£100 a month of family money on himself.

[justkeepflying]

Want to start off by saying we're not rich by any means we're comfortable in that we can afford food etc. My DH wants to buy a motorbike on finance.
He had one for many years before the DC and would like one again. I was under the impression he was going to save up and buy one. I heard him on the phone this morning saying he didn't want to pay more than £100 a month.
Now to me that's a massive amount of money. It will mean we'll be struggling a little and won't be able to afford luxuries, days out with the DC etc. To me this is selfish. Plus add on insurance, tax, bike gear, petrol etc. Still while having to run a car.

My wages pay for food, council tax and that's about it. I'm poor every month. My DH pays rent, all other bills and things. If I need money I ask and he'll give it me no problems but i suppose I'm feeling selfish in a way that I work and see nothing of my money and I don't get to treat myself to anything and I can't just go and get fiancé or a loan on something because I myself don't earn enough.

I can't remember the last time I treated myself to anything and I hate spending family money on myself.
Aibu to be annoyed about this?
I haven't approached it yet as I have a history of going off on one in the past and I don't want to do that this time.

It's 'his' money after all and it's not like we're starving hungry.
It does make me resentful though if i'm honest.

[TheDogAteMyGoatskinVellum]

Mmm, I'm a fan of the childcare is a joint expense argument, but if it's costing more than the salary of the lower paid person it's not rocket science that some people won't be able to afford that. Or will, but won't think it worthwhile.

[PrimalLass]

I think the cost benefit analysis of working should be made on basis on what is left over from the income after deducting half the childcare costs and work related expenses.

Ok, well the nursery fees for two children were more than my entire salary. So the household income was going to go down for no reason, the children would be in 8-6 childcare for no reason, and I would be back in a stressful job that I actually lost money to keep.

Thankfully my DP saw that paying out more than I was adding to the household income was a bit daft.

[WonderLime]

I'm sorry to hear that OP. That's really disappointing. Ultimately you need to do what's best for you. I think you need to look at increasing your income, independence and prospects. I think you said that you work nights to provide childcare in the day (was that you?), but if between you both you need to factor in childcare costs so you can better your career then do so. You need your own money (whether you stay together or not) to ensure you can have the future you want.

[Chloe84]

OP, strike while the iron is hot and leave this man. His word means nothing, you can do so much better.

[anxiousandpregnant]

So basically, the other day he told you what you wanted to hear and now the dust has settled he's trying alternative methods to get what he wanted in the first place. So predictable. Men like him are just full of shit.

[justkeepflying]

I don't think anything has gone in since our talk. Wants to borrow money off family now to buy a bike that needs work. He's so desperate for a bike he's not even thinking what this entails. I want to be supportive of his 'hobby' but I am so sick of hearing about it.

[Puffpaw]

Also it is often financially better overall for one person in the partnership to take the hit on the career front so the other can excel. Rather than you both struggling with commitmentsand not really succeeding or seeing your children. Marriage is about being a team after all.

[Puffpaw]

@fatdogs, I think your view regarding women's earnings may have been less black and white if you had had your own children. Being a step parent is really not the same.

[fatdogs]

@justkeepflying,I second @lakielady that a bike is a running expense especially a good one. My dp bought one second hand but in very good condition a d he still needed to spend upward on £500 getting bits done to his satisfaction. And also the proper gear is expensive. The helmet, visors and leathers. But all of that is necessary for safety ( for what that's worth on a bike). Your dp may not have factored that into the costs. I won't retract my views on bikes and it will take a lot more persuading before dp gets me on pillion. But I do see that he really enjoys his bike and so I bite my tongue and I know he is safe rider and I just hope when he rides other road users are respectful of his safety.

[fatdogs]

@puffpaw I am on the right side of 40 (coy) 😋 childless by choice but am a step parent.

[LakieLady]

Learning to drive might increase your earning potential, OP, so that should be a priority.

Is (was) he thinking of buying a brand new bike? I think that's bonkers, it will lose shedloads in depreciation in its first year. Bikes are expensive to run. They seem to need tyres, brakes etc more often than cars. Tax is generally low, but insurance may not be, especially if he fancies something fast.

As well as the bike, he will need a crash helmet (min £200 for a decent one, and cheap ones are ill-fitting, uncomfortable, noisy and probably less safe) decent boots (min £100, although DPs were £280 - birthday present from me), good waterproof jacket and trousers, with protection for elbows, shoulders, back etc (£200 and £100 min respectively, cheap ones will stop being waterproof after one winter), gloves (two pairs, one for winter and one for summer, both with CE standard protection), full thermal underwear for the winter months, and, ideally, I'd recommend a pair of neoprene socks, too. This isn't being extravagant (extravagant is Rukka bike gear, about £1,500 for trousers and jacket), but the minimum for keeping dry and safe.

