Tracking very bright children

[Judy1234]

women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/families/article3688461.ece
Sunday Times article

TV programme next week.

"Another family on the programme, the Napier-Smiths, deal with the challenge of how to educate their son Adam by sending him, aged eight, to a private boarding school 200 miles away that prepares children for Eton.

After moving house to try to find a suitable school five times in as many years, his mother, Emma, who was brought up on a council estate, thinks they have found the answer. Adam, now in his eighth month of boarding, is, Emma says, ?really happy? and sufficiently stimulated at last.

One thing she notices is that Adam seems to be becoming just another little boy, enjoying toffee apples instead of endlessly reading. She admits she was dazzled by his gift. ?We always looked for a school to cater for his academic needs. But then we became more relaxed about his abilities. I felt he should be somewhere he could enjoy himself,? she says.

?I have seen children who?ve never grown out of that geek, boffin stage. It is cute when someone is six doing very difficult maths and speaking in a small voice, but society doesn?t look kindly on teenagers or adults like that. It?s fine having a brain but if you can?t mix in society there?s no point.? "

[Mhamai]

How does one define mixing into society though?

[ScienceTeacher]

Sounds like a happy story.

[Mhamai]

Maybe I didn't post that very well. What idea of society do you have that would be better to mix into? Does one exist? Isn't society generally an amazing mix of countless cultural/educational mixes? Isn't there room for everyone? Maybe I'm missing something here?

[ScienceTeacher]

He's probably mixing with his friends - other little boys. He probably plays football with them after prep.

[SenoraPostrophe]

what a load of rubbish.

if adam is "happier", then it's probably because he's far away from his neurotic, obsessive mother.

as for the mensa girl - an IQ of 170 isn't terribly unusual. it means she's 70% ahead of average for her age. it doesn't mean she needs special schooling, and doesn't mean she needs a place in the "good" local scholl any more than an average child.

[SenoraPostrophe]

but why do very bright children need ot be tracked/ do they run away often?

[Mhamai]

[Piffle]

Georgias mum is being over precious. What a 4 yr old needs is playdough, some friends and party invites and playdates. Her brain power will not shrink while she plays! And one thing gifted kids need more than anything is social interaction as some are square pegs in round holes and as they grow up, move further away from peers= social life negative.
ds1 went to failing school from reception to yr2. Then onto great parents dream school from yr3-5 then yr6 at top performing catholic primary. Not by choice but as area we moved into it had the only spaces! He succeeded at every school!
I knew he was super bright I knew IQ was huge. But I resisted pushing him academically more than he needed. He is happily in yr9 at good state grammar. Predicted all a* for gcse.
I think i have made the right choices because although he has suffered bullying, and social issues, we have encouraged him to remain in his peer group and get along with them somehow. Now he has some good friends and is popular. As important as the a* IMO as after all he is still a kid!

[Judy1234]

The intersitng point is often whether the parents push the children to much and in his case by being sent away (at what I believe is usually too young an age) they actually buy him a normality and relief from the parents in a sense. I just read the Telegraph article about that Muslim girl who went to oxford in her mid teens and is now working as an escort - she was very very pushed by her father (she says) and she says physically and emotionally abused (he was later jailed for misconduct with other teenagers). The other girl on the TV programme her mother is very upset she didn't get into the only good state school locally. I think the programme is going to chart a group of very high IQ children for the next 12 years which is always very interesting.

If you have a very high IQ then in my view you should be with other clever children at an academically selective school at the very least.

[fembear]

"an IQ of 170 isn't terribly unusual. it means she's 70% ahead of average for her age."
No it doesn't! An IQ of 170 is very unusual - it means that your IQ is higher than 99.99% of the general population. These things are measured on standard deviation, not mean averages.

[snorkle]

From IQ percentage & rarity chart an IQ of 170 occurs in 1 in 652,598 people (for sd of 15, which I think is the usual). So maybe roughly one person in 1000 secondary schools at any given time? I think though that IQ tests aren't terribly accurate at that level, so it could easily be a bit less rare than it's supposed to be.. but still rare.

[snorkle]

I can see why very bright kids are interesting to track, and results could be useful in determining the best way to raise them (though all kids are different, so maybe not). But the whole dog & pony show type lets put them on TV & let everyone in the country gawp at them seems rather distasteful and something they may well grow up to regret.

