - to answer the question - he needed a "decent handful" of A s - his school generally did fewer than other schools and he had 8 As ( plus one other) I know other DCs have far more - but he asked and they said - That's plenty , don't worry , - so he took from that that a few fewer than 8 was absolutely fine.

I would agree with Goodbye in that ( and this is Oxford OP not Cambridge - although I believe they ( Cambridge - friend with state school DS applied ) have since last year ( for History) started to follow a similar model since the gradual demise of ASs - the HAT is important . So for those subjects where there is an aptitude test , that is up there at least with how many GCSEs you have ( assuming pre A level application)

I do know that Cambridge used to take more account of AS , UMS scores etc, but I would reiterate that simply looking at GCSE and A level results may not tell you a great deal. There are lots of DCs who have a better clutch of school exam results than my DS. ( But I think you know that )

All above caveated in that I am a parent and not an admissions tutor.

[DrMadelineMaxwell]

Thanks for all the informative answers. Happily, we do still have AS levels in Wales, so she'll have a great basis to make the final decision of whether or not to apply based on those after results day in the summer.

[GertNBert]

You can look up interesting admissions info on GCSEs on freedom of information requests on THIS WEBSITE - 'whatdotheyknow'. You have to hunt around a bit but there are some interesting facts and figures. There are some knowledgable Mumsnetters about but knowing what someone's else's kid got isn't really that meaningful.

[CornflakeMum]

I don't think I'm being peevish, just honest!

I was chatting informally to one of the admissions staff at the Oxbridge open day and she said that there has been so much negative media coverage about the state school/independent school balance thing that they have been told that they have to make any offers (for this particular course) 2-3 grades higher for students from independent schools. When she found out where we lived (leafy, very middle class suburb in SE) she said we should have sent DS to the 6th form college as it is eligible for contextual offers 3-4 grades lower! This is despite being full of the sons and daughters of dentists, doctors, lawyers etc and not being in any way underprivileged.
So yes, I do think being at Independent School can disadvantage a student at the moment - especially in the humanities, where getting the A*s can be very difficult and the marking very variable.

Anyway, my point to the OP was that looking at what other successful applicants achieved in their GCSEs is pretty pointless in this context.

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

I'm not sure I believe that's true.

I believe you spoke to someone, but I think maybe you misunderstood what was said?

FWIW, the battle for candidates is getting an offer, not making it. Enormously more candidates are rejected pre-offer. If you want a candidate, making them a lower offer based on recognition of their situation might be sensible. But you could only compare that to the situation of other candidates who also got offers, but missed them because they were high.

You can't make a sensible comparison between an offer-holder and someone who wasn't interviewed.

[user369060]

I do not believe that there is ANY course at Oxbridge differentiating its offers by as much as 2-3 grades, in either direction.

Oxford in any case makes rather low offers i.e. most candidates receiving offers are predicted higher grades than the offer grades. And I am really very sure that there is NO course in Cambridge that would raise or lower offer grades by as much as 2 grades for contextual reasons.

[cathyandclare]

DD is at Cambridge had 10A and an A, she had AAA in her A levels. She went when they said that you needed a minimum 90% average at AS, which she barely scraped. Made it on the interview and essay I think.

She says that friends definitely don't all have strings of A* at GCSE, they vary widely, they've all got them at A level though, very little/no room for manoeuvre on their offers.

[FordPerfect]

Re differential offers, Oxford (afaik) gives standard offers, but Cambridge doesn't. I don't know by how much Cambridge's offers vary - I have heard of an extra A offer (i.e. A A A rather than A A A), the need to achieve an A in a fourth A Level, a two 's' offer rather than two '1s' in STEP for Maths, which is a huge ask.

[goodbyestranger]

Because of the distinct methods of selection until the recent changes at Cambridge you'd expect Oxford to be A heavy at GCSE and A lite, relative to Cambridge. Most DC applying will know to play to their strengths if they haven't shone especially at GCSE and it's perfectly natural for 18 year olds to take their foot off the gas once they've achieved a comfortable AAA offer from Oxford. Not all will of course, but my bet is that a fair number do. Not so relaxing, the run up to a Cambridge offer :)

[goodbyestranger]

A* lite at A level, relative to Cambridge is what I meant to type.

[FordPerfect]

Given that for Maths at Cambridge the big hurdle is getting through STEP rather than getting an offer, meeting the offer is a big deal.

[Needmoresleep]

LRD, it may depend on subject. DC knew several who were asked for 4xA for Cambridge science. They were at a school where 70% of all A levels were at A. Imperial was another who used to vary offers. However given different students from the same school were getting different offers for the same course, the assumption was that the variance was due to how much the University wanted the student, with the more marginal student getting the higher offer. So not just because of the school. DS knew someone who had a 5 A level offer from Imperial. That said four A level offers have to be limited to applicants who can take four A levels. I don't really see it as a bias against private/grammar schools. An applicant who is capable of thriving on a Cambridge science/engineering course and who is well taught in a small group of equally able students should not find A*s in double maths A levels much of a stretch. Someone whose teaching is patchy and who is effectively self teaching, might. The step up from school to University science is big and Cambridge/Imperial will want the students with the most potential.

Moving to a sixth form college with weaker teaching simply to get a lower offer sounds mad. Both DC have found the maths elements of their non-Oxbridge but still demanding University courses relatively easy, whilst some of their peers have struggled. The confidence that comes from knowing that you are capable of getting there with complex maths concepts, is huge.

Disclaimer - DC went through the old system.

[user369060]

a two 's' offer rather than two '1s' in STEP for Maths, which is a huge ask.

This would be extremely rare. Even the most "competitive" colleges for Maths such as Trinity give most Maths STEP offers in the standard form of 1s at STEP 2 and 3.

It is simply not the case that an Oxbridge course with a "standard" offer of A star AA would routinely raise this to as much as three A stars or lower to as "little" as ABB for contextual reasons. Of course, there are always exceptional cases - and the criteria for accepting missed offers do take into account context - but there is simply not such a high level of differentiation in offers given out.

[user369060]

BTW I would be tempted to put Needmoresleep's specific school into the "exceptional" category i.e. that specific school could well be subject to higher requirements.

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

ford, that's true, but Maths is the exception here. The poster was referring (I think) to Humanities.

You cannot compare someone who didn't get an interview to someone who got an offer.

[Quadrangle]

His friend, who has had A in every single exam he's ever taken, didn't get an offer (after interview) at Cambridge.*
However they are at an Independent School, so this probably worked against them
Maybe he didn't have what they were looking for at interview, despite good grades?