To expect the teacher to support an upset child fully and not walk off!

[OopsDearyMe]

My DD1 has aspergers, I know that. I am fighting to get a piece of paper that also says that.
My daughter has had no real problems going to school for months, but never likes going. She starts to get upset the night before and I relialise I probably could have handled this better, I told her last night that she might be able to stay off school today, I did it because she was so upset and anxious, she barely sleeps 6 hrsa night as it is and so she would sleep, I lied (and hate myself) I told her that she would still need to get up and dressed for school and come with me.
Then at school, I asked how she felt about going in, she began to get very upset, her teacher came passed and at first went to walk straight passed us. But I called out to her and explained , her response was a half hearted , oh well we have Computing today so you'll enjoy that won't you? Then walked off!!!
Leaving me with DS who still needed dropping at his school, and a crying DD who is gripping my arm and pleading with her eyes to take her home. The only thing I could do was leave and take DS. None of her peers approached her and her only two friends were not there.

I am so upset, both at myself!!!

But could the teacher have no taken 5 minutes , her manner was so not child friendly either, so pissed off.

[londonrach]

Just glad im not a teacher now! Yabu as you her mum was with her so surely sort the situation out.

[OnTheUp13]

I was a teacher at an ASD school for nearly 10 years. We came across this kind of thing regularly. Parents wanting to drop of kids early, and they weren't keen on school. As soon as you step in you'd be left with the child, alone and very upset. All Whilst you had a huge amount of work to do before school actually started. So I can understand why the teacher didn't stop to intervene. Unless there was a plan in place that included a member of staff to help encourage a child into school we wouldn't intervene on a regular basis as it would leave us as childcare before school when it's time we need to prep and do the million other jobs we'd have to do in our own time.

[Fairenuff]

There's something about OP's account that has been niggling me. I think it's this:

whatever stuff the teacher had to do, surely an upset child should have been more important, and the class could wait a few minutes

then:

his was not at normal drop off time, this was 20 minutes before and therefore school was not actually due to start for 20 minutes, so the teacher did not have to immeadiatly attend to class of kids

It can't be both

[Allthewaves]

Ok you handled it badly - anyone who's mum has messed up those of us with sen kids have got it spectacularly wrong before. 20 mins before start of day is a bit much for teacher to intervene and take your dd - but I understand why you feel upset as you want people to help your dd but your struggling to get her diagnosed.

Would she tolerate coming in late better or would that make her more anxious?

[FoxxyFox]

I agree, it makes me sad just how nasty people can be. Just awful. Poor girl, I bet she wished she'd never asked. Shameful behaviour on here.

[LarrytheCucumber]

At my son's Junior School parents were expected to leave their children at the gate, and a Year 6 teacher wouldn't have been available to parents before school anyway.

[MidniteScribbler]

Well first of all, stop lying. Completely counterproductive.

Those last fifteen minutes before school starts are manic. I'm trying to make sure that I've got everything, run the photocopier gauntlet, deal with the half a dozen last minute emails that need to be dealt with before school, see six other teachers to arrange a team meeting for after school, check that my new grad teacher in the next room is organised, check that my student teacher is prepared and sign off her lessons.

That said, this situation cannot go on, and you need to schedule an appointment with the teacher (schedule, not just expect her to drop everything with no notice for what could be quite a long meeting). Ask the teacher how you can work together (not what they can do for you) to support your daughter.

Some things that might help are to ask the teacher to provide a visual timetable for the next day's classes so she can prepare. I have a boy in my class that needs this, and at the end of the day he makes up his own (I made a laminated sheet, and a bunch of labels, and stuck Velcro to them. He selects the right ones and puts them on his sheet and takes it home and puts it on the fridge. This way he is able to prepare himself for what is going to happen the next day.

I have another student who comes into the classroom ten minutes early. It is their job to take down the chairs, make sure the boards are clean, water the plants, etc. They are allowed to invite one other friend in with them if they choose. I want to stress that the parent supervises them in this. I just do not have ten minutes in the morning to supervise this activity, but it is something the parent and I have worked out together, and it works for the child, but it means the parent needs to put in the time to settle their child into the classroom, not drop and run.

[EineKleine]

I don't think OP's been back in a while, and I don't blame her after this roasting. OP I hope you are still reading. Some people have given quite detailed and helpful advice.

