Motivation for expats voting for Brexit

[Deadsouls]

I did post in the Brexit arms but no answers.

Briefly, here is the scenario.
My parents live in an EU country, emigrated over 15 years ago. There are quite a few expats in this area.

Last night I met a couple in the 60-65 age group who had recently retired here from the UK, having had a house here for several years. They emigrated here in April. They voted to leave the EU last year.

Now, I didn't yet get around to having a discussion with this guy. But....I am curious as to possible reasons/motivation for voting Brexit...
They said they love the life here.

1. Immigration - they are immigrants are they not? Into a country that has quite high migration.
   

1. Sovereignty - they have left the U.K. to live in a country that remains a member of the EU. Therefore will remain living under EU law/legislation.
   

1. For the people remaining in the U.K., as in living and working there? Why not stay in the UK to take advantage of the projected benefits of Brexit?
   

They will at this point be benefiting from reciprocal healthcare and so on, how this will change, not sure.
Hmmm I feel I am missing something. if you voted Brexit to not be a part of Europe (law/economy etc), why move to mainland Europe? I don't understand it. Can anyone explain?

[bathildabagshot1]

Well Turkeys do vote for Christmas. Brexit is a really good example of that whatever the reasons given.

[JumpingJellybeanz]

It makes no sense to me at all. All the expats I know, which is quite a few being one myself, voted remain and are extremely angry about the result. I don't know if it makes a difference that they are all work migrants rather than retirees.

[Deadsouls]

So....still turning this over in my mind.
So I hear what some are saying; army, fisheries, legislation, sovereignty, immigration etc

But it still doesn't make sense to vote to leave the EU, but then move to an EU member state country. Those leave voters aren't going to 'benefit' from the effect of their vote when UK does leave. Or was it an altruistic act on the behalf of those of us still living in the U.K.
I repeat, if you voted leave but live in an EU country, why do you not go back to the UK? Why do you want to live in a country that is part of the EU, when you just voted for a country to leave the EU?

[Mistigri]

I worry for them when full Brexit occurs

Why? Turkeys who voted for Christmas... I will take some personal pleasure in brexit-voting expats being forced to return home. One of the few upsides of this fiasco is that some people will get what they voted for.

[Peregrina]

Army, farming and fishing - OK that prompted the Leave vote, but I would suspect that they will end up disappointed.

To me this implies that they have bought the idea of an EU army - which isn't on the cards yet. Presumably they are happy joining in with American wars, which haven't enhanced our own security, so it seems a strange reason to me, but I am not them.
Fishing - Gove has said that the Danes will be allowed to fish in our waters, and there are big question marks over what subsidies will go to Farmers. Then of course, the big question marks over reciprocal health care, and pensions uprating.

[MyCalmX]

So Infinite can you explain why their patriotism doesn't extend to staying in the UK?

It simply doesn't make any logical reason to be against immigrants in you're own country and be an immigrant yourself brittany I agree (as an immigrant myself to the UK ). Especially when you've only been allowed in because of your EU membership because let's be honest, would a retiree having to apply via a points system have much luck getting a visa elsewhere?

[InfiniteSheldon]

The statement about their backgrounds implies their reasons for leaving but in no way changes or to a sweeping all. I do feel the rhetoric accusation from you is amusingly rich

[twofingerstoEverything]

You are making a statement about their backgrounds there, Sheldon, not specifying their reasons for leaving, unless you're implying that everyone from an army, farming, fishing background voted leave.
One year after the vote I've read many threads with you on and you are willfully ignoring and dismissing the concerns of remain voters and seem incapable of offering anything beyond rhetoric.

[InfiniteSheldon]

twofingerstoEverything reread my post there is a very clear explanation of their reasons; army, farming, fishing. One year after the vote I've read many threads with you on and you are wilfully ignoring the reasons these communities voted Leave.

[Deadsouls]

brittanyfairies

Yes the healthcare is an interesting one. I don't think this couple (who only retired here in April), have paid for an extended period of time into the social security system.
I only know from my parents who have lived in France 15+ years that they have, so they get 75% of costs reimbursed. As does apparently any citizen of an EU member country, (please correct me if I'm wrong). But who knows what will happen to these reciprocal arrangements once the UK has left. I can't wrap my head around it....yet...I mean the reasoning.