I wouldn't fret too much about the danger if he's a sensible driver who is good at anticipating the behaviour of other drivers. DP has been riding bikes for over 40 years and hasn't had an accident for 37 of them (and that one wasn't his fault!). That includes 15 years of working full-time as a motor cycle courier in London, doing several hundred miles a week.Accidents aren't inevitable, and the people prone to them tend to give up biking after a while, because they don't like falling off.

But he should save up and buy secondhand initially imo.

[TinselTwins]

Will be sitting down and going through finances and hopefully setting up a joint account in the near future, I don't want to ask for money anymore and I don't think that's helping the relationship.

That's good OP

I have been wondering, since you said that you don't know how much he earns, does he know how little you earn and how much a % of that your bills take?

A joint account doesn't work for everyone, it doesn't for us even though our money is shared. What worked for us was finding the right balance of who paid what bill so that we both ended up with a similar amount left over even though our incomes are different

Good luck with the driving lessons -

[reetgood]

Glad to hear you've resolved things a bit.

We had a bumpy road but I think longer term our relationship has really improved. We know we can work together as a team to improve our lives. The shift from me/ him/ my way/ his way to us/ our way is key. Get your running costs all coming out of the joint account and work out a way that you prefer to allocate your joint contribution - a proportion of your take home works for some people.

Then -this is key - once you know the basics is covered, agree your spending money and start your wish farm eg things you want to save up for that you think are important. Working together you may find you a) save money b) work more efficiently so you reach goals more quickly.

[Puffpaw]

@fatdogs can I ask do you have children? And how old are you?
Op glad your dh is seeing g the light now he has calmed down. Keep up the pressure

[justkeepflying]

Wonderlime I think you're spot on! I am focusing on the negatives but not helping myself!
We had a chat he swears he didn't mean to put the bike first, that we can't throw everything away on this basis. He said we'll sort my driving first and he'll save up for a bike.
I stand by what I said earlier and I'm not sure if this will work but it's worth a try for the sake of our family.
I said everything to him in my previous post, he said The family is more important than a bike, he got carried away and it's not worth it to lose everything.
In return I will start to fix where I'm going wrong. Not doing what I would like to e.g. Driving on the basis I don't think we can afford it. It's a temporary expensive but will open up so many doors in terms of getting out and finding a better job.
Thank you to everyone on here today I posted as I knew mumsnet would put me on the right path.
Will be sitting down and going through finances and hopefully setting up a joint account in the near future, I don't want to ask for money anymore and I don't think that's helping the relationship.

[reetgood]

I don't think he values a motorbike more than you - I think you are projecting because you are upset. But I actually think your real problem is communication between the two of you.

Have you actually said to him, "I'm really keen to get started on driving lessons now"? I suspect you aren't actually coming second to a motorbike, but you aren't actually telling him what you want or need (sorry, correct me if I'm completely wrong). What I think you are saying is the negatives: "we can't afford it", "you never spend money on me", "I never spend any money on myself", "we were supposed to be saving for driving lessons" (without actually ever showing any real interest in saving for driving lessons), "you will resent me, so I won't say anything".

Why not introduce the idea of saving £100 per month for six months - if your finances are fine after that you can take the £600 for driving lessons and he can finance his motorbike? But be the one to make the suggestions and put ideas into place. Don't just be the voice of negativity without coming up with solutions.

THIS! So much this! You need to communicate with each other. Not assume what each other's thinking, not back out with a 'I won't have the bike then'.

You clearly have a lot to discuss, talking about money is not easy but that doesn't mean it's impossible. What I hear from you is that you're feeling you're carrying a lot of the burden of running the household. You need to tell your partner that, not in a blame way but that's how you feel. Show him the numbers, he may not have a clue what needs to be covered. You can solve this if you work together.

It wasn't easy starting to budget together for me and boyfriend. The first 6 months I couldn't really talk to him about money because he got sooooo defensive. Luckily I realised that he was just really anxious. He's also someone who will compromise because he's like that - he was the first to start thinking of 'us' rather than me and him. Gradually he trusted our system. Having a big win, eg finding money for the things he valued as well as the necessities, really helped.

You may just be done with this, but honestly from reading your posts this doesn't sound like a lost cause (of course there's only a certain amount of context that can be got). You just need to actually talk to each other about your needs, and listen.

