resistant eater support thread - come and join me.....

[tricot39]

I hate mealtimes and have done for 4 years now. DS is 4 and has issues with food (likely due to illness in his first year) since week 4. We finally sought help last year and have seen paediatricians, SALTs and dieticians. It hasn't stopped the number of acceptable foods declining. We are mow down to plain/dry carbs and soft desserts/smoothies and chocolate. We hide supplements in the smoothies!

Over the past year we have got so much better at keeping things calm at mealtimes and trying to avoid pressuring him to eat (i give myself 3 "eat ups" per meal). But all that means is that the stress gets bottled up.

Anyway having ruled out physical and social/communication issues it seems to come down to phobias. He is a cautious chap and doesn't like mess or lumps/bits. The last SALT i saw actually knew what she was talking about and said that if we did nothing else we should do desensitisation exercises. We plan to use the ones in Just Take A Bite http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1932565124 here. This thread is partly to record that process and keep us on track.

We dont know anyone else with a resistant eater and so have noone to let off steam with. I hope there are some of you out there in a similar situation who want to share? Particularly if you are further down this road - i want to hope that these execrises will work but hope faded a couple of years back if i am honest :(

If you have read this and and are thinking about posting about your dc who isnt that keen on veg or that "kids will not starve themselves" then please don't bother. You are way out of your depth and i get enough of this in rl! Sorry to sound rude but i am hoping to find some people who understand how utterly helpless i feel

Anyone out there?

Hi Pop

We haven't started as such. We are just gather uping the props. We are planning to start the exercises at the beginning of Chapter 9 as you guessed.

I have ordered this book for him www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Usborne-Beginners-Stephanie-Turnbull/dp/0746074409 and I need to print off a whole load of food pictures off the net, or get a food magazine for him to do some snipping for the scrapbook cover. I also googled for images of the food pyramid and there are quite a few, so I might use one othem instead of the one in the appendix. I shall see how we get on. I also need some sort of small scrap book and a set of joke teeth!? It is not a great time of year for growing seeds so we might do some cress on a face cloth instead for the growing thing. I reckon that the canteen trip is going to be the trickiest to organise.... I will have to think about another way of doing that.....

I have been priming him that the book is coming and showed him the picture of its cover online. He seemed to be keen on finding out more. Fingers crossed. Anyway I reckon we will have enough bits to make a start this Friday/Saturday when we have some time together at home.

We plan to continue as we are in relation to mealtimes. Which is offering him food we are eating alongside the food we know he will eat. We rotate the food he will eat but it is really difficult because he has such a small range and I hate giving him crackers for his tea. I just feel such a failure!! We use non food rewards and incentives to get him to sit at the table with us for the whole meal. Maybe a DVD, a game or a favoured TV programme. I don't usually use "stuff" like stickers or toys as I am not organised to have a stash and in case he will only eat if he gets more posessions. I say that if he doesn't come to the table he will not get anything to eat at all. As he enjoys pudding, whereas suffers the rest, he will normally come up to the table to sit with us, and will probably end up nibbling a bit of first course. We went through a terrible period where he would refuse turn up to the table until pudding arrived. Effectively he was being rewarded for dancing around the front room! So it is a huge improvement (and reduction in stress) that we have got a bit of a handle on him attending the table for the duration of the meal! We try to keep it under 30 minutes. Ideally less if we can. If he does anything good he gets lots of specific praise, like "well done you ate such a lot" or "good eating" and "you are sitting in your seat really well" "aren't you good at using your cutlery?" etc

It might sound funny but have you considered buying your DS some ear defenders? He might look a bit daft but it might help him function better if he can cut down the noise that bothers him? A friend of DM's son has a pair and will go off and fetch them when things get a bit much for him. He is a massively fussy eater too I believe!

Although the book splits the physical from the sensory issues, I just took that to be for expediency/clarity. I didn't get the impression that it had to be one or the other. I imagine that they might be multiple factors and crossover issues for many children.

