to think doing coke and breastfeeding are incompatible?

[MrsBates]

Well, I know I'm not being unreasonable really but what are your thoughts? Was at a party recently and two mothers who are breastfeeding were taking coke. One says she is a 'bit naughty' to be smoking spliffs in front of her children but at least she and her husband only do it in the garden. One mum did say she is breastfeeding mainly to lose weight. Nice.

I wasn't a saint back in the day but now I have children - no way - and while feeding?! Still I do have too much wine sometimes and think that is sort of OK. Where do your draw your lines (you know the kind) about recreation of the drug kind?

[AbbeyA]

A wonderful post ThinWhiteDuchess- I agree with every word.

[Ronaldinhio]

YABVU
How else will that pram faced one from Atomic Kitten get by?

[ThinWhiteDuchess]

Jeez, it really does beggar belief. The same old arguments are trotted out by the boring fuckers idiots who still believe it is cool to do coke, whether they are parents or not. Why bother to compare it with alcohol? I really do not see either the point of this.

I cannot tell you what a boring drug cocaine is. And it makes the people taking it boring too. People who do the 'odd line' of coke are so desperate to believe that they are cool and know how to 'party' and that others who choose not to are dull or square or whatever. Nothing can be further from the truth and imho if you choose to do coke past 30 (am with you here oliveoil) then you are a total fuckwit. Just my opinion (based on a huge amount of personal experience and lost friends).

And of course, doing cocaine while pg, b/f or when responsible for others is beyond stupid.

[MrsBates]

[susiecutiebananas]

Cote- to asnwer you question about your pain postpartum.
I was still in need of morphine post partum. As DD was in the NNU, and I wanted to br feed, they were incredibly supportive of me doing so. It meant that if any of the morphine was present in the milks she took, she would be exposed to a minimal amount. She would then have a 'natural' withdrawal. As it happens, she didn't 'withdraw' from it and was ok.

The amount of morphine that is present in br milk is so infinitesimal that it was not a worry to them at all. It is a legal drug, which they know exactly what it 'contains'. The amounts taken are controlled. The effects are known... etc etc...

The same cannot be said for Cocaine or any other street drug. It is not regulated. It is not monitored. It is not know exactly what is in the drug that is taken, as it's made up often of all kinds of things to bulk it up. The effects are unknown for all those reasons.

I'm surprised to say the least, that were you in such pain, your midwives or Dr's did not prescribe you anything substantial enough to deal with it. I am not disbelieving you at all btw. I feel you did not receive adequate care.

There are very few drugs ( legal, i.e. the exact make up of which is know) that actually are excreted in br milk. very few. So as such, you should have been given good and adequate pain relief.

Mrsbates- I'm pleased that you have forwarded this on and something pro-active might come from it. I hope for the sake of those babies, that something does.

[MrsBates]

If they have anything by the ounce it's not common sense in this case. I have forwarded some of this info to the girl who is mates with them and will report on reaction. Even if I thought social services was appropriate in this case I don't know where they live but don't worry susiecb it is not being ignored. It has highlighted a wider spread problem than just these people too.

[susiecutiebananas]

I think I would be inclined to call Social services. The children would be classed as "at risk from" it is not acceptable and can do serious harm to a baby.

Any baby who is exposed to high levels of alcohol, or moderate level of opiate ( and some other) drugs, ( prescribed or otherwise) needs to be observed in NNU post delivery, for signs of withdrawal. ( My own DD had to be due to me having to take morphine when pg, no choice, I felt sick and guilty every time they came round to give it to me. Luckily she was ok. She was prem, so had other problems associated with that but ok re morphine )

TO do this willingly, when you do have the choice is not only irresponsible but a vile thing to do to a baby, of any age. Why would any one want to do something to deliberatly harm their child. Why? They must know it will, surely? Any ounce of common sense would tell them this.

just give up br feeding FFS! The good you do from BF is totally outweighed by the harm in this instance. You don't actually always loose weight either. I gained weight.

Very disturbed by this. I'd not be able to let it go if I witnessed it.

