just been told I have to go back to the office

[Sarah510]

and I don't want to!!!!! Have been wfh since lockdown and I love it. The freedom of it, and just not having to spend 2+hours commuting. I really thought I would be allowed to keep wfh as my job is not customer facing - I can do everything on teams, and a lot of it is with people in the far east so most is virtual anyway. But my team leader is the leader of another team as well, and she said to me today that she has put me on the rota for coming back to the office. I tried to say that I was happy to help out at busy times but that my priority had to be my own job, and that that wasn't people facing, and that it was going to be difficult to have these team meetings in a large office setting. She was unmovable though. I feel it's unfair. I mean, I'm not on that team, I'm a separate team, just me, the TL and a part-time person who is shielding so will not be coming back. I know people will slate me on here, but I really thought that things would change after lockdown. Team Leader is very anti wfh - she had denied requests even before Covid. She seems to be oldfashioned - like she always made a point of checking if I was in at 9am and telling me off if I was 5 mins late kind of thing. Never mind that I've been working weekends, late nights, early mornings since wfh, she just seems to want everyone back in the office under her watchful eye even though everyone is saying productivity is way up since we have been wfh.

Feeling miserable :( I guess I can 'see how it goes' and maybe put in a formal request to wfh. I tried to say to her that it was matter of being flexible but she's just not - she said no.

[goodwinter]

@4amWitchingHour

It's only hard to manage a remote team if you're a crap team leader - people make too many excuses to not change their working habits to accommodate remote working using the reason that it's difficult. It's not. You just have to be willing to adapt.

As for the "fannying about at home" - get into the 21st century! Why should we continue 1950s working practices when the technology is available to work in a better way.

If I were you OP I'd be looking for a new job.

Same. Unless there's a physical need to be in an office, or you want to be in an office because that's how you work best, it's just presenteeism and/or micromanagement, and I can't stand either. It is a very old fashioned view of things. Even before Covid hit there was a growing acceptance that home working can be a really good thing for both employee & employer - trust has to go both ways, and work should treat you like an adult who can manage their day on their own, and if not then they need to step up and do their job as manager. Imo the "you must be in the office" attitude (unless for a business critical reason, as above) is usually shorthand for "I don't trust my staff" or "I don't want to have to manage properly so I'll tar everyone with the same brush".

[user1487194234]

Am not sure why punctuality is seen as old fashioned
May well influence how she feels about your reliability

[goodwinter]

Also, I worked part from home and part from office pre-Covid, but my team and stakeholders are all located in different offices across the UK and the rest of the world. Literally no reason why I had to be in that particular building - and luckily I have a great manager who can see that.

[9PointsOnMyLicence]

It depends on what you do.
The DVLA are taking on 400 extra staff to clear the backlog which has accrued while their staff have been WFH. The passport service has a backlog of 400,000 cases which have also come from their staff WFH.

It amazes me that people apply for jobs in offices then get upset when their boss actually wants them to turn up. If you don't want to do the job at the location you applied for, then step aside. It's not mandatory, you're not on a chaingang.

[EveryDayIsADuvetDay]

I work in an organisation with people that provide advice to Sage.
February is next likely date that we might think about returning to the office

[everybodysang]

I'd love to continue WFH as I have a huge commute - I didn't really mind it before (except when the trains were screwed up... which was dishearteningly often) but I'm concerned about it now as it's often very, very busy.

Some of those in my business are now back in the office as they found it easier to work there - but they can only fit 30 in our office at the moment with social distancing so they've got those who need to be there in, plus a few others who want to be, and that's it. Unless the advice regarding offices changes, we simply won't be able to go in - and I'm quite pleased about that for now as none of our out-of-school childcare options are available at the moment and nor will they be for the first term back so am a bit relieved that we don't have to worry about it for now (we live very near the school). If the advice changes, though, I think we'll all be called straight back in. I hope the government don't do another massively stressful late night on a Friday announcement so we all have to somehow figure out childcare in about three days to get back in. I will go back when asked, but the change in circumstances means I need some notice to try and sort things out (somehow...).

I think Metro Bank's approach of saying 'we'll bring our staff back into offices once the winter flu season is past' is sensible - it seems a bit silly to drag those back in who CAN work from home if there's a chance we'll all have to suddenly start working from home again over the winter. That way it frees up public transport space for those who do need it.

