Epidural or not

[nikijm]

Hi,

I'm due my second in June. 9 years after my first. I had a 'natural' normal complication free birth with my son but it was 19 hours I coped badly and was very unwell mentally and physically afterwards. Looking back I suspect some type of PTSD. I'm small and was very young at the time, i also suffered with PND.

I always swore if I did it again I'd have an epidural. All the advice I've been getting at NCT etc say that an epidural is not an easier option yet the people I know who've had one generally seem to think it is. Can anyone offer any experience/ advice? I'm pretty scared :/

[EssexMummy123]

I just rang the MLU they are more than happy for me to go and try to relax in one of their birthing pools for a bit and then transfer me next door to the main consultant led ward for an epidural if i want one and as soon as there is an anaesthetist available, definitely not a problem - so i feel a lot happier knowing that.

[Mama12341]

I was offered an epidural after 24 hours when it became clear that the situation was going to get complicated. It was great. I would definitely have it again if I was in a long labour or if there were any complications. We ended up in an emergency situation and they were able to react very quickly because the epidural was already in and I was able to make decisions quickly without the hindrance of contraction pain. For the next baby if labour progresses quickly I probably won't bother but if progress is slow or there is any sign of complication or I just find the pain too much I wouldn't hesitate to have an epidural again. So basically if u feel u need one I would go for it. If things r progressing quickly and your coping with the pain then leave it. Best to see how you feel on the day

[HazleNutt]

The MW's withholding pain relief and claiming you won't need one should find another career. Somewhere they don't need to deal with people.

[lightgreenglass]

I had an epidural as was induced and will have another induction for this pregnancy so I will definitely be asking for the epidural again.

I asked them to stop the epidural an hour prior to pushing and I could feel it push, they were also monitoring my contractions and told me when to push and how long for. I had a tear but nothing traumatic.

My epidural fell out whilst I was asleep and the pain was immense, at that point they gave me pethindine which I wish I hadn't had as DS was dazed when he made an appearance. The doctor needed to go an EC so couldn't put my epidural back in and another doctor outside could hear me effing and blinding and was about to go off shift but got changed again and put the epidural back in. I will be forever grateful to that man.

[BlinkAndMiss]

I'm definitely pro epidural after having a difficult time with my first. My DS was back to back and had been from the beginning, I went into labour before my due date and my contractions were all over the place and of varying intensity - then I failed to dilate after about 6cm. I was given synto and an epidural together, I hadn't requested one but it seems the two are given together. The relief was bliss, I couldn't feel a thing and was able to sleep after 18 hours of pointless contractions. When it came to pushing I couldn't feel anything so I tore but I didn't need any further interventions like forceps or ventouse.

I'm expecting Dc2 soon and I will be requesting an epidural as soon as I get to hospital. The statistics suggest that they do lengthen labours by about 2 hours but it doesn't mean you're any more likely to have assistance with the pushing stage - or this is what I was told by my consultant anyway.

Re. requesting a scan to determine position - they won't do this until after 36 weeks and even then they may just have a feel. I've been requesting a scan for weeks and when I went at 36 weeks they refused because the midwives were all in agreement that he was head down, despite the same team being unsure the week before. Try not to worry about position because baby moves around all the time. Unless the baby is definitely breech when they examine you, you may find that they are quite unhelpful with easing your worries. I think we are having similar experiences, I'm being made to feel like I'm making a fuss over nothing when I have asked for a more detailed birth plan and an appointment with a consultant to discuss preventing some of the issues I had with my first labour.

[LadyCatherineDeTurd]

That is horrifying essexmummy! Are you seriously saying you're not going to be allowed to give birth in a CLU? What exactly was said? Having had, like you, a complex vaginal birth with my first and being low risk with my second, I experienced a natural birth fetishist midwife at booking in and early appointments try to push HB and MLU, but I laughed in her face and told her I was going to have an anaesthetic consult which she did her best to not arrange. You could ask for anaesthetic consult to discuss what happened last time and options for this time?

[StupidBloodyKindle]

PTSD

Sorry OP, reading that back sounds very pessimistic/unsupportive
As you can see two epidurals led to ventouse, no epidural led to very bad tearing
Trauma due to panic, fear, no control over the situation and a shitload of pain
For some women birth is bloody well painful, visceral, feeling of being torn in two, closest to dying without being dead
Some epis do not take/only take on half a side
Out the three, my first was probably the best and that was piss poor due to the of no pain to full pain
Only you can decide what goes on your birth plan and we all know how well they can turn out, but if you feel it is too much, then take the epidural and ask before it is too late. Trying to be brave and tough to have a birth to erase memories of a previous birth did not work in my case...and I did try to be brave, turning up to hospital with 2. and 3. when I was already 5cm dilated. Having an enema with no.3 to make sure there would be nothing hindering pushing/give me some more space I really did try...but if I can prevent you having a second birth trauma with any of the above info then I will...because EVERYBODY told me subsequent births were faster and easier, body knows what to do/can remember...and I fell for that hook, line and sinker when it is not always the case.