[wheresthehamster]

It doesn't mention whether that odd family will be taking part in the follow up programme.

[avenanap]

Isn't raising children, gifted or not, a balance? Fun and education. With alot of bright children parents forget about the fun aspect and become determined to feed their child an education that they are not ready for. It is unfair on a child to teach them GCSE maths at 10, it places expectations on the child and it does not help them grow up to be healthy, happy adults. Finding a school for these children is very difficult, academically they may excel but emotionally people forget that they are children. There are alot of emotional issues for gifted children, a 4 year old asking about death doesn't necessarily have the mental capacity to understand. My ds is very bright, he has problems socially and there are few schools, state of independent, that fully understand all of the needs of gifted children.
I watched the first of the programmes about gifted children, the one which had Adam's story and I was disgusted with the vast majority of these parents that gave their child no other life other than academic or chess. There was one child that was withdrawn from school because he was not allowed time off school to attend competitions. These children should be allowed to be children, they are not spectacles for our amusement. They do need support though and there are few schools able to give this.

[Berries]

DD2 has done some aspects of the CGSE maths and enjoys it. I think the difference is that we have no intention of her sitting the CGSE. We have just gone through secondary selection & have turned down 2 of the top 10 academic schools for a school which we think will give her a more rounded education. Interestingly, she also wanted this school as she thinks she can get a good education & have a life.

[Judy1234]

Yes, the article points out all those who did really do that well. The Muslim one is now a prostitute. Ruth Lawrence I think hasn't done too badly - works in Israel. I was reading about a gifted German violinist who had to break way from his parents at 16 or 17 and take himself to America and seems to be doing well now. It's often parental pushing as much as genius in some of these cases. If you can keep them within their age range it helps. I was a year young at school and that wasn't so different it was a problem. The highest IQ score I ever got was 159 but they're a bit unpredictable. What I do think helps bright children is being in a school in their normal age range where the whole class works to a high level whether that's the Eton feeder mentioned above or Westminster under school, Haberdashers boys Juniors or whatever. Sadly in this country I don't think there are selective primaries like those unless you pay.

[LynetteScavo]

Why on earth would you test your child's IQ at 2 3/4?

[Blueblob]

Knowing a few people at Eton who were in the top top op sets they were normal teens. Beat a few myself in games likes chess before. What's the fuss?

[SueW]

We've just turned down a place at the most academically-selective independent single-sex school locally (bus ride 7-8 miles) and have chosen for DD to attend a less academically selective, more local (5 min walk) co-ed independent school. DD has been attending the junior school of the latter since age 4.

DD's quite level-headed so far; she socialises well. She has lots of friends at her current school and she is starting to love sport. I suspect, I hope, that in the great scheme of things, our choice won't make a difference to her grades.

[Judy1234]

Hopefully it won't. If it's secondary it might make a difference if all the girls are rich and posh and don't go to university. If instead the peer group at 15+ are all going to good universities rather than trying to get the grades to make not too good ones then it might make a difference because it's your peers not your parents so much that matter when you're a teenager.

[SueW]

Believe me I have thought long and hard about it, visited every school, etc. I started doing tours with DD when she was in Y4. The more academically-selective one is my old school and I attend Old Girls' functions and have fond memories of my time there. I used to work at the less academically-selective one and I know parents of children in both schools who are a few years older than DD so it would be fair to say I have a fairly good knowledge of both schools.

Pupils at the school we have chosen go on to a variety of universities, according to their ability, and each year some of them achieve excellent academic results.

I don't think she will go unchallenged - there is an excellent academic programme in place.

And nothing is set in stone. It is not unknown for pupils to change from one of these schools to the other during the course of their 11-18 education and we have discussed this with DD.

[Piffle]

different label is all starlight. The article referenced refers to gifted or high IQ children.
lots of reasons for getting kids IQ tested. Lots of even better reasons not to! It was ex p that got ds1 tested as his friend is a child psych and was so impressed by ds1 she offered. I actually wish he had declined fwiw. IQ means little in the real world of school. You need many other skills to succeed. IQ can complicate expectations.
I am tracking my own bright children, it is my responsibility to ensure he gets opportunities.
I appreciate that I'm lucky we've been able to do this.