Is this a bit neglectful (pets)

[Pleaseaddcaffine]

Friend, has housecats and they done go out. He adores them. But...
Two females ages 2 to 3 form kittens, never vet registered and not netured or wormed or fleaded regularly.
Live in living room only which isn't that big, no scratch posts, beds or toys realy and place is very messy.
Fed 2 pouches between them a day and busicuits... If he can afford it often no biscuits end of month. Litter tray is frankly grim.. Can smell it and viably full of poo very often.
Is this neglect? I think it's borderline but he clearly cares about them. They got poorly and I pointed out needed worming and fleaing then got better.

[Poppyseed14]

Cleaning a litter tray every 4 days is not keeping a litter tray clean. I have 2 indoor cats who share a tray and I use clumping litter and scoop it daily. You should see the amount of stuff that I scoop daily. Think a full baby nappy sack. 4 days of not being cleaned and 2 cats could mean 8 poos never mind wees. I wouldn't want to wee in there either if I were the poor cats.

[FizzyTango]

This is animal abuse! How can you wonder if it’s borderline neglectful when he isn’t even fucking feeding them properly? Forget the house cat debate/medical issues…
He is unwilling/unable to provide basic food and toileting to these animals. They live a cruel and undignified life, probably hungry all the time and unable to shit comfortably. It’s awful and I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night without doing something about it. That man is disgusting.

[Brigante9]

@Pleaseaddcaffine

They wee everywhere as not neturtered

I think you’re thinking of males who tend to mark territory if not neutered. As pp said, it’s more likely due to a full litter tray. Your mate does not care for his cats, he’s totally neglectful.

[birdglasspen2]

It doesn't sound like much food ....but they are in a room and probably don't need to eat as much as an active outdoor cat?! Sounds grim

[TenThousandSpoons]

If there’s only one tray between two cats it would need cleaning daily. I have three trays between my two cats and they also go outside so half the time toilet outside. I still wouldn’t leave them 4 days. Poo is taken out daily, as soon as I see it. Couldn’t he try 3 or 4 trays if you explain they then might not wee everywhere, then he could let them in the bedrooms too if it works.
If he runs out of food though he can’t afford the cats and should re home them.

[Bemyclementine]

The litter tray needs to have thecwee and poo picked out every single time they wee or poo. If he used the Cats best clumping litter, and used a litter scoop, he'd rarely need to actually clean the tray.

[kittenkipping]

I have housecats. IMO it's not cruel and the life expectancy of a house at is 16+ as opposed to the 4-6 of an outdoor cat. Reasons being bloody obvious. However, if you choose to keep a cat indoors you really have to up the cat game- they are not the easy, just feed them and that's that type of pet you get with an outdoor cat. You have to provide vertical spaces, climbing and scratching opportunities, toys, and actively play with them with wand toys etc to meet their needs and satisfy them. What's more a litter tray PER cat plus one extra is advised. Fleas can be carried in on human clothes / be in the soft furnishings so even indoor cats need regularly fleeing just in case. And the food?! Three pouches each a day is standard. Frankly I'd be reporting your friend to rspca or cats protection. He's failing his pets. Definitely abuse.

[Wakemeupfromthisdream]

Keeping cats indoors is not cruel. We have 2 lovely indoor cats who are happy and healthy, with the run of the house and 4 litter trays which are checked daily. One has a medical condition meaning he can't go outside, the other is a pampered pedigree. Our vet and the cats protection league have both advised us, so who are you lot who think you know better? Being indoor cats is not the issue here, it is neglect and ignorance do please get of your high horse. I agree the op should intervene and help these poor cats who are not being fed or cared for properly. Maybe this owner needs wider help.

[Mabelstearooms]

I have two indoor only cats. They have the run of the house, toys, multiple scratching and climbing frames, both spayed. I flea & worm them once a year as they don't get fleas. They also have their injections once a year too. Just because they are indoor cats doesn't mean they shouldn't be health checked regularly still.

They are fed 2 pouches each a day and have a full bowl of biscuits to munch on as they please. Several water bowls of clean water around the house.

They have 3 litter trays between them that are scooped everyday for poo and wee. He needs to be doing this. It's a health hazard for both the cats and himself.

He may love them, but he is still neglecting them, which you know isn't ok. The RSPCA are useless from my experience but you could always talk to cats protection for some advice about broaching the subject or who to contact about the neglect.

[WiddlinDiddlin]

It takes a heck of a flea burden to make an adult cat ill...

If they're not going out, they don't need routine flea/worm treatment - the sensible thing to do is to flea treat the property (all rooms of his flat) properly using a vet recommended product that lasts 6 to 12 months and this will take care of any travelling fleas from other flats or visitors.

The only exception here is - if the flat is SO filthy there is a mouse or rat issue and the cats are killing those and in particular killing and consuming then yes, flea/worm treatment would be sensible.

Even then, NEVER use over the counter stuff to flea/worm, particularly if the cat is sick, its a really easy way to kill a cat. You need to use vet stuff only, and that has to be prescribed by a vet who has seen the cat within the last 6 months.

I never flea/worm unless I see reason to (ie, evidence of fleas/worms in the property or the animal), theres no good reason to stuff animals full of pretty toxic chemicals 'just in case'.

