To think this isn't acceptable even in a pandemic?

[MinniMooC]

My council runs local facilities I'd like to use. Think things like: sign language course, first aid course, swimming classes at council owned pool, etc. Stuff the government encourages people to undertake.

I've tried and failed 3 times now to book in.

The first time I spent my attempt tryi6to figure out on a laptop how to book - after much reading I realised the multiple attempts to push me into the iPhone store or Google shop were the right links - you can book via smartphone app. Great. Except my (2 year old) smart phone is "too old" to run it. Hm.

Ring customer service. In hold for so long I used up my lunch break and gave up.

Called to book the following day - after 25min in a queue, woman tells me I can't book and pay by phone, nor are they accepting cash or in person bookings even if I travel there. I can only book by smartphone or in the website account. She walked me through setting up an account which, I shit you not, took 20 mins. The form wouldn't submit properly because I don't have a landline and it was a mandatory field. We eventually figured out a fake number it would accept. Then it wouldn't do the actual booking because I can only book a week in advance and the slot for next Friday, Saturday, Sunday or Monday (when I have a long weekend and and can attend any of the options) aren't released until a few days before at 9pm. So to book Friday I'd need to log in at 9pm after Tuesday. Argh!

I ask if I can book via the phone on e.g. Wednesday morning but I get told again; smartphone or website only.

I've given up trying - it's taken me longer to try to book this government-recommended class than doing the damn thing. I'm looking into private options with better systems.

AIBU to think that "smartphone only, or website plus mandatory landline number" is extremely restrictive?

I asked customer service about people who don't have mobiles or WiFi because libraries are closed, it credit cards, and she said she didn't know. Even in my own middle class, stable income family members like my mum. She wouldn't be able to book any courses because she doesn't have a smartphone and would never get past that stupid account setup form.

[DdraigGoch]

A lot of people on this thread need to start writing to their councillors and MP. That's what they are for!

[TheSockMonster]

@ChloeCrocodile

I think it must be very unusual to not have a landline tbh. I don’t have a home phone but there is still a phone line and number because the internet connection requires it. The number of people who have neither a home phone nor an internet connection must be very small.

That said, booking online only shuts out a lot of people and there should be an option to pay cash too. I’d request to see the equalities impact assessment but most likely you’ll get told it doesn’t matter if some groups can’t access the service “because covid”. Much like when public toilets were mostly closed last spring.

I would have said this until the FTTP (fibre to the premises, e.g “full fibre”). You don’t need a landline and, in fact, have to pay extra if you want one.

I think over 10% of the UK has it at last count.

[WrongKindOfFace]

@ChloeCrocodile

I think it must be very unusual to not have a landline tbh. I don’t have a home phone but there is still a phone line and number because the internet connection requires it. The number of people who have neither a home phone nor an internet connection must be very small.

That said, booking online only shuts out a lot of people and there should be an option to pay cash too. I’d request to see the equalities impact assessment but most likely you’ll get told it doesn’t matter if some groups can’t access the service “because covid”. Much like when public toilets were mostly closed last spring.

It really isn’t unusual. A lot of people don’t have one due to cost.

[Xenia]

Our local council made booking the tip online only last year in March or April (it was closed entirely for a month to start with). I was the top booker int he whole of my London borough (amazingly) as I had cleared 20 years worth of dead bushes which even 2 companies that quoted me would not remove so I was back and forth there about 3 or 4 times a week for months so much they sent the head of waste to meet me twice so sure were they I was a gardener as no one could have such a big garden and so much waste (I do). Anyway they liked the new booking system because they have less work to do in my view. It limits numbers incredibily down from the old days. Also you cannot book your next session until back from the first and then usually have to wait 2 or 3 days to get a slot. In fact one dustman asked how I was able to get 4 slots a week - the secret is as soon as you get home from the last you book the next one. I am not sure what system people can use like my neighbour who has no internet however. She found it really hard to pay for garden waste this year without the internet. I hope she got through on the phone eventually or was able to post them a cheque.

You also have to turn up at the tip with confirmation of the booking - I print it our as they often cannot find you and your car on the list, your photo ID like a driving licence and a copy of your council tax bill. Also if you are more than about 10 minutes early they turn you away and you must not be later than the 30 minute slot.

