Male comedians and their ‘jokes’ **TW**

[Wavypurple]

I’m not a big fan of Jimmy Carr, I’m reading and DP put on his new special on Netflix to watch.

Not even thirty seconds in - rape joke.

Ten minutes later, he asks the audience if a woman has ever cried during sex to which several men proudly shout ‘yes’. JC goes on to say ‘you’re a rapist’ followed by eruptions of laughter from the audience. Seriously, as if it’s the funniest thing they’ve ever heard.

My point here (other than the fact that several men shouted proudly that a woman was crying during what they consider to be sex) is that prior to this JC mentions subjects such as being pro-vaccine and pro-BLM movement in a positive way, his jokes encourage you to laugh at his perceived stupidity of people who are anti these things. (To clarify, I also have my vaccines and support BLM and I’m not suggesting he should make negative jokes about either).

Of the joke topics JC and society in general decide are too edgy or offensive to laugh about (understandably - again to clarify racist/homophobic/anti-Semitic jokes are not funny and not jokes at all), rape is always on the list of things that are acceptable to throw in there.

My point of mentioning these other topics that are off limits is to demonstrate how sexual violence is equally as horrific and offensive as these, and yet still joked about.

I notice this with almost ALL male comedians, even the ‘woke’ ones.

Not sure what the point of this post was to be honest. It was just upsetting to watch and wondered if anyone else has noticed this in regards to male comedians.

[CallMeNutribullet]

The thing with Jimmy Carr is that the joke isn't actually that sexual violence is funny (and I say that as a previous victim of sexual violence). His entire act is about pushing the boundaries of what's acceptable to say and how we react towards that. Some people will laugh due to the shock factor, some will be turned off by it.

I'm pro the rights of comedians to be offensive even when the material offends me personally (eg I dislike Dave Chappelle's take on me too while still thinking he's the most talented comedian of his generation)

[CallMeNutribullet]

@deydododatdodontdeydo

I notice this with almost ALL male comedians, even the ‘woke’ ones.

Jimmy Carr has form for this, but I can't think of another male comedian that I listen to who does this. At all.

Frankie Boyle has made lots and lots of rape jokes

[JackTheHack]

I normally like JC but this set he did wasn't funny

[CheeseMmmm]

OP was this on mainstream TV?

[CheeseMmmm]

Oh god sorry.

His special on Netflix.

IMO.

Things on mainstream telly esp primetime IE not 3am.

Are different to going to show, comedy night etc.

Netflix etc not thought about. Bit in between. Did it have rating? Need to think on streaming services.

But if deliberately choose to see a comedian set,

V different imo than it being on main usual TV channels, esp BBC (public pay).

[CheeseMmmm]

Just looked it's 18 on Netflix.

Jimmy Carr imo is a sneering, slimy, obnoxious misogynist shitbag.

For me, it's mainstream telly that's the major issue.

Even if playing nice. Given his material. I don't appreciate him being on panels funny progs etc esp as mentioned BBC.

It is widely seen publicity for him, the BBC public are paying. Raises his profile, rubber stamps him as comedian who is crowd pleasing choice for general public, everyone.

That imo is not on.

Same goes for coren son. Behaviour and what written for columns just way way over line. Good choice for co host broad appeal family viewing?

Nope. There are loads of other people available. Use one who hasn't done the bizarre awful things he has.

[CheeseMmmm]

nutribullet

I've not seen this set.

In your view-

Did his boundary pushing make you (general you IE audience) think? Challenge views? Cleverly point of joke was to highlight in shocking way that women crying sex isn't hahaha? Riposte to men who said me! Making them less proud of themselves?

What other groups of people did he cover? (I dread to think!). In a similar way obv.

Just interested- if loads then a handful for flavour will do!

I mean choosing to go and see a comedian well known for being racist/misogynist/homophobic whatever or just v bad taste jokes about sexually abusing children I mean there's all sorts out there.
Then really what did you expect?

The jokes exist because these attitudes are shared by enough of society to get audiences to buy tickets.

Society needs to change, saying xyz can't say, drives it underground. And increases hostility and resentment, imo strengthening shit attitudes. So counter productive.

Mainstream TV, totally different.
Paying and putting the likes of JC, Danny Dyer (so), Coren chap, boy George on general broadcast progs. Really bad message imo and no need for it.

[Downunderduchess]

I started watching it, I lasted about 10 minutes. I never laughed once. I have tried to watch his other stand up shows, as he is so popular I wondered what all the fuss is about.
I don’t find him funny. He even said at the start of this latest show that jokes about rape etc. don’t make you a rapist so basically it’s ok to laugh at them (or something to that effect). He even jokes about paedophilia, which is really beyond the pale.
I wonder if he would change if something like this happened to him or someone close to him, he doesn’t appear to get it.

