To think actually, you're up shit creek and you shouldn't be judging me?

[Cactusjelly00]

Perhaps I'm being a cunt. I'm fully prepared to be told I am.
Dh makes a good income that we can live off fairly well, but I also top it up WFH in a flexible part time position and freelancing on top of that. I make anywhere from $1050 to $3400 per week, but we could cope on just the $820 I'm paid for the secure part time position (which is only 8.5hrs a week). We're doing ok.

BIL has got the idea we're struggling, I don't know why. But he seems to think I'm unemployed too? I've tried to address it with him. It seems to boil down to, you're not in an office 9-5 so you must be making $4 a day. I'm not about to spreadsheet my earnings for him, but I have told him roughly what I make. He won't listen, that's fine. However he insists upon telling the wider family (mil who dh is almost nc with - huge backstory, and other family members) that I'm unemployed/do nothing/earn very little/we're struggling. Our little family (me ds and dh) is doing just fine. Really, we are. But what makes it all the more galling is that they're about to be up shit creek.


Backstory; BIL has a pregnant girlfriend. They live together in her grandmas house. She's due next month, will be taking the legal maximum mat leave of 3 months (not in the uk) then cashing in her annual leave and not going back. They're not eligible to claim state welfare, because he's not a citizen of this country and neither is she though they're both entitled to the right to remain.
So their only income is about to disappear, he's refusing jobs left right and centre because he doesn't want to work a shit job, a stressful job, doesn't want to do nights, doesn't want to deliver for takeaways. Etc. you get the picture. Nothing is good enough. Fine, their prerogative and he'll soon become less fussy when he needs to put food on the table for his child. But for now I leave him to it.

I'm just not happy with his assumptions about our family finances (which are doing fine) the way he speaks to us about our finances. For example we recently got given a notice to vacate which expires in 2 months (works perfectly fine we're moving anyway but landlord wants his daughter to move in) and BIL has got himself in a huge tizzy about us being blacklisted from renting (can happen here) for having a dog (we have permission to have the dog - can't be blacklisted ) and other such shit. Basically, he's always got to be saving the day so invents problems and spreads them around the family. So as it stands, here are some untrue statements.

I don't work and DH is struggling to keep us afloat (not true)

We're being evicted for having a dog (not true)

We're going to be blacklisted for having a dog/damaging the property (we broke a plant pot that came with the house, $20 replacement and the letting agents/landlord wasn't bothered as we replaced quickly!)

We're living on instant noodles (okay I do have a thing for instant noodles with cheese on and he's seen me eating them, but I promise I can cook a nutritious meal too and have other foods!) funny coming from somebody who does live on free takeaway food though...

Fully prepared to be told I'm a judgemental twat, I do think I'm being unfair in some respects perhaps but Aibu to think that, if you're in the situation he's in, you should be getting into a panic induced frenzy about your own fucked up situation before applying it to your brothers family who are doing just fine?

Getting sick of hearing 2nd hand info about how poor/stupid/naive/how much trouble we're in. Dh's elderly nana has been in contact offering him money (she's in the UK on a very small pension living in a freezing mobile home) to the tune of £1700, all of her savings, because she thinks we're struggling! We aren't, but as he's been telling everybody we are, dh's family think he's just being proud or something. Gah.

So give it to me straight please, Aibu?

[IamtheDevilsAvocado]

But ot doesn't sound as if he does know much...

He just takes normal chat... Oh we need to pass through x shop for a new plant pot'...

Then grossly exaggerates (they're being thrown out because of it) and then adds more to the misleading lies... (they've been blacklisted and they're massively struggling).

It would irritate the hell out of me..!!

Have either you or your partner actually tackled him on this?

'I'm not sure why you're doing this -
Please stop exaggerating stories and telling them to our family... It's really upsetting granny, as she now thinks we're starving.' it's just not true:.

[notangelinajolie]

Ignore. We have the same thing going on with DH's sister. I don't work either and she doesn't like that. She has the impression her dear brother is in need of her charity. When ever she comes to visit she brings him a bag of her husbands old clothes. She is always sending him links to jobs she has seen for minium wage dead end jobs. She tells their dad how she feels sorry for us because poor us are living of the breadline. It's all bollocks - he has a good job - I honestly think she is jealous.

