Term-time absences banned by Gove? Have you heard anything?

[FantasticDay]

Just that really. A colleagues had heard that all schools had received a letter from the Education Minister saying that term-time absences were not to be authorised. I wondered if any of school staff on here could confirm /deny? Cheers.

[TheDoctrineOfAllan]

I really don't think that's true.

The government has a different priority set to you. It has decided attendance is paramount and only exceptional circumstances exclude that. So in their eyes, a family archaeological dig in Egypt and a parent who can't be bothered to walk a kid to school for a week are both not meeting their paramount attendance target. Each is abusing the system as much as the other.

You may disagree, but that is their position as ultimate arbiter of educational provision.

[JugglingFromHereToThere]

Who says the government is the ultimate arbiter of educational provision though ?
I think parents have the main responsibility for educating their children. They have more influence on attainment reached than anyone else.
Some send to private schools, some home educate, and others choose state provision.
I think we need to be careful to keep the balance right here (and respect parents more) respecting and developing the partnership that exists between home and school.

[TheDoctrineOfAllan]

They are because they provide it.

Just like you can be discharged from your NHS treatment if you don't turn up, or banned from driving if you speed consistently. All our public services have rules and penalties.

[BoffinMum]

If you get threatened with one of these fines, just deregister your child with effect from the first day of the holiday and immediately re-register him or her for a place at the same school on the day after your return from holiday. There is a small risk of losing a school place but if the timing is right for you, there is sweet FA a Local Authority can do other that give you your school place back.

[Elquota]

leave could only be authorised in exceptional circumstances

That's fair enough IMHO. Why does it make any difference to anyone if they weren't going to take their child out of school for non-exceptional circumstances anyway?

[Needtostopbuyingcrap]

When my school stops allowing traveller children going travelling, then i will stop taking my children out during term time.

One rule for all or non at all.

[Needtostopbuyingcrap]

God that sounds awful, i didn't mean for it to look so mean

[skyeskyeskye]

Our primary is an academy and sent out a letter to all parents saying that's what they propose to do from Sept. it's created uproar. This is quite a poor area, a rural area, lots of farming families who can't holiday at certain times of year. The school called it a consultation and invited opinions but basically they will do what they like.

A lot of families go on Sun holidays and you don't get choice of date when you can go. I paid £95 for a Sun holiday in June. The same holiday in worse accommodation in August is neatly £450, and that's just a cheap holiday. Parents wanting to go abroad pay even more.

There was talk of fining £100 per parent per child...

I think reducing the summer to four weeks, allowing holiday at set times would make sense, ie no time off during Sats etc. our school does get them watching DVDs and playing board games at the end of term which annoys some parents.

[skyeskyeskye]

The school is over subscribed too so there is no way you could deregister as you would lose your place instantly.

[exoticfruits]

I think there is a huge risk of losing the school place, BoffinMum. You need to be sure that you are in an undersubscribed school- the schools in my area that fine would have easily filled your place!

[meditrina]

"The letter came from our LEA saying that it was no longer up to the HTs discretion. That was at least 4yrs ago."

They are misinforming you. That it is HT's discretion is written into the law. Now, HT's may be subject to pressures from governing bodies and LAs etc, but that does not change the law.

It would be very risky to deregistser for this, as if the school had a waiting list, you would lose the place.

But I agree at it's always worth pointing out that the state does not have a monopoly on educational provision. Parents can go private or, possibly more realistically, HE - the latter seems a good choice for those who think that the educational value during absences is equal or greater than ordinary termtime. And perhaps it would take an outflux of families from those schools to make the authorities realise that parents don't see the school as providing a good educatiforever for 190 days.

[meditrina]

"When my school stops allowing traveller children going travelling, then i will stop taking my children out during term"

Perhaps you'll need to opt out of state education, then. Special provision for traveller children in written into various bits of relevant legislation, including the admissions code.

[saintlyjimjams]

I contacted ds2's new school from sept as I heard this (& it's a grammar school so I thought possibly awkward). Ds2 is taking part in a professional production & there's a chance he'll have to miss up to 2 days off school. They said it was fine & they had no problem with that as they see that sort of thing as a positive educational experience. However, I think that can be recorded as being educated off site so it may just be that it doesn't affect their figures.

