How do i deal with a 3 yr old that just won't do what is asked....I'm in a state of dispair ;-(

[brandnewme]

Its like his brain doesn't work......things have to be said 5, 10 a million times and he still ignores us.

No matter if he's been told off, 10 mins later he's the same. Tried stickers, naughty step, praise etc He just doesn't get it.

I know he's only 3 but I seriously could walk out the house and leave ..... he's pushing me and Dh to breaking point. It's so frustrating.

DD was never like this so this is a shock - i feel like a shit, useless parent

[brandnewme]

Thanks - DH will definitely think i've lost the plot if he comes home and sees me being a mummy dog

[skybluepearl]

making things a game also works - try being mummy dog and baby dog or dragon

[skybluepearl]

count to three slowley then take something off him? what ever is most precious. warn him mid count though. and when you are telling him something go close and make eye contact. don't move away, just satnd there waiting for him to do the task . worth a try anyway

[driedapricots]

yes, join the thread somewhere in this section which is a support group for parents of 3 year olds...and have a large glass of wine every night!

[brandnewme]

You're dead right - I've been joking with him more, and being a bit daft and it's definitely made things easier.

[sleepingsowell]

I think as others have said that it's about you asking him in a different way

If you want to acheive something, make it a game or challenge as has alreay been suggested.

Also with my DS I found reverse psychology absolutely brilliant, as in "now DS I am leaving my food next to yours, whatever you do, do NOT eat any of my tomatoes" (said with a big twinkle in the eye) DS would grin and duly pinch the tomatoes. Job done - if I put tomatoes on his own plate, he would have whinged!

Also saying things like "I don't think you're a big enough boy yet to put your shoes in the cupboard, are you" - result, shoes away.

Kids are v v clever and they know the difference between a real "don't do that" and a jokey challenge delivered with a smile and a twinkle.

I think if you use humour alot rather than just a very straight "DS put your shoes on" then it's much nicer for everyone, makes your day more fun and has the lovely side effect of developing your child's sense of humour.

[FairyArmadillo]

Marking my place so I can read this later.

You could be me, OP! Have you looked at the parents of 3 year olds support thread?

[motherinferior]

Three year olds are insane. All of them. Demented. They drive you to screaming tears.

I can however assure you that they get over it and become quite human. I realise this is no consolation now, but really it's him not you.

[Selks]

Can I suggest a book - The Incredible Years - A Troubleshooting Guide for Parents of Children Aged 2 - 8 Years by Carolyn Webster Stratton.
This book is brilliant and will help you devise ways of managing and responding to this behaviour that will work soon and in the long term.
www.amazon.co.uk/Incredible-Years-Carolyn-Webster-Stratton/dp/1892222043?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

[brandnewme]

Some more fab advice - thank you all. Another good morning so hopefully now I;ve changed my attitude things will continue - onwards and upwards. I knew I needed to take a step back and reassess, as I was just knackered and getting frustrated and nowhere!

Very interesting what the dr said shopping and ignoring is far easier than shouting so I can easily do that!

[sarararararah]

I'm also a teacher who finds parenting much more tricky than teaching! Last year we had 45 Reception children in a FS unit - that was infinitely easier! DD is 3 and we also have 6 month old DS. A couple of things to try that I have found sometimes work....

1. Putting the toy back scenario - I think because we are so used to children doing as we say instantly at school we expect this from our own. Of course it doesn't work like that! What I do when DD says no to putting the toy back is say, "Ok, but I'm not doing anything else with you until you do, so it's up to you." Initially she would leave it there for ages, but then of course wanted me to do something so would give in eventually (she's VERY stubborn!). Now, she does it as soon as I say that. "Ok then, Mummy."
   

1. Hurting the baby - I think when he's not doing anything with the baby and it's just the two of you I'd talk about how fantastic the baby thinks he is and also talk about what DS was like when he was the babies age. Then you can also talk about when he pulls the baby down the stairs it's very dangerous and the baby doesn't like it and he feels very sad and cries. Then when he's actually doing the dangerous thing I'd say - "Look at his face DS he doesn't like it!" Quite firmly - if he ignores this then take the baby away and go away from him. Also, when he's doing something nice with the baby, I'd say, "Oh look at the babies face, he really likes what you're doing there. Look! You're making him laugh." This shows him the intrinsic good feeling of doing something nice rather than just to get praise. If he's anything like my DD he hates overt praise anyway.
   