Fourtables* - I agree that there is probably no "type" or one size fits all, but for those in the psychological group I think that caution and fear play a big part. That does seem to leak out in a dislike of group activities, singing, mess. The SALT I saw seemed to recognise these traits as part of the same picture as the food refusal. Now he is able to vocalise a bit, he has said things like "I am not worried about sausages any more" (still hasn't put one to his lips mind you!!) so anxiety seems to play a big part. Obviously for other sensory issues or physical problems it would be irrelevant tho.

Good luck to all with any "experiments". I will keep watching the thread, and I will pop back after our first session on the scrapbook and new usborne book at the weekend - if I don't appear before.

Chandon, was the book 'My Child Won't Eat'? I have a feeling that's where I read it. It's a good book about not fretting about meal times and it's a great lesson. I'm still looking for a miracle strategy though.

Right now, DD has an ear infection (again, again, again) so is eating next to nothing (not far off 2 peas and a chip - and yes, I remember those days well). It's so upsetting when you were making some progress.

It seems there's a theme relating to eating something repeatedly and then refusing it. Is it a 'thing' these kids have or is it just absolute boredom with the same old thing do you think?

I think DD's problem is with texture on the tongue. She can bring food (eg, pasta) to her lips but just can't bring herself to put it in. Physiological or psychological? Maybe a bit of both?

I admit that even at age 10 I still rely on "top ups" like a piece of toast and a glass of full fat milk before bed. Sometimes he eats no lunch at all, the dinnerladies tell me...

I still stress about it in my head at times ( he had a stomach bug a year ago, and was back in hospital and on a drip after 2 days due to dehydration, and he was so very very thin it made me cry, just after a few days of sickness, all bones and skin). I always thought that if only he would have a bit more fat on him, I would relax a bit more about his eating. My helpful GP says that in the olden days, say the 70s, most kids were whippet thin but as everyone is a bit bigger now, the thin kids stand out. and that he is a normal weight, despite 2 nd centile. Pfffffff

Deep down I am an Italian Mama who wants to fatten up her kids, haha, but I play it cool, always play it cool...

cantmakecarrotcake with regards to food jags - normally children will have fads where they eat the same thing everyday, then stop eating it for a while but will go back to it. Someone like my DS will eat the same things for months on end and then out of the blue stop eating it and will never go back to it. He ate pasta with mascarpone cheese for literally months, perhaps even for a year and a half and then it just stopped. He won't even try it now. Same with ice cream - apparently he is "not into ice cream any more" (his words). I think it's a common theme.

Today, I asked him what he had at school for lunch. "I had sausages, beans, carrots and potatoes." My son the fantasist! I asked his teacher, she said he had Yorkshire pudding. Actually, I was happy with that because its something new.

tricot I bought that Osborne book to encourage him think about why we eat. He was able to name all the digestive body parts and how they worked and what they were for. Did it make him eat more? No!DS was really into it when we first bought it (about a year ago!) Might encourage him to look it again. Today, he helped me set the table and helped me clear it up. I praised him for eating but did not say oh try more or even, if you eat so many I will give you a sweet (bad mum I know). I was quite proud of myself.

ha ha pop
I expect the book will be like cooking - because that it what all the advice is - get them to participate and cook. Yes, no problem on the stirring, cutting, peeling etc etc. Put it to your mouth? Forget it! I slightly expect the same result with my ds and the book.... but I will give it a try and I can't help hoping that it will beone tiny part of the lots of little things that might loosen him up a bit..... see I can't hep hoping in between bouts of despiar. I think that is what makes it all so hideous!

I know what you mean, tricot. DS will quite happily help me chop up mushrooms and peel garlic etc but not do the eating.

I know too well about the despair, I really really do but I don't think we can ever lose hope as it keeps us going, doesn't it?

Lol, the 'let them help you prepare the food' suggestion. Alongside the 'they won't starve themself' statement. For normal children, that might be true. For the kind of children we are talking about, normal rules do not apply...

Many times I spent cooking with DD2. She loved it. Never ate a bean. Obviously, I wouldn't have expected her to eat something as weird as a bean, but a plain tomato sauce? Nah...

But as I said, she is now so much better. She had broccoli for tea (with other things of course), and then asked for a carrot and prawn crackers! After eating a school dinner (which lets face it, CAN be rather weird...).

