How on earth do people actually know which school is right for their children?

[JenaiMorris]

I'm just pondering really - ds is at secondary already and fingers crossed, won't need to move.

Looking back on how I chose primary I'm really not sure I picked the right one. I went for one that was fluffier, less strict, less pushy thinking that anything too rigid wouldn't suit him at all, but then he was 4! And actually, the more strictly structured lessons he has now (such as in maths) are the ones he does far better in.

And of course now I'm thinking that I should have sent him to a more traditional secondary

I often read threads on MN where posters list their requirements for a school ("strong academics", "traditional", "caring" etc etc). How do people know this?

Like I said this really is just a ponder...

[pointythings]

We had a choice of two primaries in our area, visited them both and it was very clear which one would suit our DD. At the time they were both OFSTED satisfactory but to my mind that was an unfair assessment in both cases. Both had very different strengths and weaknesses.

It has been a brilliant school for both my DDs, DD2 is still there in Yr5 now.

Re secondary we only have one, so no choice really, but it is a good school with a very strong sixth form.

[happygardening]

No not masses of choice duchessse but not no choice.

[duchesse]

We live in a rural area not all that far from Exeter and have a choice of two primaries, about as diametrically opposed in their ethos as it's possible to be; and two secondaries of similarly mediocre quality, three if it's a low numbers year and they have space (but the third is 8 miles away). There is one grammar in the entire LEA, to which any child in the UK has access (and plenty of parents move down here to send their children there). So not masses of choice really.

[happygardening]

We too in our rural community had a choice of at least five senior school and at least three grammar schools in the next county grammar schools in most cases transport of some description is provided although not necessarily from your front door.

[YellowandGreenandRedandBlue]

Talkinpeace - I have no idea about London or Dartmoor! Was just speaking from my own experiences.

[JenaiMorris]

Talkin - I do understand that. I'm not in London but had the choice of six schools in the small city we live adjacent to and at least two in neighbouring, rural towns.

Two of those schools might have required a fraught period on a waiting list (I really wasn't bothered enough about those to put ds through that) and a few would have required more travel than I'd have been prepared to make ds go through, but all in all we had some pretty good options.

I appreciate that we're fortunate in that however.

[JenaiMorris]

Yellow you are so right about the randomness - there are so many variables. It's not just the teacher for a particular class, group or subject it's the other children.

Sometimes the dynamic just doesn't work for a particular child - too many big characters in a group, too few big characters in a group - you name it.

[Talkinpeace]

Yellowandgreen
And outside large cities, many areas have very few schools.
Something that Londoners - especially policy makers ranting about "choice" seem to forget.
If you live on Dartmoor, all other options are not relevant.

[YellowandGreenandRedandBlue]

Duchesse it is crap when it isn't right. Glad they're happier now.

[duchesse]

From my son's point of view, any school where he wasn't unhappy to the point of self-harming to avoid going. Also from his pov, a school where the teachers don't try to come up with a pathological diagnosis every year (autistic/naughty/lazy/dreamy/lazy/away with the fairies).

From my DD1's pov, practically any school would have been fine.

From my DD2's pov, any school was fine that didn't cause her to hide under tables and/or refuse to go back after the summer break. That turned out to be not all that many schools in the end.

For the record all my three oldest children are very bright but with very different personalities. When they were very small I NEVER envisaged sending them to private schools, but there's something about a child that is so unhappy that even you dread sending them back in every day. They are all perfectly lovely and balanced individuals (all mid- to late-teens now) and all very high-achieving academically.

[YellowandGreenandRedandBlue]

Talkinpeace - in some areas there is plenty of choice in state sector, I know not everywhere but this is another aspect of postcode lottery - some areas have over subscribed schools, others have spaces in many good schools.

[JenaiMorris]

We have a good range of state schools; I appreciate that's not the case everywhere.

Private isn't an option for us but that's fine - I'm not convinced the local private schools would suit ds anyway and I can't really see him at Eton.

[happygardening]

Yes ultimately complete freedom is only open to the "richest few" but many have some choice of senior state school especially those living in cities and at primary level even those like me who are rural can have quite a few choices where possible should try and find one that comes as close to their ethos on life as possible.

[Talkinpeace]

happygardening
You do need to try and find a school that matches your own outlook on life
That is a luxury only available to the richest few percent of the population.
The rest of us have to put up with what the state provides local to where we can afford to live.