[TheDogAteMyGoatskinVellum]

It might be better fatdogs, yes. That's a possibility. Always supposing that the childcare they would need exists and is affordable, of course. Which isn't always the case, so you simply cannot portray this as always being a choice the SAHP/main childcare provider makes. We have no info about what's available locally, what the children need, and whether the salary of the lower earner would actually cover childcare during the day (bear in mind this isn't a wealthy family, so there's no guarantee they could actually cover all bills if the working arrangements necessitated childcare).

[thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter]

This isn't a power play, we don't work and haven't for a while, just neither of us have been brave enough to take the first step to splitting up

Justkeepflying I'm sorry to read this, do you think this is the straw that broke the camel's back? You saying about your way or his way is wrong - it's not 'your' way, your way is what's best for the whole family not you wanting things for just yourself.

[fatdogs]

@thedogatemygoatskinvellum that last sentence was just my view in general. I am aware that in this scenario the OP works. And if she arranges her work schedule to fit in with childcare and so takes a bit earning wise, then maybe it would be better to make the choice to work another job and insist on splitting childcare. I never understood why childcare costs are balanced on coming out of the woman's income alone. I think the cost benefit analysis of working should be made on basis on what is left over from the income after deducting half the childcare costs and work related expenses. Of course I am also aware that this calculation may not work in the case of a lone parent.

[WonderLime]

*He's backtracking saying he won't mention the bike again etc.
Why? Why make himself miserable just to stay. We both want different things, I don't want to be reliant on him for money. I don't want to come second to a fucking motorbike. *

I don't think he values a motorbike more than you - I think you are projecting because you are upset. But I actually think your real problem is communication between the two of you.

Have you actually said to him, "I'm really keen to get started on driving lessons now"? I suspect you aren't actually coming second to a motorbike, but you aren't actually telling him what you want or need (sorry, correct me if I'm completely wrong). What I think you are saying is the negatives: "we can't afford it", "you never spend money on me", "I never spend any money on myself", "we were supposed to be saving for driving lessons" (without actually ever showing any real interest in saving for driving lessons), "you will resent me, so I won't say anything".

Why not introduce the idea of saving £100 per month for six months - if your finances are fine after that you can take the £600 for driving lessons and he can finance his motorbike? But be the one to make the suggestions and put ideas into place. Don't just be the voice of negativity without coming up with solutions.

[Ethylred]

Never mind the £100 per month, riding a motorcycle is 30 times as dangerous as driving a car. Here are the numbers.

[TheDogAteMyGoatskinVellum]

@redredredrose my dp can choose to increase his income by taking on more shifts and later shifts which have a higher rate, his company are always offering them to him. He chooses not to most of the time as he CHOOSES to prioritise his leisure time, which is absolutely his right. I don't resent him for it even though it means as a household we have less then we could have. By the same token, I earn more and choose to take on extra projects that net me circa £18000 extra outside of my salary annually. We both reap the respective rewards of our choices made from our free will. His leisure time and less stress, me more diaposable income.Just like women who give up work make the choices with their free will and so should deal with the consequences such as having less earning power and less income.

You had a semi-point until your last line, which I'm afraid is when it all went very, very wrong.

In this family, OP works nights, thus allowing her to do the childcare the family need during the day. Her work pattern saves them money on childcare, while her DHs doesn't. Thus, this needs to be factored into the equation. He should not be the only one benefitting from income he is able to earn because she has tailored her work pattern to allow it.

You don't mention whether you and your DP have children needing care. If you don't, your setup may well be fine. If you do, and your DP is looking after them while you earn extra funds, then I'm afraid morally he's owed a slice of that because he's allowing you to earn without childcare costs. Half the cost of childcare would be a good place to start. If you do pay childcare so you can work while he relaxes, by all means keep at it and enjoy your extra income, but do be clear that this would make your situation quite different from OPs.

[missanony]

He's either budgeting badly and underestimating or he earns more than you think and can therefore afford it.

I think all people in financially dependent relationships need to be properly informed about the family's income. It is a little bit silly to not be informed because there are many situations when you'd need to be able to know what's what.

[fatdogs]

@justkeepflying You said you don't want to be reliant on him for money. That's a very good idea. Would it be at all possible for you to work a day job which earns more and split child care with him? In that way you may both have money of your own. Also of you do separate would any extra money you earn be eaten up in maintaining a separate household? I wouldn't put too much stock in depending on him or any man for child maintainence.

[anxiousandpregnant]

I'd say all that to him then, you've explained it perfectly