I love comedy by the way, big fan of Katherine Ryan, Dave Chapelle etc.

[ldontWanna]

The real question is .. why do people laugh? Why do they go and pay to see him? Or watch him on whatever platform? His stand up is pretty well known for being smutty, mysoginistic , homophobic at times, very explicit, and really pushing boundaries. I think I remember an old show where he deliberately got more and more outrageous to see where the audience draws the limit.

So why do people like it /him? Is it gallows humour as a PP said? Is it a failing of our society? Is it that some people are so far removed from the material he uses it's all just a "script "? Is it hate against women? Is it a little bit of everything really... and he's doing his shtick because that's what they ask for and expect?

[Rizzoli123]

I think some comedians aren't for everyone as everyone has a different sense of humour. I can't stand frankie Boyle for much the same reasons but husband loves him.

I think JC is not for everyone and some jokes are near the knuckle but he's always been that way and he isn't ashamed as if the public laugh at a joke it's generally deemed as a good joke. If I'm offend I don't laugh but dosent stop me watching.

I will finish by saying I love Tom Allen.

[CheeseMmmm]

I think it's loads of different reasons.

Eg

Some enjoy in a straightforward way. Find jokes about gay men, black people, women being raped etc simply funny.

Some enjoy having their lines crossed, sort of a personal challenge, bit like some enjoy being scared witless by horror.

Some he's famous and popular and 'edgy' and that is appealing. To feel or show others that open minded/ unflappable/ not into PC gawn mad cancel culture etc.

More reasons I'm sure but I think they will be reason for some.

[LittleWingSoul]

I tried watching the David Chapelle stand up that caused such outrage as apparently he is a "GC ally" if you like, and made good comedy about it... I couldn't get past the hitting a lesbian (eg woman) bit and found him roundly unfunny. Didn't get further than that 'joke' really.

Not everyone finds the same stuff funny or the same stuff uncomfortable.

[CheeseMmmm]

Would he make that joke about women having a man cry, or men having a man cry?

Was it about crying during sex cos fear pain etc.
Or crying because got v emotional (which happens and is not at all the same!)

[CheeseMmmm]

Actually scratch that I know the answers obviously!

No wouldn't do other than men making women cry.
Yes crying because pain fear etc.

Dunno why I asked really!

[user456727821]

To all the people on this thread laughing at JC rape jokes and excusing it as free speech:

Under what circumstances is rape funny to you? Please list them.

[CallMeNutribullet]

@CheeseMmmm

nutribullet

I've not seen this set.

In your view-

Did his boundary pushing make you (general you IE audience) think? Challenge views? Cleverly point of joke was to highlight in shocking way that women crying sex isn't hahaha? Riposte to men who said me! Making them less proud of themselves?

What other groups of people did he cover? (I dread to think!). In a similar way obv.

Just interested- if loads then a handful for flavour will do!

I mean choosing to go and see a comedian well known for being racist/misogynist/homophobic whatever or just v bad taste jokes about sexually abusing children I mean there's all sorts out there.
Then really what did you expect?

The jokes exist because these attitudes are shared by enough of society to get audiences to buy tickets.

Society needs to change, saying xyz can't say, drives it underground. And increases hostility and resentment, imo strengthening shit attitudes. So counter productive.

Mainstream TV, totally different.
Paying and putting the likes of JC, Danny Dyer (so), Coren chap, boy George on general broadcast progs. Really bad message imo and no need for it.

@cheese I've not actually seen this set either I was talking more about JC's comedy in general. In the past I've seen him make rape jokes, jokes about paedophilia, disability jokes. I've seen him crack a joke about Pete Davidson's dad dying in 9/11 (to his face, it was one of these comedy central roast things).

It's the shockingness of what he says that's the joke, people who laugh at that kind of comedy do so because it's gallows humour- it's difficult to describe but it can almost be a relief to laugh at things that are so horrible.

BTW I'm not a massive JC fan or anything. I just think it's important that comedians are able to perform the kind of comedy they want. If there's not a market for it then they'll fall on their faces.

[CheeseMmmm]

For me there's a difference between mainstream TV and paying etc to go see. Have said more on this upthread.

The gallows humour thing is a nice idea. I think it's vv optimistic though.

Does Jimmy Carr joke in this way about people like him?
Reading just now, he apparently has panic attacks about when he got done for tax evasion. Initially he said didn't do it, then yes did when lie was too obvious. In thing I read he says still traumatised by that experience. Poor him tone.
Does he joke about tax evaders? Horrible things happening to them HOHO. My guess is no (could be wrong!).