[happygardening]

I agree parents often wont ever agree. We often want different things and our DC's will often behave/perform/respond differently in the same school.
You do need to try and find a school that matches your own outlook on life, this is not easy because not only are we often unable to clearly define our own ethos and schools don't make theirs very clear. I am slack, liberal, uniform/meaningless ritual hating. jargon loathing parent it was not easy to find a school that matched our outlook and we had a to compromise but am exceedingly happy with our choice ok its not a perfect fit; thankfully they are not slack but it works for my DS and us as well. But this does not mean ot would work for everyone else.

[NeverendingStoryteller]

We chose our DS's new primary school based on its proximity and association with a middle school, and because of the school's outstanding commitment to outdoor education and sports, and because it felt right when we visited (twice - once to look around and once with classroom time). We also found that the staff were kind and helpful when I made a telephone query about places. Another school (which is closer) responded to my queries about a place with open hostility and rudeness.

DS will now stay at the same primary/middle school until he's 14. At that stage we will have a good idea of where he's going in life (academic vs sporty vs tekkie vs hands-on vs outdoorsy vs musical, or any combination of these) and we'll choose a high school based on how he develops interests and strengths as he grows up.

Good luck with this journey!

[creamteas]

I am a great believer in community schools and am lucky to live in an area that still has defined catchment areas (distance from school is only used for non-catchment applications).

So mine all went to our catchment primary and secondary (and when I bought my house, I wasn't planning on having kids so this was not a consideration). Over the 15 years I was a parent at the primary, the school went up and down in terms of ranking and inspections and both was and wasn't a preferred destination for out of area parents. Same school, same HT and same ethos. The secondary much the same.

The way that the schools are perceived (academic, caring, traditional etc) varies enormously depending on the person describing it, and I don't think any two parents would ever agree!

[difficultpickle]

I think it is really hard to make the right pick. Ds went to a Montessori nursery and loved it. So much so that if there had been a Montessori school within striking distance I would have sent him there. However now he is 8 and his school life is very rigid and highly structured and he absolutely loves it. Not something I would have guessed when he was 2. Basic character traits have remained the same but the environment he is educated in has changed hugely.

It is also hard to look at your own child objectively. For me that has got easier as ds gets older and his personality has developed. He is nothing like me which came as a bit of a shock and does make parenting a challenge.

[YellowandGreenandRedandBlue]

I feel it is very random, this child a in this year group with this teacher may get along very well, child b may not.

I think choose for any good reason (I.e. the best after school club might be really important to some, or non-denominational, or excellent maths club for those with a talent, or an amazing head, or loads of sports clubs) and then review it every year. And don't be scared to move if it is carefully thought about.

And happiness comes before academic side every time IMO because you can add extra learning but can't take away bullying or loneliness.

[teacherwith2kids]

Minty, I appreciate that - where we used to live, there was 1 choice of primary and sometimes 1 [more often 0, with children being sent to all sorts on appeal / over PAN] secondary.

When we moved, as in-year admissions in a low birth year, we genuinely had a choice of 5 or 6 schools - but still, as it turned out, only 1 choice of secondary and that only just (furthest admission distance 1 road away).

[MintyyAeroEgg]

Where I live the dc very much have to make do and mend. We had precisely one choice of primary and two of secondary (plus another secondary that has lottery allocation - we didn't "win").

I PMSL at the idea of parental choice!

[teacherwith2kids]

I didn't think I'd know - specialkly as for DS's first school I only had one choice, thought it was OK and turned out that I was wrong.

So when we moved I toured EVERYWHERE (with the children, as DS was being HEd at the time so that he could be mended - his first head having declared that she didn't think he would ever again be able to attend a mainstream school).

And suddenly, it was really clear - from the way the head spoke about the school, from the way the staff reacted to my children, from all the subtle things that you get from comparing places and not from just seeing one IYSWIM. In the school we chose, the head took my children by the hands, saying ' Let me show you my school. I like it, and I think you will too'. In the school we ran a mile from, the head said 'Let me show you how we keep this school an Ofsted Outstanding', and completely ignored the children...

[JenaiMorris]

Crikey a couple of them were so shiny faced, glossy haired and smart of blazer I wondered if they were actually real

[Talkinpeace]

Happy
If its any relief, state schools seem to pick the students who would do well at Public school to do their tours and pictures / videos

[happygardening]

You don't especially in the independent senior school sector as in a way most are so very samish, once you've taken results etc out of the equation. They use the same jargon on their websites and prospectus, same guided tours by bright eyed and bushy tailed students, teacher all looking interested hanging on your every word. If you ever look at the videos on school websites they even use the same bloody music and the same science experiment blowing something up (yawn). In the end you take a leap of faith and go with your gut feelings. You may get it wrong but IMO if you do and are able you need to move on ASAP and find another hopefully more suitable option.