please read the guidance for schools....

[Ariseandsmellthetea99]

Key points:
-Since hospital grade PPE is neither obtainable (needed for medical staff) nor practical for teaching young children (scary and next to impossible to teach in) this is not recommended

• Since face coverings would need to be worn by all the children to have any effect at all (this relates to the science that a face covering only protects those around you not the person wearing), this isn't practical or recommended.
  

-They are NOT suggesting children are kept separate from all other children (as some fairly alarming photos on social media have shown).

-Children should be kept away from others who are NOT in their group bubble (the max 15 other children they WILL be mixing with). These groups should remain the same with the same adult to limit exposure for the adult.

• Any staff who are (clinically) vulnerable or live with someone vulnerable should be leading remote learning from home.
  

-Any children who are (clinically) vulnerable or who live with vulnerable should stay at home

• Parents should be socially distanced. To enable this, each bubble of 15 children should be dropped off at a different entrance or time.
  

If you disagree with these measures, please say what measure you think would be better, since children remaining home for up to 2 years is neither desirable nor healthy.

[Shesellsseashellsontheseashore]

I've read the guidance. I'm in school this week and we are preparing for phase 1 of the intake. We should be able to meet the needs for this as we are lucky with staffing and school size.
Phase 2 when the rest of the school are meant to return will he impossible for us to implement and we have the already mentioned good size school and staff.

Eating in classrooms will be a logistical nightmare. Most of our school access hot dinners. And on the odd occasion I've had to have children eat in class the clean up process is massive. But if eating is staggered and playtime is staggered and then my lunch is staggered then I'm unsure how the day will pan out.
The government need to to be clear that children returning will not be slotting back into school life and returning to getting a normal education as this will not be the case and unfortunately this is believed by some parents as I have had conversations with some friends/parents etc who have talked about the children missing school and wanting to get back to normal and they are worried they are falling behind.
We are all missing school and want it to be normal but this will not be anywhere near normal. I understand that the economy needs to attempt to recover and this needs to happen by people getting back to work and in order to do this schools need to facilitate a larger scale childminding service as we have been providing all along for keyworkers children.
We aren't being difficult, lazy, obstructive (insert appropriate word) we are genuinely worried and concerned about how this will all work and are worried about the health of our pupils and our colleagues. But we are preparing for it even though we aren't quite sure what it is and how on earth it will work.

[WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee]

Up until very recently I felt there was a very low risk to children and was mainly concerned re: staff and happy to send mine.

However yesterday I went to a talk about the newly recognised Kawasaki like illness in children that has spiked alongside the Coronavirus outbreak and felt a lot more concerned.

It is still very rare but does make my assumption that children without underlying illnesses would be safe less secure. I think on balance I would still send mine but if I was from a BAME background I would not as they are at higher risk.

On the other hand I am worried about our vulnerable children on child protection and CIN, those with SEN and PP children with less resources at home. In normal times it's a big focus for us to close the gap for these children. At present it can only be getting bigger. Some of these are entitled to come to the key worker provision and are encouraged but many have not taken it up. They get regular phone calls but that is all.

I think that what I'd really like to do is admit children part time and on the basis of need not to particular year groups ie basically expand the key worker provision

I'd also invest the time in improving our remote learning offer. I know the school has been working really hard from a standing start on this. We had no existing online platform so had to train everyone on Google classroom and rethink how the curriculum can try to be delivered in a fair way. I would not ask for any live Zoom lessons but I do think more marking, feedback and checking in could happen. However this is NOT going to happen if all SLT energy is directed at reopening for some groups.

Increasingly I think that although I was (and am) in favour of trying to reopen soon the way it is being planned is for childcare purposes and not the best thing to do for children.

[WaterOffADucksCrack]

I don't know why people are citing DBS issues wrt staffing, they're coming back really quickly at the moment! Schools, like every other sector, will do what they can with the resources they have. Obviously they can't do more than that. They can make plans in advance with the resources and space they have.

[Peapod29]

Headteachers are genuinely frightened of making the wrong call

I have so much sympathy with them. It’s easy to look at figures over a whole nation and say the risk of people dying from it is very low, which it is, and even more so for children. But the sad fact is that when the virus starts circulating again, which it will with the lifting of lock down, more will get it and some will die including children. Imagine being in a position where you know that it could be one of your pupils, and every decision you took on how to implement social distancing/hand washing in schools (near impossible) was scrutinised. Because you know it’s the heads and governors who will have the finger pointed at them if the worst happens.

[LemonPudding]

I was musing about this thread while supping my morning coffee.

What guarantee can there be that parents will keep symptomatic DCs off school?

When I was teaching it was quite common for working parents to send ill children into school so they didn't have to miss work. I can see this being an issue here.

One parent even sent a child in with a bottle of calamine lotion to put on her chicken pox spots.

There are some very selfish parents around.

[SporadicNamechange]

The steps for education outlined by the Northern Ireland executive were far more pragmatic than this cherry picking year groups. At least the idea of gradually expanding the eligibility for ‘key worker’ places to encompass the groups of parents who need the childcare explicitly acknowledges the real reason (supporting the economy) the government are so keen to get schools open. And acknowledges the practicalities of the current situation.