[chipmonkey]

Not any more, I hasten to add!

[chipmonkey]

Common practice around here too, MrsBates!

[MrsBates]

My Mum put alcohol in bottled milk to get us to sleep. Crazy 70's parenting. A year of breastmilk and weaned onto brandy. Probably why my brother was teetotal until recently.

[chipmonkey]

But the alcohol in the breastmilk gradually filters back into the blood and into the liver and kidneys ( and skin!) for disposal. So it's not the case that if you have had one too many, that the alcoholic breast milk will end up in the baby if not pumped and dumped, The same milk which is too high in alcohol at midnight, will be fine by 7 am.

[MrsBates]

StewiesMom - I like your style. Will do the same and if anyone else has been bothered by the thread please follow StewiesMom's lead and do something similar. This isn't about judging other people, it's about letting them know the risks they are taking. How you relax is up to you but a few months off shouldn't be too hard for the kinds of people who would be receptive to this message. Most of them were smokers and drinkers who gave up while pregnant. And if it is harder to avoid than they expect, well maybe that would help them face something that has gone from a laugh to a dependancy and prompt a change of social circle.

Thanks for taking it seriously despite early suspicions of me being a troll. Although if you saw the state of me today you'd wonder all over again.

[CoteDAzur]

No, actually, I don't know what you mean. Breastmilk does not circulate through the body and pass through liver & kidneys like blood.

[VictorianSqualor]

You know what I mean. You don't have to take the blood out of your body and throw it away until new stuff is made.

Blood (along with the help of other organs ) like breastmilk, is cleansed in your body, pumping and dumping is a big fat waste of time unless it is to keep supply stimulated.

[RhubarbEatsBiscuitsOnTheBog]

My blood is green and can dissolve metal.

[CoteDAzur]

Blood doesn't cleanse itself! Haven't you studied any biology?

That is what liver and kidneys are for.

[chipmonkey]

Sorry, VS X posts!

[chipmonkey]

But there is nothing to suggest the odd glass of wine while bfing does any harm while it has been shown that cocaine when bfing can cause harm.

Cote, what VS means is that for example, even if you don't "pump and dump" the level of alcohol in the breastmilk will reduce at the same rate as it reduces in the blood. So you don't need to rid your body of the contaminated alcoholic milk, your body will do that itself

Doctors can sometimes be fairly ignorant of what can and can not be taken while breastfeeding, btw. You get better info on that on Mumsnet! BTW I had a CS wound infection on ds1 and was given antibiotics with no ill-effects on ds1.

[VictorianSqualor]

Well, IMO, then Rhubarb that is fine. DP would do the same for me. I just don't think someone who is suffering from a dreadful hangover or come down is the right person to be in control of children.

[VictorianSqualor]

Cote, breastmilk cleanses itself in the same way that blood does. Certain medications would affect a baby, others not so.

Obviously the stronger medication you are given, the more goes through you blood stream, and into your milk, which means it would take longer to be out of the milk.

Tiktok has talked about this hugely with relation to alcohol in breastmilk and how there is no point whatsoever in pumping and dumping.

[RhubarbEatsBiscuitsOnTheBog]

Surely it's much the same as having a glass of wine whilst bfing? I should imagine it's more dangerous to do these things whilst the baby is developing in the womb, but I think that breastmilk has the ability to filter out some toxins. Still not brilliant, but overall I'd rather see mothers breastfeed than not.

[NobodysPerfect]

I'd had a couple of lines the day before I found out I was pg. Once I knew I was pg I didn't do any more and I also stopped smoking.

I had a -regular- odd spliff when I bf.

DC is fine. I feel slightly guilty, but not much tbh.

[Rhubarb]

Ah VS, my wonderful dh does that for me. But then he gets to go out and stay overnight at times so we think it's even.

[CoteDAzur]

I'm not sure about breastmilk 'cleansing itself'. If that were the case, I am fairly sure I would have been given much stronger painkillers when squirming in bed postpartum, and then doctors would have been more forthcoming re antibiotics for the infected episiotomy.