Am I going to have to go through this again?

[Springchicken]

My DD is one and DP and I are planning on having another baby next summer once we have got our wedding our of the way. However, i had a pretty horrific labour last time round and have been wondering if there is anything i can do to prevent things getting so bad next time.

Here is my story from last time round if you've got a spare hour .

It is something that is really bothering me. Dp and I had a scare a few months back and i was in tears just at the thought of having to go through this again
My personal opinion is that i should never have been left to labour for that long considering the length of time everything took, IMHO, I should've been taken for a C-Section. Now, I a not qualified at all and I'm sure Mears or Prufock would say that there wasn't enough of a reason but what can i do to esure that i don't have to go through this again?

My area isn't renound for our local hospital or health service, I'm not sure that just expressing my feelings to my Dr or Midwife would actually do anything.
I know this is a long way off yet but i am really worried about it.

[astonished]

Cathcat, my ds1 had shoulder dystocia and was 10 lbs 14 ozs, my ds2 was again a lrge baby so I asked to be induced early at 38 weeks to avoid a section and my consultant had no problem with that. I had a difficult labour as baby was not ready and was very high up and was lying back to back, however giving birth itself was wonderfulas he was my first child to have a non assisted delivery weighing in at 9lbs.
However i would now not do the same, i would wait to go into spontaneous labour as i now feel more empowered with knowledge and feel that just because i had one baby with shoulder dystocia it is not necessarily going to happen again. I have also read that there are a number of less aggressive ways to delievr baby in this situtation than the ones used in my situation, some women have babies with SD and don't even know until after delivery such is the skill used by the midwives to enable baby to move. HTH, but whatever don't let your consultant bully you. Good Luck xx

[cathcat]

Can I just ask Spacecadet what size her dd2 was, when she was induced at 38 weeks.
I also had shoulder dystocia with ds who weighed 10lbs 4. They can tell I am having another large baby so have been told I am having section at 39 weeks. I asked to be induced early but was told this would make no difference.

[Prufrock]

Springchicken - it's pupuce who's the doula (though I am very flattered to be confused with her)

[milward]

SC - just read your story and really feel for you. The birth crisis weblink on your birth story thread would be good to contact and talk through what happened and also to get info on how to ensure it doesn't happen again. A doula would be fantastic - someone at your side that's there to support you, dh & baby. You can talk through your birth plan with them as well. It is easy to say that every labour & birth is different but understand that this doesn't sort the situation. Could you go back to the hospital with your soon to be dh & see the senior m/w to go through what happened last time so that they know your fears and can do something to ensure it wont happen again. Wishing you all the best and also for your wedding xxx Don't let this experience stop you from having another child. Just to say that I'm due to give birth in 7 weeks and am very nervous about it.

[jamiesam]

Oh, and beware that the sooner the stopwatch starts, the sooner that hospital policies like 'you've been in established labour for x hours and haven't progressed far enough, we are going to start intervening' will come into play. Fine if you're not coping and want drugs/cs/etc, but if you are copying and baby is OK, then such policies and procedures are out of place - in my view.

[jamiesam]

Oh dear where are my asterisks going? Sorry.

[jamiesam]

MN vetting? I meant to type bth but lost in translation?!

[jamiesam]

Springchicken, I would really strongly second Harpsichordcarrier's recommendation that you try and seek out the 'Birth Afterthoughts' or similar service at your hospital.

I used this after birth of ds1, when pg with ds2. Although staffed by mw from the hospital, it has an 'independant' feel about it. I firmly believe that you have to go through one labour so you can get it right the second time round. Like you, I had awful mw - 'yes it will hurt dear, you're in labour'. If I'd have realised at the time how unacceptable that was, I could have told her there and then. As it was, I never got the chance to go back to her afterwards and say 'If YOU'D bothered to find out that baby was in OP position, you might have understood why I was in so much pain'.