[Drearyme123]

"I'm more annoyed because this situation is made worse by her aspergers, it complicates things".

Your child does not have aspergers

[QueenieGoldstein]

Hi OP I hope I can help a bit. I'm a primary teacher and the daughter of a HF Asperger father so have first hand knowledge of how reactions can happen.

First things first, the beginning of the school day. I don't know how things are set up at your school but in my class I have a TA that is dedicated to Meet and Greet time in the mornings. That means meeting anxious or vulnerable children to ease them into the start of the day. It also provides an opportunity for parents to pass on any details such as a bad night or anxiety over a piece of homework. Due to the fact I'm with the rest of the class this means parents have longer if needed with the M&G TA. This works really well for us as we have a few children who need this in the mornings. A possible option to raise with the SENDCO.

Visual timetables are very useful no matter the age. My own DF used timetables regularly before he retired so he knew what was coming etc. Try to match these up with school and home so they look similar. Children with ASD in my class like the fact their day is clearly mapped out for them and I try to warn of any changes well in advance.

I'm sorry but you must never ever make a pie crust promise. It's so easy to do when you are frustrated or stressed but the fallout from it is horrific for all involved. Be clear on the expectations and rules surrounding going to school and why we must follow these rules then map out a routine for the morning, clear clues as to what is coming next, everything in the same order so your DD knows when it's time to leave for school so it's no surprise when she's out of the door.

I'm sure what I've said is nothing new but I do try my best for the pupils I teach with ASD as I have personal experience with my DFather.

[Userone1]

I'm sure the OP said her dd is like this every morning. I'm sure the OP said she realised she should not have handled it that way. She did it so her dd would be able to sleep that night. Sleep deprivation is a terrible thing for both OP and her dd. Sometimes people make mistakes.

The real issue seems to be that the OP feels unsupported by the school. Not the teachers fault admittedly.

[ExplodedCloud]

sash the OP' s dd is in Y6.

[misshelena]

"whatever stuff the teacher had to do, surely an upset child should have been more important, and the class could wait a few minutes?"

What?? NO.
OP, you've lost all my sympathy right there. I really do hate the mothers who think that her child is THE only one that matters. Ugh. And you were there!! So 2 adults to comfort one single child while the other 30 kids wait?? Nice.

[melj1213]

Honestly OP, why did you give your daughter the choice if you were never going to honour it and she was always going to have to go in to school? You were on to a loser there to begin with, even if your child was NT they are going to feel betrayed if you did that, even more so a child with ASD.

If you had genuinely intended to let her come home, then once she had started getting upset, gripping on to you and "begging with her eyes to go home" then you should have cut your losses and taken her home for the day and started again tomorrow without the fake choice ... the fact that you didn't accept her "choice" to go home, to the point of trying to get the teacher to take responsibility for her instead will have reinforced the fact that you lied to your daughter.

Yes your daughter's teacher could have done more to help, but she was under no obligation to do so, especially as it was not just a couple of minutes before the school day started but a good 20 minutes, when she will have been finishing her own preparations for the entire day. When I was a teacher, those last 15 minutes before the children became my responsibility was when I got any last minute work done, collected any phtocopying, check my classroom is set up correctly/everything was in the right place (the amount of things that would move around overnight because people would borrow your classroom/resources and then not return it to the right place was incredible) and just generally get organized for the day and if I was lucky I could have a quiet five minutes sitting in my empty classroom to get into the right headspace to start teaching before the invasion of noisy ittle people.

Also, she didn't know the situation, what you'd promised/agreed/arranged with your daughter so I don't blame her for not wanting to get too involved and make things worse by saying the wrong thing and sticking to " the facts" of what they would be doing in school. What exactly did you expect her to do? Stay there to be a support while you continued dealing with the issue (that you created)? Take over and deal with your daughter's meltdown because you had other priorities? Negotiate with your daughter despite having limited knowledge of the situation? I know that a lot of teachers I worked with would have done the same, as often getting more people involved makes the situation worse so they stay out unless asked, and then they still try to keep it light and not get too involved if they can't guarantee that they won't have to leave to deal with something even more important (like the legal requirement of taking the register and taking responsibility for the other 29 children in their who would otherwise be unsupervised ... and if anything happened to them, the excuse of "Well LittleOops was having a meltdown and I didn't want to just leave her for her mum to deal with once I'd got involved ... how could I know that LittleJohnny would climb a table then trip and fall off, hitting his head on the bookcase because I wasn't there and have no TA to watch them till I arrive?" is not going to cut it ...