Some laugh gallows humour. Some laugh because just find it funny.

The jokes I assume are directed at groups other than his? That says a lot imo.

[CheeseMmmm]

Example-

I went to see al Murray pub landlord small local theatre, more than 20 years ago I think. Before famous.

The act was about how fucking awful this landlord was.

A stereotype of a certain type of man, opinionated, small minded, boorish, unapologetically loads of 'ist's etc.

And through the set he said things (in character, that weren't out of place for character, that showed up what a nasty, hypocritical, unthinking, credulous arsehole he was.

It was brilliant. So so clever. He skewered that 'type' totally.

And when he got more famous, what happened? He became beloved by the group he was shredding. Why? They took him at face value. Missed the actual jokes. Loved his tell it how it is .. he's one of us!

Like the optimism but...
Don't share it tbh!

[MsTSwift]

All those “I’m pro free speech” types - so you would be ok with overtly racist jokes on mainstream tv? Bet you wouldn’t be. Op
Is spot on.

Also don’t understand why the porn industry seems exempt from rules and regulations that apply to other workplaces. Use of abusive hate speech against a group and physical risk that would be utterly unacceptable in any other workplace. If you step back and look at it in the round the only explanation for accepting this treatment of women as “normal” is deep ingrained misogyny.

I think applying the same standards

[ElftonWednesday]

YANBU, OP, and I'm shocked that material is still allowed/accepted/laughed at in 2021. I remember in the 1990s comedians making loads of sexist/misogyistic jokes and not finding them funny then, and thinking that sexism was about the only prejudice left that was acceptable in comedy. Amazing that Carr thinks it's still acceptable to make such jokes after the events of last ten years. The man is such a twat.

[Oblomov21]

There are loads of other comedians other than JC. I was watching R Howard and Kevin Bridges and Joe Lycett. All different.

[Tayegete]

I hate JC too. Unfortunately he is on lots of shows that I like watching so I quite often put up with watching him. Surprised by some of the views on here, joking about rape is not ok and I find it really sad that it’s still acceptable. I find so many male comedians a turn off, I’ve seen Dara O’Briain 3 times and he generally really makes me laugh but every set has to involve references to strippers or porn and I find it really boring. The one time he talked about doing a gig at a university and meeting some female students afterwards and being shocked that they didn’t fancy him - him being a not very attractive, middle aged, married father with clearly no self awareness. He represents so many common male views though, that’s why I find him depressing.

[motheroflions]

@MsTSwift

All those “I’m pro free speech” types - so you would be ok with overtly racist jokes on mainstream tv? Bet you wouldn’t be. Op
Is spot on.

Also don’t understand why the porn industry seems exempt from rules and regulations that apply to other workplaces. Use of abusive hate speech against a group and physical risk that would be utterly unacceptable in any other workplace. If you step back and look at it in the round the only explanation for accepting this treatment of women as “normal” is deep ingrained misogyny.

I think applying the same standards

I am one of those 'free speech' types.

I dont think racists jokes, rape jokes or jokes about disabilities are funny.

I also hate porn with a passion and believe the damage it has done and is still doing to women and men is huge - especially the reach it has to young people. I actually think this generation of young boys will actually be the worst lot we have had due to the access of hard corn porn on mobile devices at such a young age - but thats a whole other thread.

But I am very very wary of speech censorship and what people are 'allowed' to say. There aways is a line not to cross but there is always some one else's line that is lower than yours and so on - till we get to the point ^everything' is considered literal violence - and then women get arrested for talking about biology.

censorship is a double edged sword.

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

Frankie Boyle has made lots and lots of rape jokes

Yep, I used to like him, but stopped listening - he's just mean.
As I said, none of the ones I listen to do - and I follow many male and female comedians.
There are plenty of alternatives without rape jokes.

[RandomDent]

@CheeseMmmm

Example-

I went to see al Murray pub landlord small local theatre, more than 20 years ago I think. Before famous.

The act was about how fucking awful this landlord was.

A stereotype of a certain type of man, opinionated, small minded, boorish, unapologetically loads of 'ist's etc.

And through the set he said things (in character, that weren't out of place for character, that showed up what a nasty, hypocritical, unthinking, credulous arsehole he was.

It was brilliant. So so clever. He skewered that 'type' totally.

And when he got more famous, what happened? He became beloved by the group he was shredding. Why? They took him at face value. Missed the actual jokes. Loved his tell it how it is .. he's one of us!

Like the optimism but...
Don't share it tbh!

The same with Alf Garnett. Started out as a parody but became a hero to many.