It does speak volumes that the official government advice insists that Y6 are (unanimously) making a key transition. That just isn’t the case for children in many areas. There are a whole range of local systems within state education in England, which mean children might be making ‘important transitions’ in, say Y2 or Y4 or Y8 (and sometimes never in Y6). Why on earth haven’t the DfE taken this into consideration - if ‘supporting transition’ is truly the reason for it? I’d imagine the rest of the guidance has been thrown together with just about as much thought and care.

As it is, it looks like the government think that the Y6 and Y1 in my family should go back to school, despite the fact that both children have mothers who are not working (one SAHM and one on maternity leave). And neither child is making any kind of transition either (beyond moving up to the next year group within their existing school). Why on earth is that a greater priority than a Y3 with two parents who are supposed to be working outside the home?

[greathat]

At what age do children become adults with regard to people thinking children spread the virus less. A year 10/12 would appear to be much more adult than young child physically. Where do we draw that line?

[TinySleepThief]

At what age do children become adults with regard to people thinking children spread the virus less.

I've wondered this. Surely a large proportion of secondary children are pretty well developed almost mini adults some much bigger than their teachers. At what point do you stop considering them children who dont apparently transmit it as much and instead people who happen to be under 18 who bear way more similarities to the adults who apparently transmit it more?

[KrakowDawn]

Below 10/above 10 seems to be the divide, from what I've seen i.e. Y6.

[ineedaholidaynow]

I have thought about this too. I wondered whether this is one of the reasons they are not planning to open Secondary schools at the moment.

Even Sweden have closed education establishments for 16 and over.

[SporadicNamechange]

Below 10/above 10 seems to be the divide, from what I've seen i.e. Y6.

Except that most Y6s are 11 at this point in the year.

[KrakowDawn]

Indeed, and the cabinet have decided that Y6s should return alongside Reception and Y1. Of great interest to conspiracy theorists I should think.

[1forsorrow]

I'm not sure how the staggered times would work. The local primary, just up the road, has 3 form entry and a pre school. So if 3 years go back plus the preschool that will be 18 groups of 15 children plus the preschool so say 20 groups of 15 children. Even with only ten minutes between start/finish times that is 20 x 10 so 200 minutes or 3 hrs 10 minutes so if the earliest group starts at 8.30 the last group would go in at 11.50, even worse letting them out if the first group goes at 3 pm the last group would go at 6.20 pm. I've got a bit of a headache so have I got that wrong?

When the whole school goes back will we have some children on the night shift?

[1forsorrow]

I've wondered this. Surely a large proportion of secondary children are pretty well developed almost mini adults some much bigger than their teachers. My 15 year old GS is 7" taller than I am and I think I'm not particularly short, I'm 5'4" and he is 5'11". He's year 10 so expected to have so time with teachers before the end of the school year.

[SporadicNamechange]

Of great interest to conspiracy theorists I should think.

I’m not sure how anyone could even begin to imagine that the current government are competent enough to pull off any resembling a conspiracy. 😆

[KrakowDawn]

I think you may have a point there sporadic

[SporadicNamechange]

In many ways it might be better if it could possibly be some kind of conspiracy. At least then we wouldn’t have to admit that the government are not able to (individually or collectively) effectively run a tap and are just scrambling around hoping to chance upon sound bites that go down well in the press with no actual plan.

[nobodyimportant]

When I was teaching it was quite common for working parents to send ill children into school so they didn't have to miss work. I can see this being an issue here.

Indeed, before schools closed but people were being told to self-isolate if they had symptoms, we had children coming who were clearly ill. One had an awful cough. I caught covid (as sure as I can be without a test) before the schools closed. Thankfully (given my weight and my age) I seem to have had a relatively mild case and recovered without medical help.

We always have sick children in school. Partly because of pressure on parents who work and partly because of pressure about attendance from the school.

[KKSlider]

I saw this on FB today, posted by a primary school headteacher about what parents can expect if 1st June goes ahead as a return date. On their FB page above this post are photographs of how the classrooms will look.

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2708468605948080&id=202673596527606

[ineedaholidaynow]

I’m assuming schools will be much stricter when it comes to illness, but bearing in mind it will be hayfever season I’m sure more children than necessary maybe sent home.

[HarveySchlumpfenburger]

On the plus side, if you can manage to enforce the the rules on sickness our hospital are using for staff, you are unlikely to ever have all 15 children in.

[Siriusmew]

@KKSlider That is heartbreaking to read!

[Hearhoovesthinkzebras]

I wonder what the contingency plans are if a teacher has to self isolate for two weeks? Does that mean their bubble stays off school or another teacher is found from somewhere? I would imagine this will be ever more likely if the tracking app is brought in and triggers alerts from people you happened to be on the bus or in the supermarket with.

[Puzzledandpissedoff]

'In April, Imperial College modelled the death rates for the virus, factoring in for the first time less serious cases which will never trouble the health service

Hang on, I'm having a logic fail here. If these less serious cases never access health services, how on earth can they assess how many of there are in order to arrive at meaningful stats?

Unless they tested the entire population - and they can't even get it right with testing those who are seriously ill - surely they'll never know how many are at home feeling a bit crap but generally getting on with things?

[Siddalee]

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras this is actually one of the few things covered In the guidance.

Think one off all off

If one person in your bubble gets symptoms, then everybody in that bubble has to stay off till the first person has been tested.
If the test is negative, the bubble can come back
If the test is positive, the bubble stays off for 14 days