To stop DD going to ex-H’s?

[TabbyTigger]

A long one so as to avoid any drip feed. Ex-h left me when I was pregnant with DD12. He’s always lived close by and we’ve always been relatively amicable - DD (and DS) previously went to ex-H’s two nights midweek and every other weekend. Never settled in court, just agreed between us. In the last year ex-H has remarried and moved in with his wife and her DD, who is in the same school year as DD. They were never friends, never really spoke to each other, but since they started living together ex-H’s DSD has been really nasty to DD, and encouraged nasty behaviour from other kids too.

DD has subsequently chosen to stop going midweek - claiming it was because she found it disruptive to have to pack her stuff to take to school, though I reckon this was only a small part of the reasoning. I have honestly done everything I can to try and make ex-H take action regardingg his DSD’s behaviours

[TabbyTigger]

Elton while I agree and am sure DSD isn’t an “evil Machiavellian genius”, I am sure that this isn’t a case of two girls not getting on, and is more of a bullying relationship. It’s been 8 months now, and for the first few I thought it was just teething problems and that DSD would shake down and get used to DD. Yet it’s got worse and DD is definitely scared to go there - DSD is much bigger than her physically (and 10 months older) and though she’s only pushed/kicked DD a few times (she has a temper and can break into screaming and kicking, but after will make up a story about DD starting it) she uses this to make physical threats. A few weeks ago she broke one of DD’s most treasured possessions on purpose (ripped the hardback cover off a signed Harry Potter book - basically gold dust to DD!) and then told DD that if she told her dad she’d hurt her. At 12, coming from a bigger girl who’s already kicked you before and got away with it, I’d say that’s a very scary and palpable threat. DD was very open minded at the beginning of the process about having a new step sister, but DS explains the situation that the DSD’s mother completely dotes on her and therefore she struggles to share limelight. Her parents also had an acrimonious divorce which probably hasn’t helped her. I think she’s just deeply insecure but is taking this out on my DD in a place that should be my DD’s home too.

Thank you for all the supportive comments! I am trying my best to make this about DD and what she wants so I’m glad that’s coming through. I am just worried that with DS he’s proved he cares so little, which DS hasn’t taken too badly because he’s a confident 18 year old who decided he didn’t like how his dad treated him, but with DD it may affect her more. I want her to maintain a relationship with her dad, but I don’t see how this can happen until he and his wife do something to sort the issues with DSD out and stop upsetting DD with their unkind conversations, which they seem unwilling to do. I’ve been trying to persuade them to sit the girls down and help them with the transition for six months now, but I just get ignored and told I’m being sensitive and dramatic. DD holds her feelings in while there because she isn’t believed but as soon as she gets home she sobs and tells me everything - and her best friend has previously told me how she cried in school about it. I don’t see how I can comfortably let her go there until something changes.

[wednesdayswench]

He believes DSD over his own DD, and that is the crux of the matter.

No, she shouldn't have to go there until he starts the realise that she is hurting.

I believe they are blaming you for feeding for feeding the flames, putting ideas in her head etc.

Just stop engaging with him until he comes around.

[Balaboosteh]

Awful situation! What I notice is how brilliantly you are supporting your DD, keeping your feelings in check and not making it all about you and EXP for example, like people often do. DD is very lucky to have someone so clear thinking and supportive at her back!

[iamafraidofvirginiawolves3cats]

What happened to blood is thicker than water? Your daughter would like to meet him in a safe place and not stay somewhere where she is anxious. Good for her. Her ‘father’ should understand that his child has a say in how/when/where she sees him and maintain a relationship with her that allows her to feel comfortable.

He isn’t going to though is he? He is a knob and not good enough to call himself her father- h3 showed this before she was born. Protect her rather than allow this inadequate man and his new family to bully her tag -team style.

