Is there any freedom in having had the virus?

[SuperAlly]

Just that really. I can’t find a straight answer to this.

If you’ve had the virus (and a positive result), can you (or should you be able to) move freely? Are you any less of a risk to other people?

I have a feeling the answer is no...but I don’t know anyone who has had the virus or anything

[Rowgtfc72]

I would put money on having had covid in March. I ticked every symptom box. Never tested as it wasnt a thing in tbe uk then
Actually tested positive 3 weeks ago, only symptom was loss of taste.

[Delatron]

Yes I read that about SARS and t-cells still being present 17 years later.

Also 40 million people world worldwide have had this virus now since last January. If there was zero immunity we would be hearing about more than a handful of cases having it the second time. We just don’t know enough yet.

[Delatron]

I think we don’t know enough about the role of t-cells. We know that some people who have had the virus don’t produce antibodies but do produce t-cells. But we haven’t studied or researched the impact of this on immunity.

I think you have to behave as though you have no immunity.

SIL had it in March, my bro didn’t get it then. He got it in October and she did t catch it. Such a strange virus. You could take from that she still had some immunity maybe in the form of t-cells from March but then he didn’t catch it from her the first time round.

Hopefully we’ll study more on t-cells as I think this is key to understanding immunity.

[PuzzledObserver]

Potted summary of my understanding of the current state of knowledge, gleaned from multiple sources:

1). It is possible to catch it again. But the number of people who have done so is vanishingly small compared to the number who have had it

2). Of the verified cases of reinfection, most were asymptomatic or milder than the first bout.

3). Add 1 and 2 together, the implication is that the chance of someone who has had it once going on to get it worse at a later date is really minuscule.

4) All of the above is “from what we know so far”. It’s only been 11 months. So it may be that as time goes on, reinfection becomes more common. Only when we have larger numbers can we know just how likely a 2nd infection is to be worse than the first.

My hunch - based on the presence of T-cells in people who had recovered from SARS 17 years later - is that catching it twice is going to continue to be uncommon. But people who have had it should still be as cautious as everybody else, because we don’t know for sure.

[Underhisi]

My sister (a nurse) had it in the spring with a positive test and then a positive antibody test. She has still had to do two more tests when she has had symptoms since as well as routine tests and has had to self isolate when her child had symptoms.

If people had more freedom if they had had it there would be people deliberately seeking to get infected

[QueenStromba]

[quote rc22]@smelliethenelephant I agree with you. Only one case in that report suggested that someone had worse symptoms when infected for a second time.[/quote]
Two. Out of six.

[rc22]

@smelliethenelephant I agree with you. Only one case in that report suggested that someone had worse symptoms when infected for a second time.

[QueenStromba]

[quote Smelliethenelephant]@QueenStromba thank you but if you are pointing towards the first report on the link you sent, it does not provide evidence of your assertion.[/quote]
I said that it was proven that it is possible to catch it again and that it's possible for it to be worse the second time. The report includes details of a man in Nevada who was hospitalised the second time after having fairly mild symptoms the first time and a man in Ecuador who had worse symptoms the second time but fell short of requiring hospitalisation.

[bumbleymummy]

Recent paper in bmj says that t-cell response lasts at least 6 months. Fingers crossed it’s an indication of longer term protection. Time will tell.

[JustBidenMyTime]

@Redolent

Prof John Bell of Oxford was arguing last week that those who test positive for the virus should be given a 3 months 'freedom' period during which it is judged that they are extremely unlikely to contract the virus again.

But there is evidence that antibodies wane particularly after 6 months.

Good grief - does he want people to start having 'coronavirus parties', like chickenpox parties so that they can have 3 months' freedom?

People who have had Covid-19 seem to be less scared of the virus in some cases. Most people who I have heard say 'I'm not scared of the virus' have actually had it. Those who haven't had it might be more scared as they don't know what it will/would be like and how their body will react. It is a bit annoying actually since it kind of belittles the fear of those who haven't had it before, since only the healthy survivors of Covid-19 are going to be claiming this fearlessness, not those with long Covid or those who died.

[HitchikersGuide]

Sadly it would be too difficult to have staggered rules depending on antibodies, especially as T cells do a great deal of the hard work for many so that no strong antibody response has to be produced.