[StupidBloodyKindle]

Hello OP

Not all second births are quicker
Not all second births are easier
Not all women feel the urge to push, irrespective of pain relief

1. 14 hours, epidural, bliss, switched it off/did not top up so went from zero pain to oh my God, are you fucking kidding me? Ventouse, episiotomy. Stitches - gas and air causing vomiting
   

1. 14 hours, epidural, only half took, ventouse
   

1. you guessed it...14 hours, Nothing: no gas and air, pethadine or epi, HUGE FUCKING MISTAKE, rectal tear
   

I swore never again after 1. and similar age gap to you.
No. 2 I thought Ooh, it can't be a carbon copy of 1. surely not, surely...but it was and I felt cheated.
No. 3 I read a hypnobook, I decided that the epidurals were at fault for the ventouse births, that without anything of course I would feel the urge to push, that I would get through transition then nature would take over and I would get a high burst of happy hormones at the end for being so fecking brave.

Shoot me in the head, I am going to die with all three
Ring of fire with all three
PND with all three
PNSD with all three

Would not wish it on my worst frigging enemy.
Epidural. Early. Every time. Make the bastards keep topping it up ALL the way through, pushing when they tell you/having a ventouse at the end stage if need be.

No more babies for me, too old, but dc4 would have been an elective caesarian.

[Strokethefurrywall]

I was just about to post to say the same thing as Flumpty
My first was a hypnobirth, lovely, over and done with in just shy of 5 hours.
Second I went into labor in the evening and was tired. I didn't have the desire to concentrate and get into the zone for the entire night and baby had to be monitored as his heart rate was up and down. I got to 5cms and the pain was the same as when I was 8cms with ds1! Don't let anyone tell you what your pain level is!
Anyway, requested epidural so I could sleep which I did through most of the night, and woke up to push at 6am. Ds2 emerged after 3 pushes. I could feel pressure but no pain and it was fabulous. Both births were actually but if you've been left traumatized I would request that epidural early and enjoy a pain free labor and birth!

[Terramirabilis]

I'd say decide when you're in labour but it's definitely good to think about it in advance. I loved my epidural. Especially after 26 hours of labour. In my case, I'm sure being able to relax once I wasn't in agony any more was what permitted me to dilate the rest of the way to 10cm pretty quickly (I was already at 8.5cm). I could feel everything throughout the rest of the birth but it didn't hurt. I could walk immediately afterwards and DS was born in less than an hour of pushing despite being a first baby, large, and my having been in labour for 27 hours at that point. I can't say I will certainly have an epidural next time but I will if I feel I need one.

[FlumptyDumpty]

How the hell would your midwife know whether you will want one or not? She'll not be feeling your pain, you will be! Pain is subjective and varies from person to person. Pain is what the sufferer rates it as, not what anyone else thinks it "should" be. Ignorant attitudes like this really piss me off. They contribute to birth trauma. And how is it that you are being denied the option of labouring somewhere you can get an epidural? Sounds very poor to me.

[EssexMummy123]

I had DC1 and requested it / pethidine and was told it was either to early or to late, so 18 hour back-back labour with episiotomy/vontouse and no pain relief has left me a little traumatised, however it seems with DC2 my options are only home birth or MLU as I'm 'low-risk' - so still no epidural option, my midwife has told me i won't want one - but i'd quite like the option, so how does everyone else get the choice?

[imwithspud]

My advice would be to not make any set decisions just yet, wait until you're in labour and see how you feel, all labours are different and some are much easier to deal with than others.

I had an epidural with DC1, best thing I ever did. I was induced and had been in slow labour for days, hadn't slept properly and was utterly exhausted. The pain just got too much in the end. I don't think it helped that I was strapped to the bed being constantly monitored so I couldn't really adjust my position to help deal with the pain. The epidural meant I could get some rest and respite from the contractions which were literally on top of each other at one point. I did end up having to have a ventouse and episiotomy, but who knows whether I would have had to have those things regardless?

This time I would love to go into labour naturally, so I have the opportunity to try other coping methods such as the birthing pool, or even simply being able to get up and walk around/get into positions which may help with the pain, but I'm not totally ruling out the possibility of an epidural either. It depends on how bad the pain is and how I deal with it at the time. Love the idea of a walking epidural, will have to see if my hospital does something like that.

[geekaMaxima]

Didn't have one myself, but my NCT class was far from anti-epidural and have some really useful info.

For example, epidural are not all the same, so ask for one that still allows you to walk around.