[sashh]

Sorry I didn't make one thing clear, that I think people are missing, this was not at normal drop off time, this was 20 minutes before and therefore school was not actually due to start for 20 minutes, so the teacher did not have to immeadiatly attend to class of kids sat ready to work

You have no idea what the teacher needed to do i that 20 mins. Phone parents? Phone agency because a teacher is sick? Phone social services because little Johnny has been on the premises since 7am and appears to be in Friday's clothes?

And people keep asking, how old is your dd? A 5 year old isvery different from a 15 year old.

[Spacecadet14]

Hey OP, I just want to flag up something that might help a bit with your DD's anxiety. My DD isn't SN but we have had a nightmare getting her to school since October half-term. She's been suffering from acute anxiety because she doesn't like her new teacher and crying all the time - even waking us up in the middle of the night to say she doesn't want to go to school in the morning. I found this excellent book that's based on CBT and helps anxious children learn to cope with worrying. My DD still frets about school, but nothing like on the scale she did before. Maybe it could help your DD too? <a class="break-all" href="//www.amazon.co.uk/What-When-Worry-Much-What/dp/1591473144/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1486403886&sr=1-1&keywords=what%20to%20do%20when%20you%20worry%20too%20much&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">//www.amazon.co.uk/What-When-Worry-Much-What/dp/1591473144/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1486403886&sr=1-1&keywords=what%20to%20do%20when%20you%20worry%20too%20much&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

[SomethingBorrowed]

OP Well all make bad parenting decisions, lying to allow your DC to sleep peacefully: I can see the logic, not saying it is right, but not saying I would never do something similar myself.
Where you are BU is in expecting the teacher to handle the situation ie take care of a child who thought she had a choice of going to school or not and is told that in fact she has to go.
Also, if a child is really upset and the parent is present, the teacher might not want to interfere.

[leccybill]

OP, you have acknowledged that you are struggling and that you could have handled the situation better.

But I still think that you think the teacher was wrong. You really must see by now that the teacher did nothing wrong at all.

[Trifleorbust]

Thank goodness I'm leaving teaching altogether-it's parents like this that are the final straw.

This. Although I'm not leaving teaching. I would just tell her I was sorry but I cannot take responsibility for her DD before school starts.

[rollonthesummer]

You lied to her , got her to put on her uniform, took her to school and expected her to just go in? How confusing for any child

This!

You caused this whole drama and you think the teacher has time to sort it out for you!

Thank goodness I'm leaving teaching altogether-it's parents like this that are the final straw.

[Bahhhhhumbug]

One of my closest friends is a primary school teacher and the amount of unpaid hours she puts in is unbelievable and she regularly gets to work half an hour or more earlier because she simply has to in order to do her job properly. As if thats not bad enough she tells me how she often has to run the gauntlet of the school car park/corridors etc to avoid the obligatory opportunist parent/headteacher/teacher/classroom assistant trying to head her off with a query/form to sign/whatever. Yabvvu.

[glitterazi]

Then at school, I asked how she felt about going in, she began to get very upset

Not read all the replies, but this stands out at me. Why would you say that?
Had she been going in fuss free before you asked her how she was feeling about going in?
If so, why bring her attention back round to feeling bad and start it all up again?
I'd have thought that positively putting a spin on it would be better.

[GinAndTunic]

I have ASD, I hate lies. Please do not lie to your daughter, and apologise to her for doing it this time.

I would say "otherwise, she may never trust you".

As someone with autism, what I hate most is being lied to. Believe me, life on the spectrum is difficult enough without people lying to me because it makes their life easier. Once they do that, it's all over. I never trust that person again.

[derxa]

As a former teacher I might have said 'Come on LittleOops I'm going into class you can help with some jobs.' And taken it from there. But... I might have been dashing off to a pre-school briefing, photocopying or whatever.
You need to arrange a meeting with the teacher and discuss. Have you done this? It is very hard to get a statement now. You need to work with the school to make this difficult year better for your DD. For example reducing SATs pressure.

[tinytemper66]

As another PP suggested, perhaps taking your son to school first and then your daughter so you are able to manage and focus on her if she is upset may be a short term solution.