[roseretro]

For your daughter’s self esteem and mental health, yanbu. I would feel like shit in your daughter’s position, snide remarks, dad taking her side and not defending me, being forced into this environment every week etc.

She’s lucky to have you looking out for her and actually caring about her feelings!

[Eltonjohnssyrup]

Okay. I'm trying to think of a way to put this diplomatically.

In most situations there is two sides and the truth somewhere in the middle. I suspect that what is happening here is not that DSD is some sort of evil Machiavellian genius and that your DD is not being as horrible as she is accused of being either. It just sounds like these are two girls who are in a very awkward situation which is not being helped by the adults involved taking sides and joining in the conflict. Both of them are probably finding it so difficult that neither of them has behaved perfectly towards the other. And that's not their fault as they are very young and neither of them asked to be in this situation.

If his relationship continues this girl and her mother are going to be a non-negotiable part of her father's life so it's probably better to approach this with your x as a problem which needs resolving jointly rather than avoiding by pretending DSD and her mother don't exist.

I think rather than saying to x that your daughter will only see her without them or not see them at all you might find it more constructive to suggest to your x that things be handled differently to give the girls more time to get used to the fact that they are going to be in each other's lives as the current arrangements are clearly not working.

Do you think he might be open to seeing DD on her own less regularly and occasionally seeing her with the stepdaughter on occasions where adults are always present and supervising? Building up to the girls spending more time together until they're feeling calm and tolerant enough to be under the same roof overnight?

It sounds like they have been thrown together and expected just to get on with it when it could have been handled much more sensitively from the get go.

[Handsfull13]

A dad is supposed to be someone you can trust and will protect you. He doesn't seem to be doing that anymore. I think if I was in your shoes I would stop her going over at the moment. Don't make it a indefinite decision but maybe word it as a break to reassess what is best for DD and if her dad is willing to support this.
If he doesn't change he ways and won't protect her in his own home then she shouldn't go there anymore. It will get easier for her to come to terms with that but it will be hard to start with.

[caringcarer]

He is throwing his children's love away to appease his new partner and her dd. Keep dd at home and keep telling her how special she is. Cut him off and maybe he will miss her.

[TabbyTigger]

MaisyPops i do agree - they never got on at school, but they never argued and still never really do in school, which is why getting school involved hasn’t really been an option. It’s just when they’re in his house or over messages that DSD is (it would appear uncharacteristically) mean.

[TabbyTigger]

I really don’t want her to go back, and I know she really doesn’t want to go back (she’s told me she’s scared and pretended to be ill to avoid going before) but she’s been talking a lot about feeling rejected so I think we’re both worried that what happened with DS will happen with her. DS said “i’m not coming unless you stop” and ex-H just said fine and they’ve texted minimally since.

And Reanimated I do wonder if his new wife has something to do with it. She was definitely the driving factor of DS cutting contact, and DD has come home crying before because they apparently say unkind things about me and my family a lot, which upsets her. She also came back from her last visit very stressed out and upset because of a few incidents with DSD, which is why part of me just wants to say no more.

[Starlight2345]

I would say she still wants to meet you but not dad so how can this be arranged . At 12 she has a right to a say .

[MaisyPops]

I wonder how much of the DSD's behaviour is encouraged and enabled by her own mum. if the mum is driving this because she's jealous and spiteful and wants no reminders of you anywhere near her new 'family'
I wondered this.
It seems odd that 2 kids who don't really talk would turn into this situation without some external influence.
I think it could be 'mother doesn't like links to old family' going on here too and to appease his new mrs, your Ex is going alomg with it for an easy life. A bit spineless but thats how it appears.

[Bambamber]

Please don't send her. I was bullied by a sibling at home, on the way to school, At school, on way home, then again at home. It went on for years as he was the golden child who could do no wrong. It fucking broke me.

Tell him he either spends time alone your daughter at a safe place, like you suggested, or the contact stops

[lalalalyra]

Don't make her go. Support her in her choices - she might go back a few times before giving up.