Hang in there

This might not be relevant to all but I wanted to mention supplements as a stopgap while your child isn't eating well. My DS2 (6yo) was referred to a dietitian in the Spring by the school nurse because his weight had fallen from between the 2nd and 9th percentile to below the chart. He has been prescribed supplements for the last four months (Pediasure Plus Juce) and they have worked wonders. He gets about 2,500 kcal a week from them and is now back up to the 9th percentile. The dietitian wants to keep him on them through the winter then stop them so I am trying and get him to drink more milk instead. I can't believe the difference in him now, he finally has a bit of 'meat on his bones' and I had to loosen his trousers on the way to school just now because they were getting tight! Obviously it's not an ideal solution but it has given him a boost and hopefully his growth will reflect that as we have concerns about him being stunted by his poor eating.

That's great, Stuntnun. It must be such a relief to see him a bit chubbier. And to be taken seriously by the health profession. I don't know about you but I mentioned to the HV countless times about her poor eating and I just got the same old advice about introducing family foods. I should have gone to the GP sooner really but I guess even they won't take you seriously until they've actually dropped centiles. It's actually quite hard to know/admit when you have something more than a regular fussy eater.

Anyway your comment about the supplement juice (which 21mo DD probably wouldn't drink) made me wonder if any of this thread's DCs also didn't/don't drink much. DD will drink no more than about 50ml water in a day and 250ml milk and nothing I can do will persuade her otherwise. She's not interested in orange juice or smoothies. Perhaps I'll try apple juice and see if that's any more appealing. God only knows how we'll potty train if there's very little being produced.

Carrot DS2 requires bribes to take the supplements: one star for half a bottle, two stars for the whole bottle. They do a lot of different flavours as well.

stuntmum - we have supplements for vitamins and minerals but not for calories. We buy them. DS is around the 50th percentile (having fallen from 75% at birth) so we will not get stuff on prescription. Mind you I haven't pressed. I don't know that he would take anything like that as he only drinks water, smoothies or chocolate milk. Bribes and peer pressure have absolutely no effect on him. The supplements we take have no visible effect but make me feel a lot better. You must be over the moon to be able to see a visible difference. It must be such a relief.

cantmake our DS is not great at drinking but maybe manages a bit more than your DD. We found that having a straw or a bendy straw seems to increase fluids. The SALT also told us that wide bore straws are good for strengthening oral muscles. Might be worth a try.

How do you get past the 'lick it' stage to the actual 'eat it' stage?

DS (2.8 yrs) is now willing to lick some fruit, hooray! But doesn't want to put it in his mouth. I've shown him he can put it in and take it out, but he isn't keen. Just stick with licking it for a few months maybe?

Also what on earth do you do for xmas lunch. PIL will be here and they will be horrified if he only has crackers and butter! They don't really understand at all.

chocolate regards Christmas dinner: what time is the dinner at your house? We usually eat at two, which is way past my DS's lunch time. I give him his normal lunch at normal time and then we all sit down for dinner, but I will give him a snack instead as its his snack time then. He quite happily sits there eating said snack!

No idea chocolate.
That seems to be the million dollar question!

Just popping in to report a (very) minor victory. DD ate some pasta for tea yesterday. Not a plate of pasta and sauce but 1.5 ravioli left over from our dinner the night before. It may never happen again but I'm still celebrating!

We've got our follow-up with the paediatrician this afternoon. I wonder what he'll say...

Oh that's great cantmake. That really is a victory :)

My DS made me laugh yesterday. As he was eating his lunch (a whole one egg omelette and dry toast - wow!), he said that he was worried about his friend R and when I asked why, he said and, I quote verbatim, "R is going to get ill because he doesn't eat or drink very much." His friend's mum was telling me when we brought the boys together for a playdate that he had only had 2 bites of a sandwich that day.

I have small victory to report. As I was grating cheese, DS said he wanted to try a tiny bit. He has never, ever asked to try anything before. He didn't like it and spat it out and said yuck but it's still a victory.

I don't think you do get from licking to eating until they are good and ready. All you can do is to keep providing opportunities in as non-threatening (and nonchalant!) a way as possible.