[whatwouldrondo]

As am I, and one who has been quite moved by the way a 73 year old listening and quietly discussing the issues with 18 -30 year olds, and speaking up, could inspire them to get involved with politics, and campaign on his behalf. They deserve a voice? We are not short of remainer voices from our generation of politicians, we can spare one. Though actually Anna Soubrey has been quite vocal on the failure to listen to and speak for the younger generation too.....

[Peregrina]

User, I am the same, a baby boomer who voted Remain.

[brittanyfairies]

I live in France and two lots of retired British neighbours who voted leave, apparently because the uk has too many immigrants. The irony that they are immigrants in France is lost on them.

I worry for them when full Brexit occurs and there is no reciprocal health agreement for all those pensioners who have never contributed to the French social system and will have to pay for their own healthcare. They don't understand the system they are living in and that how they have voted is going to completely disrupt their lives.

[whatwouldrondo]

Vince Cable is 73! I think you are singing from the same hymn sheet!

[whatwouldrondo]

I think that for the older baby boomers, it is an identity thing. I talk to one fairly regularly and in private he admits he is regretting his vote in the light of the mess that had ensued, and disappointment in May. When challenged on specific issues where he has picked up the Leave rhetoric, like Fisheries, he concedes that faced with the complexity and knowing the full story, rationally it was not a reason to vote Leave. However get him with his friends (some of whom retired to France as expats but returned as they got older and faced the reality of where they wanted to end their days ) over a glass of wine and you get "I'm a leaver, don't you know" (actual words) It is all tied up in feelings of imperial superiority and entitlement and also, frankly, a need to feel relevant and powerful again. After all he did business in Europe in the 70s and it was fine, so he knows better than I, doing business in the modern world, that it will be again....... His wife did an economics module when teacher training so she too knows better than I (Masters level study) too. They are actually people who made a huge contribution to society in their working lives, and were actual Liberals, not just liberal. They are intelligent and curious, and still so, but I have come to the conclusion it isn't rational, it is about having an identity.

[user1471453601]

Excuse the rant, but I am sick and tired of people, mainly the press (see Vince Cables latest interviews) blaming us baby boomers for brexit.

I'm a baby boomers, I was born and brought up in a country with a free at point of contact NHS, a free further education system, no world wars and end of salary pension.

I voted remain, I would vote against the triple lock pension idea.

I'm sick to death of being demonized because of my age. I know I've had it good, and as far as I'm able, I vote for the next generation to being treated equally as good.

Sorry for a bit of a rant, I just feel that my age group is being unfairly demonized, well, at least this one is!!

[Deadsouls]

But then if they are so patriotic (I mean these expats), why not go back to the UK, rather than settling on the European mainland?

[Deadsouls]

But do these people not benefit from U.K. being a member state (at present), in the country they've chosen to migrate to; whether Spain or France or wherever.

[GhostofFrankGrimes]

Same as the rest of decisions they've made in their lives: putting their country and family before their possible personal good

Blind patriotism won't pay the bills.

[Peregrina]

They don't have to live with it. Lucky, lucky them.
They may have to live with it, or live in reduced circumstances. At present pensions are uprated for EU citizens. This may or may not happen if we leave. No one can say. At present, certainly for Canada, and I think Australia, pensions are frozen at the rate available when you left the country. This is already causing hardship to British citizens who have gone to live in those countries, and at present the Government has no plans to do anything about this, even though the numbers of people involved are relatively small. Imagine if the numbers of British Citizens in Spain suddenly find that their pensions are frozen at 2019 rates? Forget about the triple lock and any uprating.

[twofingerstoEverything]

There you go then. The usual, unspecified 'best for the country' with no further explanation.
It's no wonder they have no regrets. They don't have to live with it. Lucky, lucky them.

[InfiniteSheldon]

My Spanish resident pil voted Leave, they are from an army and)or fishing background and voted the way they feel is genuinely best for the country as a whole. Same as the rest of decisions they've made in their lives: putting their country and family before their possible personal good
They also have no regrets and speak to many other expats who did the same and feel the same.

[Mistigri]

There are a fair few like this where I live - no French, move in entirely British circles etc.

Hopefully the collapse of the pound will eventually result in most of them going home.

[GhostofFrankGrimes]

Sadly there are people who think the empire will return with the click of their fingers. We have Brexieers pining for the return of industries that were left to rot by previous British governments.

There is also an air of arrogance and ignorance. Last week the Daily Mail was complaining about Brits having to queue at airports because other countries were tightening their border control. According to Brexit lore borders are to keep foreigners out they should never be used when Brits want to get to their Spanish sun lounger quickly.