[justasking111]

DIL working from home part time job but is still expected in the office when requested once a week. I would look for another job if it seems that your boss will not compromise.

[PleasePassTheCoffeeThanks]

Imagine how your colleagues in the office are feeling I disagree, if some people can fully do their work from home they shouldn't be brought back to the office in the middle of a pandemic just because other people need to be there and might be jealous.

I am in a similar position, based in a London office but the rest of my team is in another country. They are now all back to the office but I'm still at home - so video-conf / calls from home instead of from the office, no difference at all for them and makes my live nicer.
I'm glad they are nice people are are not complaining just out of jealousy.

[roarfeckingroarr]

Most office roles in my experience allow you to wfh regularly once you're a certain level. Regular WFH is an important aspect I consider when thinking about a new role, as is not working with a rigid manager stuck in the last century, just as much as the salary and benefits package.

[Laffinalltheway]

Just added up my extra hours (commuting), and fares for said commute, and it appears I'm £22,950.00 worse off per year than my colleagues who are on the same grade and WFH... Just a thought!

[Nextity]

Look for another job. Even in my fairly niche area jobs are being advertised full WFH in a way they never were before.

[User87471643901065319]

No timescales yet for anyone to go back in the global company my DH works for but unlikely to be until at least October (if not next year). Employees have been informed only 30% could go back due to social-distancing when the time does come and priority will be given to those who wish to return to the office.
Very few people need to ever be in the offices at all and I think it very likely they will close most of them down and virtually everyone will continue to wfh.
It could decimate the town where he is based though as there are essentially only two employers there.

[Graphista]

I willingly admit I’m not currently working so don’t really know how things are at the moment

But...

Having worked in office jobs myself even then years ago there was still far too much emphasis on presenteeism rather than work actually being done!

Most office jobs with modern tech can absolutely be done from home and I think it’s utterly ridiculous that bosses are STILL - even now after they’ve SEEN that employees are just as if not more productive wfh - insisting - and before even the cv risk is much lower - on employees returning to working in offices

There’s no good reason for it, a good manager/team leader should be flexible, able to see the bigger picture and more than capable of managing people wfh

It’s old fashioned and unnecessary imo

[Dozer]

Presumably your employer as a whole will have a policy for each location, and should consult staff. unless it’s a small organisation and your team leader has a lot of autonomy.

Disagree that remote working being productive is down to having a good team leader - remote working has both pros and cons.

I too love not commuting, but IMO productivity has suffered in my organisation in lockdown. Eg for my team it’s been much harder to collaborate informally, resolve issues and learn from colleagues. unless/until productivity and other things are measured we just don’t know and it’s all just opinion.

[KatieB55]

Me too this morning. I don't work in a team and my interaction with other staff is all by e-mail (as mostly requires an audit trail). I work in finance so sometimes have to go to the bank. I have worked effectively at home for five months and made some really good process improvements. I'm going to put in a request for flexible working.

[Skyliner001]

@minnieok

Being in an office has other less tangible benefits, team building, cross department relationships etc. Not everyone wfh is that conscientious (a survey said on average we work one hour a day less). I do like wfh, I am today but I've been in 2-3 days a month from March as I need to use software on the server - a four hour round trip (I stay near the office though to save time, keyworker status). Be happy you have a job and you didn't have to use public transport at the height of the pandemic!

Link to the survey please.

[Thislittlelady]

You knew you’d have to go back to normal at some point. You can’t try to say no now. Like you say, get back to the office and put in a formal request for wfh. Many people will be in the same position as you.

[EasterIssland]

Imagine how your colleagues in the office are feeling

O also disagree. If for the nature of my work I need to be in the office I’d rather be either as little people as possible than a full office where the chances of catching the virus and/or needing to self isolate again will be greater.

It depends on what you do.
Exactly. It’s not the same someone working for the passport that I guess the paperwork will need to be done within some machines/etc than I.e my it work that at the moment we’re around 20 people 15 in north west of England. 2 south west. 2 London and 1 from Italy. Making me go to the office in the sw when the team is around the country makes no sense.
My previous engagements client made us go to their offices 4 days a week even if we’re bases somewhere else so had to pay for expenses. Come lockdown and have realised how capable we’re without needing to go to their offices and now are thinking about “work from wherever you want”

[Laffinalltheway]

Just added up my extra hours (commuting), and fares for said commute, and it appears I'm £22,950.00 worse off per year than my colleagues who are on the same grade and WFH... Just a thought!