The inappropriate weeing will be a combination of a lack of space, dirty litter trays improperly spaced and not cleaned often enough (they may also have the 'wrong' litter in them, cats can be very particular about what litter they'll use) and the lack of enrichment.

Neutering would be sensible, it would reduce stress by stopping them coming into season and wanting something they can never get.

SO yes this is neglectful and abusive - but your chances of getting your friend to see this and change what they do are low, and as the cats are fed, watered and sheltered your chances of getting the RSPCA or anyone else to take action are also pretty low.

[Bumblefuzz]

I have 3 house cats (one is only a kitten so the following was the same for 2). They have a massive litter tray in the utility that gets cleaned at least twice per day. They have the run of the house and have a big floor to ceiling cat tree, several cardboard scratchy furniture things, 2 Bigfoot scratching posts and lots of toys. They don't have flea treatment as often as if they were outdoor, but are wormed. The youngest isn't spayed yet as we have only had her a couple of weeks and has to have her 2nd vaccination on Friday before she can be booked in. The other two are. I do believe that cats can be happy in flats, but they need enrichment and a clean environment. I'm not surprised they're peeing elsewhere if litter is never cleaned!

[Whatsthestoryboringglory]

Every 4 days?! I have one cat and have to do it daily! There should be two trays (ideally three) between two cats and daily cleans.

No wonder the poor things are pissing everywhere. Imagine having to stand in your own shit to have a wee.

[Pleaseaddcaffine]

He's a bit deluded tbh... He says I have biscuits but I know several times he's not got any in for days in a row.
I've suggested switching to tinned food not pouches as cheaper.
It the smell tbh I find it very bad and I know that isn't normal for cat litter trays... My kittens ncer smells (her farts do! Yuck)

[Sunshineandbrighterdays]

@Bemyclementine

The litter tray needs to have thecwee and poo picked out every single time they wee or poo. If he used the Cats best clumping litter, and used a litter scoop, he'd rarely need to actually clean the tray.

I was also just about to suggest Cat's Best cat litter. Just a quick scoop each time they do a poo or wee and he'll only need to completely change the litter every month or even less. You can technically flush this litter as well, although I don't as it's not brilliant to have cat poo in the water system.
I do think he is being incredibly neglectful, however if you want to try to help him, this might be a good place to start.

[Cw112]

@Grandeur

I hate when people don't allow their cats to go outdoors. Cats are natural roamers.

No scratch posts or toys means they're not getting any stimulation. And an inadequate diet on top Poor cats.

Not all cats can go outside safely. Ours is indoor only due to health conditions he has. He's got plenty of space and stimulation provided in the house. Posters starting otherwise aren't taking FIV and other conditions into consideration.

I'd be inclined to ring animal welfare anonymously to be honest. They should absolutely be de-fleaed and wormed monthly even if they are indoor only. We can carry things in from outside so its still possible for them to get an infestation. It sounds like he wants to do his best for then but either doesn't understand what they need or can't afford to provide it because that is nowhere near enough food. Its definitely neglect.

[LT2]

@mumboss1984

Some cats shouldn’t be outdoors. The breed we have is not known for being savvy outdoors so would likely get hit by a car very easily. We are having a catio built for her so she has outside access. She hates other cats anyway.

I bet I can guess - Ragdolls? I have 2 😍

[anotherday11]

@Pleaseaddcaffine

I have spoken to him about it several times, he seems to genuinly belive he cleans the litter tray every 4 days. No way he does. It mings. I mean takes your breath away mings

You say every 4 days like this is some fantastic target he’s achieving 😳

I check my indoor cat’s litter tray several times per DAY! The same way as a human you wouldn’t like to take a piss or shit in a toilet already filled to the brim without being flushed, so why is he subjecting those poor cats to the same?

The cats are pissing everywhere because their litter tray is disgusting to them. Your friend should not have cats if he can’t even do basic things such as make sure they have a clean toilet and plentiful food source.

[Pleaseaddcaffine]

I don't really know as never had a cat, only more aware mow as just got own kitten.
I knew it wasn't right but wasn't sure as no reference

[TheSausageKingofChicago]

My cat mostly does his business outside but we have a tray for emergencies at night, when I keep him in. I probably scoop it every 3 days.
The weeing inside is a red flag.
Indoor cats need a lot more toys and playtime than those who play out too.
In terms of food, what is their weight like? Do they look skinny?

[Mahanii]

The cats protection website recommends feeding kittens twice a day and adult cats (over 12 months) once a day. I don't think a pouch of wet food each plus biscuits is too little?

[Pleaseaddcaffine]

There a small breed but to me yes, they are on the thin side

[mountainsunsets]

@Brigante9

I think you’re thinking of males who tend to mark territory if not neutered. As pp said, it’s more likely due to a full litter tray. Your mate does not care for his cats, he’s totally neglectful.

Female cats also mark if they're not neutered.

[Pleaseaddcaffine]

Three manufacturer says 4 pouches a day... They don't always have biscuits.
If they did it have complete food biscuits it wouldn't be an issue for me

[HeadacheEarthquake]

Report report report.

[Regularsizedrudy]

@Beamur

If they never go out, they probably don't need flea and worm treatment. Not neutering is risky in case they do get out.
Food and living conditions leave a bit to be desired though. They are probably bored and under exercised.

Yes they do. Fleas and worms eggs live inside too. It only takes one flea in your carpet to infest your pet.