[Cactusjelly00]

IamtheDevilsAvocado
We've tried to tackle it - by saying (paraphrased)
"Look, we're doing absolutely fine. We're making good money and pretty comfortable. I don't know why you think that we're struggling but we're not. We have struggled in the past and know what it's like and we are not living like that now."
He'll then either ignore it, argue with it (ie, you don't need to lie to me I'm family I know you're not doing too well etc) or say okay but it still goes in. It is at the point where we don't really mix with him socially.

I don't know why anyone here thinks I tell him my outgoings. Wouldn't dream of it, but I've given him an outline of my earnings because he pushed for it by saying stuff like "oh come on you can't be making much"
"You're basically unemployed"
"You must be making $100 a week at best" which is more than he's making so I just said no my income averages at xy per week which is more than I'd get doing y job in my field but I can't find x anywhere in this location (as it happens we're relocating where a new job would be possible, where my earnings will be more).
He just thinks I'm lying, or enjoys spreading lies I suppose. Or being seen as a saviour. I don't really care about his motive anymore but it is fucking irritating. More than the lies about the earnings is the idea that we're in poverty or something, ie ds's clothes are too small (not true at all, in fact I try to size up where possible as he grows really quickly, so buying things "just right" means after 12 wears it's being given to a 2nd hand shop/charity shop). We live on instant noodles, have damaged our floors, we're going to be listed on the tenant blacklist (nobody with sense will rent to someone on a blacklist) for getting a dog without landlords permission - we applied appropriately for the landlords permission and it was approved.

[Cavender]

We get on extremely well with both our families.

We also live outside the UK.

Neither of our families have the least idea of our income, outgoings or savings. They don’t know about the terms of our rental lease here or details of our own tenants in the UK.

If they asked or even alluded to any of those things they would be politely shut down.

If they spread rumours round the family we’d be having a more serious conversation with them.

Why are you dealing with this? Why isn’t your DH shutting his brother down?

[Heatherjayne1972]

I'd do the head tilt puzzled look thing and say 'wherever did you hear that from?' To whoever asked
And 'were fine thank you ' repeat repeat and repeat
No one needs to know your personal/ financial situation

Ignore the lot if them op- unless granny does send money in which case I'd return it with a note about how grateful we are but don't need it etc
Sounds like hard work

[BatteredBreadedOrSouthernFried]

Goodness there are some incredibly soft people on MN. You told him your income because he pushed for it?? How about “fuck off mate, none of your beeswax”?

[LilQueenie]

he sounds jealous and is trying to make himself feel better about his shitty situation that he clearly isn't making an effort to improve.

[Cactusjelly00]

BatteredBreadedOrSouthernFried
Yes, I'm not particularly secretive over my income anyway tbh. Wouldn't go into the ins and outs but certainly don't mind giving a ballpark, and it was to get him to stfu with the "you must be making barely $100 a week"
"You're basically unemployed" bullshit. Call me soft if you'd like, we're all different and I sometimes wish I was rough as a badgers arsehole but I'm not so... oh well 🤷🏻‍♀️

Lil, quite possibly. Just wish he'd stop... he's slowly but surely being freezed out of our lives because of this anyway. He's still carrying on to other people but I'm sure he'll find a new person to "save" soon.

[BatteredBreadedOrSouthernFried]

You don’t have to be soft or “rough as a badgers arsehole” 😂 there’s a middle ground that would prevent a known lying gossip from having your information. Either way, whether you choose to be soft or not, he only has that information because you gave it to him. Stop doing that and he won’t be able to distort it.

[applesareredandgreen]

Personally i would stop making a big deal of what you are earning and how well you are doing. As you've said you'd BIL and SIL seem to be struggling- unless you want them coming to you for help - seeing as how you are doing so well for yourselves.

[LemonysSnicket]

Well at least when he's skint he can't come asking for money as apparently you are too!
If be worried about Nan giving BIL her savings though when it comes out he's skint ...

[pandarific]

Ugh, he sounds a delight. Sounds like he has a personality disorder of some kind, it's pretty pathological behaviour tbh.

I really hate to say it, but I think you collectively need to go nc with him - or very lc at best. You need to give him absolutely no oxygen at all if at all possible - would the 'grey rock' defense work?

If it escalates, would you consider sending a group email / text to wider family members telling them how X has been behaving, and to just bear in mind when he tells them things? Do they really (REALLY?) believe him? WTF? Why? Is he like this with anyone else, or just his brother?