And I should add that's on a salary of approx. £55,000 per year. Yeah, I am getting a bit resentful I'll admit!

[roarfeckingroarr]

@minnieok

Being in an office has other less tangible benefits, team building, cross department relationships etc. Not everyone wfh is that conscientious (a survey said on average we work one hour a day less). I do like wfh, I am today but I've been in 2-3 days a month from March as I need to use software on the server - a four hour round trip (I stay near the office though to save time, keyworker status). Be happy you have a job and you didn't have to use public transport at the height of the pandemic!

Could we have a link to that survey? It doesn't sound right.

Also any evidence to all these benefits. Especially when compared to general productivity and wellbeing of staff who don't have to undergo daily long commutes just to sit somewhere else to do the same work.

[uniglowooljumper]

She wants to start training me etc. so I can go on the reception desk. Total waste of my expertise, but there you go.

You need to start looking for another job. I've had jobs like this and left them. You wind up with someone who expects you to do it all and gets pissy when you fall down in some areas in which you've had no experience.

Personally, I can't stand customer-facing roles so trained to get out of them. If someone tried to get me back on phones or reception I'd be out there. Been there, done that, fucking hated those roles. They're shit, especially reception because it's expected you'll do everything and receive people.

You're shouting into the wind expecting things to change with this manager in place.

[LucaFritz]

Oh boo hoo you. Think about all the people who have lost their job's entirely or don't even have one right now. And what do you think would become of all the office blocks rented out if everyone stayed at home and all the small businesses that rely on the daily footfall of office workers in the city

[crowsfeet57]

she always made a point of checking if I was in at 9am and telling me off if I was 5 mins late kind of thing

Bosses tend to be funny about that kind of thing. I think that's why it's called work. If we could do what just we wanted, it would be called play!

[heymacaroner]

I don't know how big your company is or the size of your team in proportion to that company, but is it worth considering it might be a 'bigger picture' policy?
I work for a large company, around 5000 employees, with offices all over the UK. Certain departments tend to be based in certain offices, but it's not a rule by any means. In my team, there are 10 of us, and currently I am the only team member based in my office. The others are mostly permanently WFH (including the team director) or based in other offices. No two team members sit together. Around 35% of the entire workforce are home based and it's something the company prides itself on, as it means we are more likely to be appealing to people who live in more remote locations or for whom flexibility around childcare etc is important.
Before covid I chose to WFH once or twice a week, on an informal basis, with my manager's blessing. My contract states I am office based but it didn't seem to be contentious for me to do this. On a Friday, my office is nearly empty as most people choose to WFH. Obviously since lockdown everyone has been WFH and the company has made a specific point of advertising how proud they are of the productivity in this time, how well everyone has adapted and how the business has continued to run largely unchanged. Now they are starting to look at re-opening offices, there's been a large number of people who have realised the benefits of WFH, have been told for months they are operating as well as they used to in the office, and have requested to stay at home permanently. The company stance on this seems to be that they are almost offended and a policy has now been brought in that no-one will have their contract changed to WFH except in exceptional circumstances. This means even for staff like me, whose roles literally aren't impacted by being home, I have to tow the line and am expecting to be asked to go in again at some point.
Mostly from what I can gather, it's because if they didn't take this line, it would feel harder to get anyone to go back in at all, and then they would be wasting vast volumes of money on offices which remain permanently empty. It's frustrating for me but I do understand. Personally, I'm hoping as things settle down again once offices are open I'll be able to get agreement to stay home - apart from anything else, I'm saving £450 a month on commute costs at the moment.

[Frazzled13]

@Laffinalltheway

Just added up my extra hours (commuting), and fares for said commute, and it appears I'm £22,950.00 worse off per year than my colleagues who are on the same grade and WFH... Just a thought!

And I should add that's on a salary of approx. £55,000 per year. Yeah, I am getting a bit resentful I'll admit!

I don't see why your solution to that is to insist everyone else spends that much on commuting as well. Do you also resent those who can walk to work and therefore have extra time and money because of it. The flip side of people saying "you chose a job where you have to be in the office, stop complaining" is "you chose a job and could presumably have looked up those commuting costs before you accepted it, stop complaining."