Mw I had when in labour with ds1 was a b*h and I swore that if she walked in the room when I was in labour with ds2, I'd walk out. Birth afterthoughts mw explained a lot of things that happened during ds1 birth - like getting ignored, that gas and air didn't work because I wasn't using it properly ( and then ran out anyway and no one checked until after I'd requested pethidine), not getting tests done properly (oh yes, useles dr too! 3 failed attempts to take blood sample from ds1 head/scalp, when concern was his low oxygen levels - take yout time why don't you!). Helped me to understand how the things that 'went wrong' first time round needn't do the next time round. Also reassured me of the areas where I could do something different next time - either to demand better treatment, or simply keep more mobile, and that it's OK to ask questions all the time (especially if it annoys the horrid staff!)

[spacecadet]

there has been a really good series on discovery health al about doulas entitled mum=one, its very interesting

[astonished]

In Pupuce's absence I will try my best to fill you in on the role of a birth Doula.
Birth Doulas are both trained and experienced in childbirth, many are mothers themselves. Their role is to support the woman during childbirth in whatever way the woman chooses. Some Doulas are trained in areas such as homeopathy and massage, others are more hands off and respond by giving emotional reassurance, taking cues from mum when to support and when to step back. many Doulas are a combination of all these things, using their own knowledge of female physiology and their own experiences to support the woman both in labour and in any choices/decisions she makes.
The doula usually meets with mum before the birth and can be in constant contact in the weeks leading up, as often it is the bond between doula and mother which gives the woman the confidence and reassurance, and the continuity of care which unfortunatley is not always available in midwifery care.
The role of the Doula has throughout history been undertaken by womenfolk within the extended family, so is not as such a 'new role' statistically having continuous support through labour can reduce the chances of medical intervention 'The Cochrane Report 2004'

A doula does not just support mum she also works with dad and encourages him to get involved and feel part of the experience (if appropriate)

Hope this helps

[spacecadet]

SC- i had a horrendous birth with my dd now aged 14, she actually nearly died due to an incompetent midwife, my next labour was better, but ds 2 labour although quick was horrendous as he was too big,his shoulders got stuck etc and he stopped breathing and had to be rushed to special care, with dd2, i was like you, terrified of the prospect of giving birth again, and was terrified eith i or my baby might die,i went to a diff hospital, where i put all my feelings across to my consultant, who agreed to monitor me to see how big baby was getting and induced at 38 weeks in the hope of preventing shoulder dystocia, the labour wasonly about an hour, my midwife was fantastic, i had no pain relief, although not through choice!, and dd was delivered in just a few pushes, right at the end, she got another midwife to just drop the end of the bed away and be there in case of shoulder dystocia again, but dd just slid out!, no stitches, nothing, alert and happy baby, it really was fantastic.sheila kitzinger believes that woman who suffer from traumatic births can develop post traumatic stress disorder..this website might e useful as it has lots of contacts on for woman dreading becoming pregnant again after traumatic birth, it also includes the doula uk contact, as well as sheila kitzingers article.

[PeachyClair]

Hub2Dee- you and your IT skills again!!

Shelia Kitzinger (sp)- wow, that's a name I've learned to respect!

[hub2dee]

Peachy's story is here Sunday, 17 July, 2005 9:30:32 PM



Springchicken - this might be useful .

[astonished]

I may be able to help you, I know some Doulas in Northants who may be prepared to travel

[Springchicken]

Bedfordshire Astonished, the clostest place i have found is Hertfordshire.

Thankyou so much for your posts - just knowing that i have alternative options has helped me relax a bit more about it.

I think i need to understand exactly what a doula does. do you think Pupace would mind me asking her for some advice?
I too didn't write a birth plan last time, my midwife told me there was no point as the labour ward midwife wouldn't take any notice of it anyway.

[astonished]

Whereabouts spring Chicken, most Doulas will travel, what area are you looking in?

I do feel from reading your birth story a Doula would be of benefit to you by giving you the emeotional support that all women need and should receive during childbirth. I beleiev a doulas presence would be reassuring to you given what you have previously experienced.

[PeachyClair]

Hi

I had a botched PG / labour with my first, too (if you want more look at Hub2Dee's nipple confusion thread, I explained it all there, makes me upset still after even 5 yeras).

I went to a different hospital with my second, it was really the right thing to do, I felt far more confident. I also had a different midwife from the start. I din't have the courage to do until PG3, but with that one I requested my Ob to review the notes and give me an opinion. That made the biggest difference and I'm glad I did it, as my home birth got cancelled at the last minute and I had to go back to the original hospital (combination of anaemia and power cuts in my village).