Loving the small victory, Pop. Keep trying the cheese (nonchalantly of course). Hopefully he'll be interested enough to eat some more.

We saw the paediatrician this afternoon. DD has gained weight/length and crossed the 0.4th centile. He was pleased with that and has opted for 'masterful inactivity' until she's 2.3 when her growth hormones have a greater influence over her growth. I've come away pleased with the progress but slightly disappointed not to have any more strategy going forward than keep doing what you're doing.

For those not giving supplements, he attributed her good gain on the supplements. Obviously, the don't provide calories in themselves, but the general feeling of good nutrition and well being boosts appetite apparently (the other paediatrician we saw said the same about an iron supplement.

Onwards and hopefully upwards!

cantmake good to hear DD has put on weight and gone up a centile. It's a bit disappointing they won't do anything but there is not a lot they can do though, I guess. I remember watching a programme a few years back about a paediatrician at the children's hospital in Birmingham, who treated extreme resistant eaters and I remember thinking I need to see her about DS. She dealt with toddlers to teens and she seemed to get results. she worked with an eleven year old who only ate chocolate, nothing else! She got her to start eating a tiny piece of toast every day. I just wish there were more doctors like her.

What supplements do you give her? When I was giving junior iron, he definitely ate more but he got terribly constipated and we tried lactoluse but he got tummy ache so we just stopped the iron. I do give him vitamins though. And thinking about giving him Spatone.

Earlier in the thread you mentioned our children not drinking much. When junior was the same age as your DD, he was the same but he does drink now.

Well done carrot and pop. It is those tiny tiny glimmers that keep you going! Well our usborne "why do we eat" book arrived. I dont like it much.but ds is keen. At tea time he ate twice as much potato as normal and told me it was going down his gullet (heavily featured with an xrayed head in the book). I darent hope this will last but tiny steps....

Dh spent this afternoon cutting and sticking food pictures on to ds's scrapbook with him so we are ready for some exercises from the book now. Fingers crossed.

X post - the birmingham paed is called gillian harris. Unfortunately she hasn't thought to write a book so her knowledge could be spread around a bit!

Pop/Tricot, I remember that program. I think I watched it pre-DD and was horrified for those poor children/families. Agree, a book would be good - I'm still waiting for the one Tricot mentioned in her OP to be delivered.

We use a Wellkid supplement. DD hasn't really suffered constipation so we're lucky on that front.

Just looked properly at DD's red book and the height gain is quite considerable in the last few months. If she continues that trajectory she may even catch up

Good luck with the book and scrapbook, Tricot, agree about the glimmers of hope. A few of them are even real so hopefully this will be one of them.

Tricot, really feel for you, it's so difficult trying to get food Into a refuser. My ds3 never enjoyed food from day one, difficult to get milk into him, then solids. He was always on the lowest centile, saw numerous specialists, had lots of different tactics and tricks tried out on him, but absolutely nothing could convince him to try food. He survived for many years on a diet of about 6 items, causing the rest of the family to be anxious and upset for him on many occasions. Eating out, holidays etc were tricky. Another issue was not wanting any food to touch another food on a plate. However, he was rarely ill, grew into a intelligent university student and survived somehow!!!!! I would say that he still has many foods which he still refuses to even consider trying and has a fairly restricted diet. He is now 21 of average weight and height.
I don't suppose any of this will put your mind at rest, I worried daily probably til he was about 17! Just wanted to say you are not alone.

Tricot - joining the party late and not reading 99 posts, so sorry if this has already been said. Are the sensitisation issues only related to food, or are there other ones - like scratchy labels in jumpers and not liking fast moving playground equipment? DD2 had sensory integration disorder, and so was fussy about texture in food, but it wasn't a food issue. Once we treated her for her sensory integration disorder she ate pretty much anything - expect yoghurt with bits in, which is still considered Satan.

DD3 is becoming a right pain in the arse madam about food. She is refusing anything with sauce, most meat except sausage and ham, potatoes in almost all varieties and is essentially trying to live on fruit, yoghurt, bread and chocolate spread. With her it is definitely control issues rather than anything else though - she is trying to exert her authority over me. It still makes me need at meal times though.