[TwasBrillig]

The school my daughter is about to start at seems not to be changing. They are ofsted outstanding and are a lovely school.

The policy in the welcome pack was that you could take up to 2 weeks during the year if your child's attendance was 95per cent or above.

[StarlightMcKenzie]

Dd is a young carer. She starts school next year but if we don't go to museums etc. In term-time we can't go at all.

Same with some holidays, due to ds' disability.

HT has made it quite clear in parents welcome meeting that she NEVER authorises absences. She made it clear if absences are what you want to find another school.

This school is oversubscribed and we want dd to go there.

What are the chances of this HT being reasonable?

Dd's attendance rate (based on past history) will be excellent outside of this.

[DameSaggarmakersbottomknocker]

If a school has imposed a blanket ban than I would think that is challengeable under the law. The discretionary power of the head is written in law and it shouldn't be fettered by the LA.

I would authorise your days off SM but there are many schools that wouldn't. We don't authorise straightforward holidays when no exceptional circumstance is given, I have to be able to justify my decision.

One of the sticking points I think is that there is no clear indication of what is deemed an 'exceptional circumstance'. One HT's exceptional is another's 'run of the mill'. We quite often have complaints from parents that we've unauthorised a period of leave when the sibling has had theirs authorised and it creates confusion and ill-feeling.

[StarlightMcKenzie]

Hmm. There's also that added pain of incompatible half-terms (and I think next year also Easter). Again, unless one child is out of school, we can't have a family holiday.

It really isn't straightforward.

When I was working, I attended a workshop on school attendances run by FFT and the data clearly shows a correlation between attendance and grades. Even a few days appears to make a difference.

However that information was taken at whole-population level, not individual and afiacs is skewed by the figures relating to the absent children from CBA families.

If you look at the data over school holidays, this shows that the disadvantage groups fall behind, the MC more or less stay where they are but with some getting ahead as a result of their holiday hothousing involved holidays.

[inthesark]

Jimjams and theas18, unfortunately the regulations on Code B are also changing at the same time:

Schools should not mark a pupil as attending school, using the attendance code B for off-site education activity, unless the school is responsible for supervising the off-site education, and can ensure the safety and the welfare of the pupil off-site.

This is a complete pain in the arse for us, but I can't see any way round it, so if anyone knows what's supposed to happen instead, I'd love to hear.

[inthesark]

Sorry, meant to add, link here

[saintlyjimjams]

Oh interesting inthesark.

I wonder what will happen in the future. The school were very positive when I spoke to them, but we shall have to see in practice I guess. Luckily if he does need some time off for his current role it will be minimal as he has performed it elsewhere on the tour so shouldn't need to attend a rehearsal (which is the big one in terms of time off as it involves travel to the previous place on the tour).

[rabbitstew]

Sounds to me like another balls up by legislators who operate on the basis of those things which are one step down from damned lies... and who then cover their blushes by pretending they have left any real discretion in the hands of HTs.

[inthesark]

Yes, I'm not sure that directive has percolated down fully - another HT of our acquaintance wasn't aware.

We've had permission withdrawn for something that DD has done all this year, even though the guidelines say 'existing arrangements can continue', because it will affect their precious attendance records. Sigh.

[saintlyjimjams]

Oh fark. It should be okay for his current commitment (because if absolutely necessary he could prob get away with missing no school), but certainly suggests there may be problems ahead.

[meditrina]

It's not a legislators balls up (for once!) The word of the law is largely unchanged (just deleted the specific reference to holidays: everything else about HT's discretion remains there).

If individual LEAs are making 'directives' that are not actually compatible with the law (ie HTs must never XYZ) then that's a fault of local govt officials, not the government.

[saintlyjimjams]

Oh unless there's a matinee - although the weekday ones are usually late. I don't suppose you can even just ignore & take out because you need permission for the licence. At least I know the school think it's a good thing to do so will be hopefully able to find a way around it if it does become issue.