Driving whilst tired -WWBU

[CrimsonandViolet]

Once a month DH has to fly to a business meeting in London. He has to get up at 5am, and is home by 9pm. He usually starts work at 9am, but the day after the London meeting he has a breakfast meeting at 8am to discuss the London meeting.

On his last trip, he phoned from Heathrow to say his flight home was delayed, then it was delayed again, then his flight was being diverted to another airport and they were being bussed, and then, once he'd arrived in the other airport, they waited for an also-diverted Bristol flight to land so that the London and Bristol passengers could be bussed together. He got home at 2am, and was back up at 6am in order to make the breakfast meeting.

He looked exhausted. I suggested he should try to come home at lunchtime and work from home in the afternoon, to avoid driving home through rush hour traffic at 5.30 / 6, whilst exhausted. He could easily spend the afternoon working through e-mails from home.

His boss refused! By the time he got home he was dead on his feet.

I have two questions.

Firstly, was it a reasonable request to go home early in the circumstances, and was it reasonable for his boss to refuse?

Secondly, would driving home at 5.30pm having had 4 hours sleep (plus dozing fitfully on the bus) in the previous 36 /37 hours be regarded as dangerous driving?

[viques]

A £35 cab fare is not unreasonable. If your oh is high enough up in the food chain to be flown to London for a meeting once a month then it is nothing at all. I take it he has other travel expenses covered so could have either taken the hit or put it through under expenses after a difficult day.

[ShowOfHands]

DH is in a job where the working time directive doesn't apply and often has to stop in a layby for a sleep. A couple of years ago he did a 27hr shift (peculiar circumstances) and had to drive 45 miles home afterwards. He couldn't stop as he had to get home in time to get our dc1 to school. He fell asleep 2 miles from home and crashed. He was v lucky that the road was deserted and the only damage was a written off car. He cycles now if possible as you don't fall asleep on a bike.

[flimflaminurjams]

1. Start logging the hours he works
2. Start logging the time commuting

It sounds like he has a high pressured job, where asking for time off or postponing meetings due to flight delays etc would be seen as a sign of weakness.

There are such things as working time directive.

I think if this is a regular occurrence e.g. lots of late nights and early mornings then a work from home afternoon 1 day a week to avoid long commutes is not an unreasonable request. But he has to make the request and IME if you don't speak up, bosses either don't know or prefer to ignore such issues.

[JigglyTuff]

I don’t know anyone who works those kind of hours who wouldn’t just tell their boss they’re working from home (rather than asking). And agree that attending a meeting once a month in person when it involves such long hours is bonkers. Haven’t they heard of Skype?

[CrimsonandViolet]

Are you sure the boss knew about the 2 am home arrival - sometimes men do not articulate issues like this well and he may have just said after yesterdays travel etc

He definitely said that he got home at 2am. It has occurred to me that he might have told it as a funny story, or a rant about the plane, without specifying that he was exhausted as a result.

[Littledrummergirl]

m.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1373

www.lawdonut.co.uk/business/employment-law/working-time-hours-leave-flexible-working/working-time-regulations

I think his boss wbvu and in breach of employment law. Might be worth a phone call to ACAS.

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

flim, really? You'd do this rather than let your adult husband behave like an adult and address these issues himself? With his boss?

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

flim - sorry, I think I've misinterpreted your post. Sorry!

[LooksBetterWithAFilter]

I’m actually going to do exactly what film suggested myself. Dh having similar issues with his employer and it’s really starting to be a problem for the whole family. We are all held to ransom by the ever lengthy hours etc.
Some of the links shared here were really useful.

[CrimsonandViolet]

Thank you for all replies. The links were especially useful. We're not going to do or say anything about this, as it's over and done with and he got home safely, but we are much better prepared if it should happen again.

[grobagsforever]

@CrimsonandViolet - pls encourage him never to drive on that little sleep again. Despite previous protesters protestations that we are 'all different' - there are very few humans who are truly safe to drive on what now appears to be three hours sleep after a very long day.

Look at showofhsnds post. And listen to me. Because I know several ppl who have been killed on our roads due to driver error.

He was ok this time. Take this seriously. What he did was not ok.

And ignore the hysterical posters who say he would be fired for missing a meeting. Sounds like he works in a professional business environment- there were surely dial in options.

[grobagsforever]

Some evidence for the 'we are all different' posters. I'm not attacking you OP. I'm just shocked at attitudes on this thread.

m.huffpost.com/us/entry/9562992

[Youcanttaketheskyfromme]

If he'd had an accident driving his employee could be in serious trouble. He may wish to point this out.

My company are very good about this as we often do long hours and lots of traveling. That an they don't want the arses sued off them if someone dies.

[Katedotness1963]

It is very worrying. Years back my husband was driving from Europe to Scotland. Between one thing and another there were many delays. Finally he decided to stop at the next rest area. He fell asleep at the wheel. He was incredibly lucky (especially as the airbag failed) and only ended up with cuts and bruises.

[CrimsonandViolet]

grobags, I am taking this seriously. That's why I posted; to see who was b.u. If I had thought that he would not get to come home early, I would have encouraged him to get a taxi, rather than drive in. When he arrived home, I did not think he was fit to drive. He is strictly tee-total if he is going to drive (as am I) and he has a clean driving licence. He is not a careless person, but somehow there seemed to be a series of events here, starting with the first flight delay, which he could not extricate himself from.

[AWholeLottaRosie]

There was a train crash in 2001, ten people died. The car driver who caused the accident denied falling asleep at the wheel but it was judged that he had likely been in a sleep-deprived state (he'd been up all night chatting to a woman he'd met online) and he was given five years in prison.

[RavingRoo]

Where was the flight? My workplace isn’t sympathetic to EU / Internal UK fliers or commuters at all (some flights take about as long as some train commutes!). But there are (or should be) special measures in place for long haul (ie a flight journey over 6 hours long). At my work

[CrimsonandViolet]

It was an internal flight from Heathrow. The problem, as per my OP, was that it was delayed twice, then flown to a different airport, then they sat at the other airport waiting for a second diverted flight to land, then they were bussed to the airport he was supposed to be going to. Instead of landing at 8.30pm, the bus got them to the airport at 1.40am.

[RavingRoo]

But that could happen on the train too. I have a commute of 1hr30 each way, and 4 times last week my evening train had a 4-5 hour delay so i didn’t get home until gone midnight. Still drive home from the station at that time, and back again at 6am to do it all again! My workplace isb’t sympathetic at all as everyone has to do this.

[ArcheryAnnie]

CrimsonandViolet is there an option, ever, of a overnight sleeper train rather than a flight? Because that might be an option if this happens another time.

[CrimsonandViolet]

It wasn't a commute, though, but a flight booked by work to attend a business meeting in London. Technically he was "working" as he was on that flight as part of his working day. .

[CrimsonandViolet]

Annie, he could go down by sleeper, but he usually has an early night anyway, so the night before isn't a problem. He couldn't get the sleeper back up and still be at work by 8am.

[SonicBoomBoom]

Your DH's boss was a dick.

Had he had a bad accident, the Health and Safety executive could well have had something to say about it, and the company could be up for Corporate Manslaughter.

Because while it wasn't his employer's fault the flight was delayed, he was put in the position where that affected him by his employer. And they have a duty of care towards him, which they failed in.

You are absolutely right that this was not an acceptable response from his boss.

This would never happen at my company. Absolutely not.