I wonder if we will ever get back to the glory days when I demolished a hut and green house in the 90s when 5 months pregnant and was doing 4 trips a day of stuff - no bookings. No wonder we get fly tipping.

[stuckinarutatwork]

I'm fed up with the lazy 'because Covid' excuses from organisations that are meant to support the public.
We recently moved house to a neighbouring town and our old GP said they could no longer serve us as we were no longer in their catchment (fair enough). When we went to register with the only surgery in our new town, we were told 'sorry, we aren't taking new registrations due to Covid' . The old GP wouldn't let us stay as they 'can't once they know you've moved'. So now the whole family is GP-less and I'm having to spend hours (literally) a week phoning round various NHS agencies and admin people to try and get us a GP. No GP means no vaccine either

[Imaginethis]

I’ve had similar problems. I can book a swimming session at our local outsourced Leisure Centre but when I try to pay my debit card is not accepted on my IPhone (5). Fortunately my husband’s phone is more up to date so I can use this.

It’s impossible to contact the chain of leisure centres and I ended up emailing my local councillor who in turn asked the Leisure Centre manager to email me.

It is offputting and I really hadn’t thought of the discriminatory aspect so much. Will be contacting my councillor again.

[Shellingbynight]

That sounds infuriating, they should offer an option to book by phone or in person too.

My council pool/gym doesn't offer online booking - maybe I should be grateful for that! We either book by phone (good luck getting someone to pick up), or in person. The easiest option is to book the next session when you arrive for the current one.

I have an annual membership but 'pay per session' is done at the reception desk using contactless. As far as I know they still refuse cash.

[MondieBee]

For everyone talking about landlines, just either put your mobile in or 00000 000000 and the form will accept it. It just wants a certain number of digits.

I agree it's silly OP but now you've managed it I think PP is right to not do it would be cutting of your nose to spite your face.

[TheDailyCarbunkle]

@YellowScallion

I think it IS too much effort

I'm not sure you'd get very far with the complaint that it's too much effort to log onto a website to book something. You've already gone through the pain of creating an account, which may not have been straightforward but as a one time thing it's probably reasonable.

This is the attitude companies rely on. It allows them to supply utterly shit services and people will not only accept it, they'll have the attitude that if they can't struggle through the services and endure massive and pointless inconvenience then they themselves are in the wrong. This is something I research as part of my work - it's amazing the extent to which people will tolerate truly hideous design and even blame themselves when it doesn't work.

I beg of you - don't stand for it. The more you accept it, the worse it'll get.

I can guarantee you (because I've sat in on these meetings) that there'll be a review of booking data at some point and they'll say 'oh we've had a real drop off in interest, I suppose we should just shut that service.' If anyone brings up the idea that it's impossible to book the response will be a shrug and a claim that they're done the best they can (not true) and that if people can't use the systems that's not their problem.

In central government services, if any difficulty is found in an online process, your service fails the assessment and has to go back to the start. That's as it should be - if a service simply doesn't do what it's supposed to do, then it's not fit for purpose.

Incidentally it may interest you to know that when tech pundits talk about automation and AI this is essentially what they're talking about - replacing humans with badly designed systems that don't do the job properly, causing frustration and result in disadvantage and discrimination.

If you call a person to engage with a service/process, you expect that person to be able to help you, or to pass you on to someone who can help you. You expect to get what you need fairly quickly and without too much hassle.

If it's not possible to easily get the same level of service from an online system and there's no alternative, then that's simply not good enough. It just isn't.

[ThewaterlilliesofGiverny]

My DMum’s utility provider’s phone line is out of action and won’t act on signed letters, but insist she should whattsapp them, even though she doesn’t have a mobile and even if she did her hands are too arthritic to text.

[NoBetterthanSheShouldBe]

I think many of us either live in the same area or have councils that outsourced leisure centres to the same company.

The one near me operates bookings on the app only, you can never get through on the phone, only a week in advance. Pool opens for the first time since March 2020 tomorrow noon.

For all the announcements about app-only booking, queueing at reception is the best way to book if you aren’t IT confident.