If he's already lost his son and can't/won't see that he's losing his daughter then he's never going to learn imo.

[Emerald92]

IMO your DD is old enough to decide what she wants to do. If she doesnt want to go, dont make her. If she does want to go, reassure her that youre only a call away if she wants to come home.

[ReanimatedSGB]

I wonder how much of the DSD's behaviour is encouraged and enabled by her own mum. if the mum is driving this because she's jealous and spiteful and wants no reminders of you anywhere near her new 'family', then I pity the DSD when she gets old enough to be percieved as a rival to her mum.

As for your poor DD: don't make her go. Reassure her that her father is being foolish and the moment and that she can choose to see him again in the future but does not have to visit his house or spend time with a girl who is so unkind to her.

[becotide]

he's a piece of shit. Your daughter deserves to have her dad on her side, and no, if I were you I wouldn't send her.

[TabbyTigger]

I think the DSD has spun a narrative of DD being jealous/insecure/attention seeking and ex-H has lapped it all in.

I’ve sent many lengthy texts and tried to arrange phone calls and meet up to discuss it, but he just doesn’t cooperate. I can’t help feeling he must know at least a little but is choosing to turn a blind eye to keep peace in his own home, at the expense of his DD This has happened already with my DS18 who no longer sees him after a series of horrible comments from him and his wife about DS’s higher education choice.

[beingsunny]

This is awful, your poor daughter.
If you can't get him to engage in conversation with you, can you consider writing to him?
Maybe spell it all out in an email with a summary at the end giving him some options.
It sounds as though he is minimising the situation which isn't fair, your daughter shouldn't have to live like this.
If he won't meet halfway and acknowledge the issues I would take the lead from your daughter.

[TabbyTigger]

Maelstop no!! He doesn’t!! That’s what’s really driving me mad. DD showed him some messages DSD had sent her but DSD had another Instagram account and turned the whole thing to claim DD was lying for attention. DSD has managed to spin the situation so it looks like this - ie she pushes or says something spiteful to DD, DD tells ex-H, DSD cries and says DD is accusing her unfairly because she’s jealous/wants attention. He believes DSD over DD so now she’s too scared to tell him when things happen

[Maelstrop]

He's being a complete wanker. Why is he refusing to see her outside of the home, knowing that his dsd is bullying his own dd? Does he not believe her?

[TabbyTigger]

It would seem not but she seems reluctant to fully commit out of fear of offending her dad. We nearly set up an arrangement a few weeks ago where she wouldn’t go round but would instead just meet up with ex-H for food/cinema trip etc, but he said he just wouldn’t show up for those and thought she was being sensitive about the whole situation. (She definitely isn’t, DSD has really affected her self confidence)

[TabbyTigger]

Posted too soon again. Technology is not cooperating today!!

WIBU to simply tell DD I don’t want her to go back for a trial period of a month, and we can review the situation then if ex-H will cooperate?

[PinkSnowAndStars]

Does she want to go?

[TabbyTigger]

I have tried to arrange to meet him and discuss it, I have been into school to talk to the teacher but the issue is that much of the bullying doesn’t happen in school - only when at ex-H’s house. At school they mostly ignore each other and DSD makes the odd snide remark. DSD is also very much a “golden child” and very manipulative - turns on the waterworks and a baby voice, even at 13. I went so far as to go in with DD earlier today when dropping her off to try and talk to ex-H about his DSD’s behaviour. He started shouting at me (in front of DD) and inappropriately bringing up irrelevant past/family events, including things DD didn’t know about and that distressed her. So I simply told him DD wouldn’t be coming any more and we both left. He hasn’t contacted me since and I haven’t tried to contact him. DD says she feels like he and his wife and daughter don’t want her and hate me, and she doesn’t like being there but doesn’t want to lose her dad. She’s very distressed, and I don’t know what to do and who should have the final say on this.