Sorry if you've tried these things already! Another thing that's often sited on here is to imagine there's a film camera watching you. When I do this it makes me keep calmer and deal with things more thoughtfully which can only be a good thing I think.

Definitely yes to cutting yourself some slack - I find two DCs impossible some days and you have 3? 3 is tough.

[deaconblue]

More thoughts - the paed we saw for ds (he has aspergers, we didn't see him just because ds was an annoying 3 year old :) ) said that the only effective way of changing bad behaviour is by ignoring it. He said every time we respond to a child's behaviour we reaffirm the behaviour and make it likely to happen again. So we should make a massive deal over all "good' behaviours and totally ignore anything that isn't dangerous. Dangerous stuff should be dealt with by moving the child away but without looking at them or speaking. It's really hard particularly when you feel other parents are looking at you and expecting you to hand out a punishment but I think he's right and I try to stick to it.
Re the pulling baby down the stairs incident How to Talk book would say use information to deal with such incidents. So you say to ds "rough and tumble on the stairs is dangerous, lets go and play downstairs where it's safe instead". you've then given him the information he needs to hopefully make a safer choice next time but without getting cross with him.

[petisa]

Hello, my dd's 3.1 years and I hear where you're coming from OP, and I can be shouty too, and feel terrible about it. I've ditched the naughty step and am no longer shouting as much after having read a few books - Playful Parenting, Raising our children, raising ourselves and Unconditional Parenting. I don't follow these parenting styles to the letter by any means, but they have really helped me be kinder and gentler with my frustrating threenager!

The main tactics I employ are:

• distraction
  
• ignoring attention seeking
  
• explaining clearly and concisely and gently rather than ranting
  
• validating her feelings rather than denying them - yes you really want to stay here at the park don't you because it's fun, etc
  
• role playing, so getting her dolls to hit each other and cry and be hurt and hug and say sorry, or kick each other and laugh about it, etc, as a release
  
• tickling her when I feel myself getting angry
  
• visualise myself ranting at her and being really angry in my head and taking a breath before trying my best to be sweetness and light - this really works for me as a release!
  
• leave the room for a minute
  
• apologise for being shouty and start again
  
• not getting trapped into situations where you get your toddler doing exactly what you've just told them not to do while "smirking" at you - mine does that a lot at the moment, by doing some of the above instead of saying "DON'T pull my hair again /STOP hitting your sister"
  

Good luck, I know how frustrating it can be sometimes having a just turned 3 year old, but they really can't control themselves and their impulses and feelings and can't follow your orders to "be good" at this age. Best to keep them distracted, amused doing activites, running around etc to stop them from getting up to no good IMO. HTH!

[brandnewme]

Thank you - will ignore the smirking then!

Having a better day today and he's a nursery now. Lets hope teatime/bedtime passes calmly.

[camdancer]

The only thing that would work with my DS at that age was making stuff into a game. So taking toys back to the playroom would be "I can take my toy into the playroom quicker than you. Ready, steady, go" And usually by "ready" he was already off. Picking up shoes, I'd do something like pick up DD's shoes and say "are these your shoes? Where are your shoes?" Just anything to make it into a game preferably one where he could win easily. It is very tiring though and I did resort to shouting - sadly that just didn't help.

Be careful about the smirking though - that you aren't projecting older feelings to someone who is very little and might not understand fully. Easier said than done though when it looks like someone is being rude to you.

[brandnewme]

Thanks for the tips. He's not always unkind to the baby, just somethings are getting dangerous now the baby is more active around the house. Tickling him or stroking him I don't think would help when he's trying to drag him down some stairs.

Also re the toys, it's really only me asking to put 1 thing back in the playroom, that's he's dumped in the middle of the floor in the hall/kitchen or whatever, not tidy up lots. This is what is frustrating, that he can't/won't do really simple, reasonable, quick and easy tasks. Yet I know he understands and isn't daft. He also smirks alot when told off so that says to mean he's trying to wind us up and test us. i find it very hard to be chirpy and positive when he's being like that.

[cottonreels]

Am also a teacher who finds it hard to parent my own dd 19 months
With regard to the baby, maybe try to model how to stroke the babys feet or some such whilst repeating the mantra 'gentle hands'. Maybe thats too young for your ds. What about a doll so he can practise what you do with the real baby?
Can he count? Could you ask him to put 5 toys in the toy box (showing off his counting skills as he counts to 5). Maybe put some toys away and rotate them every so often so that there is less to clear away...