I know how scared you must be, maybe this will help with some info,

association for improvement in maternity services

Probably NOT a conicidence theya re based near the first hospital I laboured at!

A word of reassurance, though: when I went back to the 'bad' hospital, things had changed a lot and it was actually a good experience.

[champs]

hmmmmm, is there another nhs hosp where you can go? do any of the hosps have doulla's there? Would you be able to afford a private m/w?

is there a close friend who could be with you at the birth?

[Springchicken]

According to the Doula UK Website there are none in my area.

[hunkermunker]

Hi, SC.

Just wondering - have you thought about contacting the Birth Trauma Association?

[joybee]

I just wanted to let you know that I had a similarish experience to you, the midwife could not communicate in english very well and I didn't feel comforted or supported. The consultant came in waving the ventouse around and telling me how rubbish I was being. Had a lot of stitches following episitomy which said consultant didn't stitch properly, hence returning 6 months later for 'refashioning'. Like you was dreading 2nd delivery but it was totally different. I decided to deliver in an upright position this time and my midwife was really supportive and encouraged me to just go with the flow and listen to my own body - not once did she shout push at me! The labour was only 5 hrs and I just used gas and air. I felt so proud of myself afterwards. The baby was another whopper - over 9lbs again and I did tear a little, but nothing like last time and they really took time stitching me back up after I had written all over my notes that I was very concerned about this. This way six days ago and instead of feeling shell-shocked I can concentrate on breast-feeding and worry about other things! It doesn't have to be like last time - I would advise you to make your fears very clear on your notes and discuss with your midwife ways of making sure things go better next time.

[likklemum]

I got mistaken for 14/15 year old too. In fact i still do (had to convince corner shop man that i'm 24 when trying to buy ciggies for my sister!). DP looks about 20 when he is actually 30 (and he wears braces(for teeth not trousers)). Loved m/w's face when she found out dp has an 11 yr old too!!!

Ahhh, I digress. I had a nasty 1st birth and it makes me anxious to think of it. I would be quite happy with NEVER doing it again, but will as i want DS to have a sibling. I keep holding on to the fact that lots of people say that the 2nd birth is easier. Also, you know more what to expect and can write a clearer birth plan (i didn't even write one 1st time!!). You can arm yourself with stats and DH will have some idea what to expect and can be firmer.

[champs]

hiya!! yep me and dh (dp at the time) where taken for teenage parents without a clue.
At clinic we went to for pg test we had a right telling off by the doc and then when i went to antenatal visits it was horrible... wont go into it but it still hurts a bit.
It didn't help that i looked around 14/15 at the time but even if i was they had no right!

dh was very taken by how much pain and distress i was in too. The stupid m/w wrote in my notes that my brother came to get her... it was infact dh!! He was brilliant second time around as he new what to expect.

[astonished]

Spring chicken, where abouts are you?? if you are interested in hiring a Doula, go onto the DOULA UK website and click on the Find a Doula pages you should find someone close to you. It may also be helpful for you to look at Birth Crisis and perhaps contact Sheila Kitzinger, who can put you in contact with someoen to talk over your fears with.
On a personal level, my ds1 had a horrififc birth, brady cardic trace on arrival at hospital, induced labour and Shoulder Dystocia. This left me feeling very distressed and i later was wrongly diagnosed with PND, I believe I had PTSS. After much discussion with others i was able to work through my expereiences and fears and have a comparitively normal and exhilirating birth with my DS2.

I wish you every luck and positive vibe and hope that it all works out for you xx

[dejags]

SC, I didn't have a great first labour. Similar in length to yours, with 2 failed epidurals and a very disinterested agency midwife or just sat and scribbled without saying much.

Second time round it was so much better. I knew what was coming and was well prepared. I was all fired up to stand up for myself if necessary but it turned out that I didn't need to.

DS2 came in under four hours after a pessary and having my waters broken for me. The labour was extremely painful but knowledge is a wonderful thing. I felt controlled and calm throughout.

Obviously there are no guarantees but I believe that second labours are often a lot easier than first time round.

Keep us posted