Even with the "heavier" types of epidural, you don't have to lie supine, and can labour and deliver on all fours if you want. However, you will need help getting into position and the midwives can't help you (insurance reasons regarding lifting, apparently), so this is where a birth partner comes in really useful.

If you're planning on breastfeeding, ask if the epidural drug cocktail is compatible with bf because its contents can vary.

Some women in my class made good use of this info.

[Princessbb1]

I gave birth a couple of months ago to my first. I went in with an open mind with pain relief, I had a very long labour with my waters breaking before contractions started. Unfortunately I had a terrible reaction to gas and air so they took it off me and I stopped progressing at 4cm so they had to put me on the synto drip by this point it had been 24 hours of pain so I had the epi. I'm so glad I did, I could still feel when I needed to push and I pushed him out after 10 mins of pushing. I'm very petite and my baby was massive in comparison, so as pp's have said go in with an open mind and see what happens and how you feel you are getting on. The epi was the right decision for me during a traumatic birth. I'd hoped for a water birth all along and a natural delivery but I didn't get it but I'm not disappointed by that because me and baby came out of it ok. Good luck

[CommanderShepard]

Absolutely agree that epidural is a very good idea if you've got a synto drip. I didn't want one at all but had to be induced thanks to pre-eclampsia, having had 2 hours sleep in 30 hours, and the epidural meant I could sleep for a bit.

[RL20]

Agree with Yika - haven't read many other posts but did see that one.

I would recommend it to anyone that can have one. I don't know how I would have coped without one - I didn't go into it wanting one but when my contractions started they were extremely painful (turned out that baby was back to back). These were over the course of a couple of days and I had no sleep because of them.

Ended up having to have the hormone drip to speed them up and make them stronger as my waters had broke a couple of days before, and I remember someone on mumsnet saying if anyone was to have the hormone drip, have an epidural beforehand for it to be able to kick in. So I did. And was able to sleep through a lot of the labour and found it very restful.

A common side affect to the epidural is not being able to feel when you need to wee and I suffered from that but they just did 2 'in and out' catheters and I couldn't feel a thing, so wasn't a problem.
I could also tell them when I felt that the epidural was wearing off and they ramped it up for me (well, I had to press the button).

I could still feel when I needed to push and although it was an odd sensation, I didn't find it extremely painful.
I did have to have an episiotomy though (a tear) and also tore a muscle. So it was the days after the birth when the epidural fully wore off that I could feel soreness with the stitches etc.

[NotCitrus]

Thing is, given most women don't have that much choice of where they give birth, with midwife-led units being few and sometimes full, 'low risk' women who decide they are low enough risk to give birth at home or in a MLU not on the same site as a CLU are not going to include women like me who are deemed 'low risk' clinically but suspect their history or pregnancy means things aren't going to be totally smooth, so would only go for MLU in a hospital.

(I ended up with two births involving epidural and then ventouse. First was after 18 hours of labour including 6 in a birthing pool and was for my SPD not labour pains. Given labour went on for another 22 hours, suspect I wouldn't be able to walk if I hadn't had the epidural, though if epidural hadn't been available I'd have had a cs. Second birth cut straight to needing epidural for SPD as soon as I got to the hospital. Consultants agreed it was a good thing I don't want any more children as they wouldn't be able to guarantee I'd be able to walk again.)


I was very glad I'd been warned though that you can have involuntary shivers for a few days after an epidural - that was very wierd and would have been worrying if I hadn't known it was a common side effect.

[nikijm]

Thanks for the interesting link. Pregnancy childbirth and child rearing are things that make me feel vulnerable. it's better to be informed hopefully this time I'm a bit older and wiser ;)

[YouMakeMyHeartSmile]

I don't know if it's normal nikijim but I've had to book all appts myself. And you've just reminded me I really need to book my whooping cough injection

[LadyCatherineDeTurd]

Check out The Adequate Mother blog if you haven't already OP. She doesn't update now so most of the articles are a couple of years old, but she's an anaesthetist who's good at explaining complex literature to laypeople. There's a whole section on epidurals.

theadequatemother.wordpress.com/category/epidurals/

[nikijm]

Thanks everyone,

I don't have much faith in midwives so far. They forgot to book my whooping cough vaccine and my anti d injections, I had both late anti D by 6 weeks! I'm not actually sure whether I would have seen anyone for anything if I hadn't made the appointments myself.
Is this normal? It's been 9 years since I had DS.
Midwife 'thinks' baby is head down. I'm going to ask for a scan to double check I reckon.
I had PND last time, very keen to do what i can to minimise stress whether that be epidural I'm not yet sure!!
Nervous!!
:)

[drinkscabinet]

I've not had an epidural so can't comment on that but have had 3 very different births so would say wait and see and if you need an epidural have one. Every birth is different and every mother is different so while it's nice to hear other people's experiences you've got to do what feels right for you at the time.