[rc22]

I had it in June and in the immediate aftermath I felt invincible although I still did the hand washing, social distancing etc. I think I certainly enjoyed the summer more than I would have had I not been fairly convinced I had some immunity. I'm a bit less confident now and really don't relish the idea of a second bout. I'm actually self isolating at the moment and although I'll do it and stick to the rules I do wonder if it's strictly necessary.

[walksen]

I re to ugly caught it a few weeks ago. Hopefully that means I should be able to stay at work until at least Christmas. Having said that the guidance as it stands means I could have to isolate again next week if id notified we've close contact which sucks as it means I need to stay away from my support bubble if I want to keep earning

I've seen speculation that you can catch it again after 6 months or so. There have been some documented cases but few studies in detail. However it is worrying when you start to see posts on forums that people in the NHS or care homes are testing positive again after being infected in the first wave. Some may dismiss this as scaremongering but that's also what they said about that Chinese and whistleblower.

It should be looked into seeing as it seems unlikely that anyone under 50 will get the vaccine until next winter and there could be a lot of people getting it again in march of April.

On the other hand there have been reports that t cells might provide immunity and some healthworkers have not seen declines in antitibodies due to presumably repeated exposure to the virus.

[GooseberryTart]

My manager had covid early on and had the anti bodies but a couple of months later they were gone.
Another friend thought she wouldn’t be too bothered if her and her family caught it and got it out of the way. She was ok but her partner ended up in hospital and nearly died.
I also know fit healthy people in their 40’s and early 50’s who are really struggling with everyday life several months on as they have gone in to develop long covid.
So I think its best to avoid getting it if you possibly can.

[Smelliethenelephant]

@Porcupineinwaiting I am not doubting that you can catch it twice, but there is no evidence that symptoms will be worse a second time for the majority of people so 'you're likely to be hit harder a second time' 'is a claim that needed to be challenged.

[Porcupineinwaiting]

@Smelliethenelephant it is well established that you can catch COVID twice, just take a look at the covid Facebook groups. Lots of people (mostly Americans) posting their positive test results from March and then again from the summer/autumn. There are posters right here on these boards who will tell you the same story, or speak to NHS staff.

In order to be a proven, scientific case of reinfection you need to have the viral genome sequenced for both infections. Strangely, not many people are offered the opportunity to have that done. Lots of people didnt even get tested the first time round.

Subsequent infections can be better or worse. Certainly the ones that are worse tend to be more heavily reported which makes sense - if you had a mild infection the first time then an even milder one then you might not even notice.

[Kitcat122]

No the opposite. I wasn't too concerned about catching it. Now I've had it definitely abit anxious about catching it again.

[Lifeispassingby]

the guidance to isolate/quarantine is the same even if you have antibodies detected

[Smelliethenelephant]

@QueenStromba thank you but if you are pointing towards the first report on the link you sent, it does not provide evidence of your assertion.

[QueenStromba]

[quote Smelliethenelephant]**@WitchesBritchesPumpkinPants* @QueenStromba* do you have evidence for your scaremongery coments please?[/quote]
www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/publications-data/threat-assessment-brief-reinfection-sars-cov-2

[Sitt]

I don’t know if we know how likely it is that having it for a second time will be worse, because anyone who has had it a second time and was (for example) asymptomatic is unlikely to have known about it. We will only pick up the cases where it was worse. So in terms of risks it’s hard to know how high that is.

[sirfredfredgeorge]

Even if it did confer immunity - and it almost certainly does in the short term - the main reason not to provide this is it would specifically encourage risky behaviour, at the moment millions of people are avoiding catching the virus not because they're worried about what would happen if they did, but simply because they don't want to isolate.

If you give them the reward of one isolation and then the guarantee to carry on freely then they would all jump at the chance. Such a "infect the low risk" strategy has been rejected.

[Smelliethenelephant]

@WitchesBritchesPumpkinPants @QueenStromba do you have evidence for your scaremongery coments please?

[OwlOne]

Maybe, a little, but they (govts) don't want us to believe that there is.
They don't want people who've had it to relax.

I know it's been proven that you can catch it twice but I believe that that's still rare? I hope that that is right.

[QueenStromba]

@Looneytune253

No I don't think they've proved whether or not you can get it again or not but I think it's almost certain even if you don't get it again you can still carry it and pass it on. Personally though I don't worry so much about catching it. I have a tendency to worry a lot about illnesses so I think if I hadn't had it already I'd be a proper wreck now panicking

It has 100% been proven that you can catch it more than once and that you can have worse symptoms the second time.