[EssentialHummus]

It's absolutely galling. There was a thread on here 2/3 days ago about how things are functioning in this covid twilight and the bottom line from a lot of posters was private sector fine, public sector barely functioning. Why is it that if I want to sign up for a high-end gym I can input my name, DOB, email address and credit card number, but if I want to sign up to a council leisure centre it's a three page form requiring a pink post -2018 iPhone accessible only on alternate Tuesdays?

[Winter2020]

Similar problems here. I've spent an hour trying to find a swim timetable or any way to book a slot at our two local leisure centres. No chance. If they remain closed a simple message saying so would be helpful. Rather than "see the timetable below" when there isn't one. Swimming slot search that requires names of sessions - when I have no idea what the Council have called their sessions.

[WeatherwaxOn]

If this is the case it isn't accesible and could be in contravention of the equalities act.
They should offer telephone booking.
Not everyone has a smartphone.
Not everyone does apps.
Not everyone is technology-savvy.

I would be complaining about this.

[FluffMagnet]

As it's a council, you could always do a Freedom of Information request about the equalities assessment and generally how the percentage ages of users has differed since they have moved to this online system? Then you have evidence to take forwards.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

No landline is actually the omly reason sticking with Virgin😂
I don't think I even have a phone socket here actually

[NakedBanana]

@ChloeCrocodile

I think it must be very unusual to not have a landline tbh. I don’t have a home phone but there is still a phone line and number because the internet connection requires it. The number of people who have neither a home phone nor an internet connection must be very small.

That said, booking online only shuts out a lot of people and there should be an option to pay cash too. I’d request to see the equalities impact assessment but most likely you’ll get told it doesn’t matter if some groups can’t access the service “because covid”. Much like when public toilets were mostly closed last spring.

I don't agree chloecrocodile most of my friends do not have landlines!

We're in our 40s/50s.

[LakieLady]

@DdraigGoch

I wonder if an equalities impact assessment was done

I was going to suggest asking this question, and for the OP to complain to her local councillor.

A small, but significant, group of people are being excluded from services because of this insistence to use smartphones/internet.

[Woeismethischristmas]

@ChloeCrocodile

I think it must be very unusual to not have a landline tbh. I don’t have a home phone but there is still a phone line and number because the internet connection requires it. The number of people who have neither a home phone nor an internet connection must be very small.

That said, booking online only shuts out a lot of people and there should be an option to pay cash too. I’d request to see the equalities impact assessment but most likely you’ll get told it doesn’t matter if some groups can’t access the service “because covid”. Much like when public toilets were mostly closed last spring.

I think lots more people are moving away from a landline. In my area mobile internet is faster than bt. Also thier internet has been historically unreliable so people are pissed off and cancelled phone line.

[YellowScallion]

I think it IS too much effort

I'm not sure you'd get very far with the complaint that it's too much effort to log onto a website to book something. You've already gone through the pain of creating an account, which may not have been straightforward but as a one time thing it's probably reasonable.

[HighlandCowbag]

'Cos Covid' has taken over from 'computer says no' hasn't it? I looked at making myself a member of local council gym/pool but it was so difficult just to work out what swim sessions I could take ds to, what times were lane swimming etc I just gave up.

Yet we are members of a multisports club down the road and their systems are so simple to book onto!

[supermoonrising]

Huge numbers now don’t have landlines. And among those who do, millions never use it or don’t even have a phone connected to it (usually just mandatory as part of the broadband package). I’ve found most online websites these days have stopped asking for a landline.

[Confusedandshaken]

Just a hint for the future. When I have a form that requires a landline number I copy in the number of the business or institution involved. So for your form I would have found a number for the local council.

I have a landline for my broadband but I don't have a phone plugged into it. I could check the bill to find out the number but have never needed to.

[SimonedeBeauvoirscat]

Everyone having these problems needs to contact their local councillors and tell them. It’s what they’re here for.

[Barbie222]

I want to say this in kindness but I think you have put a lot of your own barriers up here. I think there will be a way to have a 2 year old phone download the app required. Mine is 5 years old and runs everything as I upgrade it when asked, etc. If everyone gave up as easily when it comes to going online the pandemic would have been even more of a disaster.