[HeebieJeebies456]

Would be interesting to know the psychology behind it...

In my experience, it's deliberate manipulative behaviour with an agenda behind it....and to put you ALL in a 'no win' situation - especially further down the line.

The key thing here is that he's concentrating on money....and pursuing/projecting his own narrative (struggling financially and too proud to admit it)
I bet he's keeping note of the reactions/responses from others......that you're being offered or 'given' money.

So guess what he will expect when he makes it known/drops hints that they are struggling financially now that they have a dc?.....and he will once he's confident he's got the 'upper hand'.
If anyone then refuses to offer/give the same financial help to him/them he will bleat on about being treated 'unfairly' and 'favouritism'.
I bet that he will also play the 'we're too proud to ask for help' narrative.

Currently, i guess he knows if he asks for money he'll be told to get a job?
So he will throw back in their faces that they 'offered' you money -
despite you not having 'a proper job', and your dh having a 'job' (just like sil).

He's just making sure he's got all angles covered so nobody has any choice but to bail them out financially.
He's making sure that any refusal or comments from others will be seen to be 'unreasonable'.

The best way to deal with this is to be extremely blunt with him and others.
Let it be known that he is playing manipulative games, that he's a blatant liar, that he's projecting his own issues onto your family unit so that he can then expect the 'same' treatment when he cries wolf.
Go extremely low contact with him.

If you need to, get very pissed off and snappy with others when they refuse to accept your answer - "For fuck's sake! WE are telling you that we're ok and don't need help....STOP projecting/repeating all of bil's bullshit onto US!"
"BIL is creating problems and being extremely manipulative -STOP taking his word as the gospel truth!"
Or just feed them your own narrative - "BIL is manipulating you all for X reasons".....say this to his face when he starts on you.

[Cactusjelly00]

I don't blame some of DH's family for being worried. He can be too proud to ask for help if he needs it (but really doesn't!) and BIL is extremely charming, good with words and has the gift of the gab imo so he's probably easily written his own version of events...
what you say heebie does seem to make a scary amount of sense, unfortunately.
His parents are wankers and he is pretty much NC with them, but the rest of the family are all round decent people and reasonably close when times are tough.
We are at the point of extremely LC and will soon be moving quite far, so it'll be limited online contact only. Which is fine by me! I no longer have most of my social media only mn and a couple of apps so he doesn't speak to me much anymore but does try with dh. Dh will often ignore him a few times before responding and keeps the conversation basic (ie how are you and not much else said) but I'm not sure he'll be comfortable with going completely nc at least not yet but that's his choice

[KittiKat]

What Heebies has said.

He is gearing up to others giving him money because they have offered it to you. Or better still, as you keep saying you don't need any money, he will expect you to give him handouts.

[Clutterbugsmum]

So when he says You're basically unemployed" bullshit answer him that you have told him that unlike him you actually have a job earning a good wage, and that you have noticed he keep forgetting conversations and/or getting confused and you and dh are getting worried and it seems to be getting worse and that perhaps he needs to see a doctor about in case something is wrong with him.

Then the next person who mentions BIL's lies tell them that you and DH are worried about his confusion and memory loss and have suggested he sees a doctor about.

[StaplesCorner]

Heebie used my quote "Would be interesting to know the psychology behind it..." and I think the reply is very insightful - when I read it I thought yes you are right, that is pretty much what my DH's brother and his wife did to us.

Many years ago they lost their house, they were to be re-possessed, so they moved in with DH and his mum (this was before we were were together) and chaos ensued. Long story but they ended up with the house (you knew that was coming didn't you).

So when we got together they started this narrative about us being poor, incapable "Poor Mr Staples what has he got himself into" etc. And at some times in our life we have been poor, genuinely taking 2p and 1ps to get a loaf of bread type of poor, and at other times we've been comfortable. We used to live in a flat which was fine, it was just an ordinary flat - to them this was evidence of our poverty to be used - but when we bought a large house they simply could not handle it, so they refused to visit. They didn't come to see the house for 8 years. They even went so far as to go back to the flat pretending they thought we still lived there.

Too many examples to type out here but it was an intricate web they wove, all so as to keep what they saw as the upper hand and maybe to deflect any questions about why they suddenly owned DH's mum's house ...