[Rosebud05]

I'd second the book suggestion and also the 'pick your battles'. It's irritating when they won't pick up their shoes/tidy up/put things away and other things they're completely capable of but my strategy is to just accept that most of the time asking these things of dd (4.2) is setting the stage for a yes\no type confrontation so I either make it into a jolly old game or 95% of the time do it myself because then there's no conflict to be had over a pair of shoes or whatever.

\maybe that's lazy of me but I suppose it feels that it means that the majority of my interactions with dc are friendly and co-operative which does mine and I'm sure their sanity the world of good.

[schobe]

I second the suggestion of reading 'how to talk'. One of the strategies is to explore the fantasy, eg 'wouldn't it be great if we could stay at the soft play place for ever? Where would you sleep?' etc etc.

I find that allows us to branch into surreal absurdity and/or humour. Either because of the distraction or just being allowed to express fully what they want, they do seem to be more willing just to get up and leave the place (while still discussing the fantasy).

Read the book, I'm describing it very badly!

[brandnewme]

Thanks shopping - I want him to be 4 so he's in fulltime education

I'm going to try and stop the shouting. But some of the things that we ask him no to do are for his own safety, that of others or so things don't get broken. At teatime he tried to drag the baby down some stairs......how do i phrase that without saying 'don't' or in a positive happy way?? Twice i asked him to leave the baby alone and had i not been standing right next to them and grab baby, there would have been an accident. I try to back up requests with a simple explanation why so he might understand why we are asking him certain things.

Shouting is just me loosing control. Dh is more along the stern parenting line and I'm not - I do try and think how he must feel about situations, and say stuff like 'i know you're having fun playing but it's time to go home/to the supermarket/pick your sister up etc now' and so on. DH is very much 'nip it in the bud' attitude whereas i realise there's alot going on in his head and the world is a crazy place for kids.

Perhaps I'll make a new sticker chart tonight - it will at least help us focus on trying to help him rather than shout and punish....

[deaconblue]

AHA brandnewme - "I used to teach and 30 kids were a walk in the park compared to this". You could be me 2 years ago with my ds. I found it relatively easy to control 30 teenagers yet ds could drive me to tears in seconds. Here are my words of wisdom 2 yrs on:

1. stop comparing parenting with teaching - it is infinitely different because you don't love the kids you teach
   
2. boys just are a pita from 2 -3.5. Ds woke up at 3.5 and was calmer, more rational and altogether lovelier. He is now 5 and mostly fab
   
3. having a dd first makes it tricky too. Girls are just easier toddlers than boys imo (I have a younger dd who has been fairly easy to parent from 2 -3yrs old)
   
4. praise praise and praise some more. Ditch the punishments (all I did with ds was move him to another room if he was driving me insane) because they don't get them anyway. I read "How to talk so kids listen" and try to follow the advice there. It changed me from angry shouting mum and gave me useful suggestions on things to try with ds. I almost never shout now and still use the techniques most days.
   
5. a very wise friend of mine said to me when ds was 3 and I was fed up with similar behaviour "you just want him to be 4. He will be soon." She was dead right, I was expecting the behaviour of an older child and he just couldn't help being uncooperative, irrational etc he just wasn't mature enough to be any different.

[brandnewme]

Thank you all - lots to take on board and have a think about.

He's 3 and 3 months, very switched on and bright. Perhaps that's why i think this shouldn't be happening, he communicates very well but i guess not able to process everything thats going on??

Schobe - i was thinking of returning to teaching as it's easier than this

[Danthe4th]

Youre asking a question/request that will get a no answer and most toddlers would say no,simple.
Have you tried saying it differently, ' i'll carry this if you carry that' type of thing. or instead of saying don't poke the baby, say can you tickle her feet.
Or 'where do my shoes go and where do yours go, you show me how quickly you can do it' Turn it into a game it may take the stress out of it.

Most toddlers do not hear the first word, if don't is at the beginning they hear the rest of it,iyswim.
Don't forget he is still young and will learn by example and praise for doing something well.
He wants to please so create situations where he can do that.

[FattyAcid]

IF reward & punishment isn't working try reading Unconditional Parenting and Playful Parenting for an alternative approach that may suit you both