To ask the breeder to take the rats back?

[LuluLovesFruitcakes]

Got pet rats from a local private breeder, only wanted two, got talked into taking 4. That was fine. I've had scores of rats before, no bother.

DS is 4 and being assessed for ASD. He loves furries and the rats have - in some way - been good for him. They were advertised as being "silly tame" and handled from birth and appeared very happy and docile when we viewed.

However, he will not listen when I say not to put his fingers through the bars. Which resulted in a very bad bite this morning. Blood everywhere.
I'm under no illusions here - it was absolutely DS fault he got bit!
The biter was one of two that keep fighting - both have bitten me a few times when I've put my hand in the door to feed them, clean them, move their poop, stand their litter box up, hang toys etc.

AIBU to consider contacting the breeder and asking her to take back (at least one of) the two that keep fighting & biting?
(I wouldn't ask for my money back at all, am not remotely bothered about that.)

[OurBlanche]

Push for her to take them back. If not have a look for your local rat rescue place (almost everywhere has a small, local rat passionate group) and let them take the biters.

I have had matties since the 1980s, very few years without having 2 - 4 in the house. I have had 2 biters. Back in the 90s the vet took care of her, that being the only remedy available at that time. In about 2008 I passed my 2nd biter on to a friend who had a couple of other biters from the same breeder.

That is how rare it is to find a biter. The natural friendliness of them means even those bred in hordes, small boxes, sold on by the hundreds, are unlikely to bite!

Don't feel bad, you did nothing wrong.

[Magicpaintbrush]

That's pretty unusual for a rat to bite. I've had 10 rats over the years and only one ever bit anyone, and he had a really unusual personality. If don't feel you can trust them around your child they may be better off in a home with just adult owners.

[LuluLovesFruitcakes]

Breeder has said she will take them, she doesn't seem happy about it and is being very vague about how to arrange for me to return them...

I'm not on Facebook so I'm not too sure what I'll really do if she doesn't get back to me about returning them.

Feel awful about sending them back, and it's going to break my little boys heart, but I just can't risk keeping biters. I've kept a similar number in a similar sized cage before and have honestly never had this problem, it's not a small cage - have put its dimensions into the calculator posted above and it says it "hold up to 4 rats if the space is used wisely". So they're not cramped for space - they're just not happy for some reason :(

[OurBlanche]

If you get any argument you quote the best rodent vet I ever had "I want a pet, not a threat" Good breeders take biters back and amend their breeding lines.

A good friend recalled 2 whole litters of her much prized 'blues' because a specific buck/doe combination seemed to include biters. She refused to send any of them out to anyone she thought might breed from them, so I ended up with a cage full of posh matties for a while

We found homes for them all, I only had to keep 4. There are a lot of experienced owners who will take biters and Rat Rescue would also be my best advice if the breeder doesn't step up!

Good luck.

[Floralnomad]

Whatever you do don't give them away via Facebook or similar as they will probably end up as live food for someone's snake , hopefully the breeder will take them . We have also had lots of sets of rats and never had a biter .

[LadyDeadpool]

If the breeder won't take the boys back try placing an advert on Rat Rescue Network UK on Facebook lots of rescues and experienced owners on there willing to help. I agree with everyone else though that you unfortunately found an idiotic breeder none of mine have ever bitten and that includes rescues and pet shop stock.

[Pythonesque]

Reading this I find myself wondering if the bigger two had already been returned to the breeder once and are a little older than the chilled out pair? Good luck hope things go smoothly for you.

[Sonders]

I think any responsible breeder of any animal would take them back. If you have no luck I'd speak to a local, small rat rescue. They'll be able to give you some advice and rehoming will be easier when they're still young and cute.

[Sybis]

One of my rats bit me once.

Tbf, I shouldn't have sat on it.

Sounds like you've resolved to return 2 of them, but in case you're ever unsure about cage size in future, there's a 'cage calculator' tool here www.rattycorner.com/odds/calc.shtml

[Efferlunt]

Are you saying you kept four to a cage? That seems like too much.

[StatisticallyChallenged]

My rats never bit either, they're normally very good natured. Ime the cages sold at pet shops are often way too small for rats, they need a lot of space. I think the recommendation is around 2 cubic feet per rat. They also tend to need a lot of climbing opportunities.

[strawberrypenguin]

Even my rescue big guy who had had very little handling and therefore was never comfortable with it never bit me.

[strawberrypenguin]

I agree you should send the aggressive 2 back to the breeder - sounds like you didn't want them in the first place anyway.
Rats are usually gentle and make brilliant pets so I'd be wondering about her breeding program too

[KC225]

I thought you were thinking of sending ex back to his mother.

Have read the full thread and I am now considering a rat instead of a Guinea pig idea. They sound quite sweet.

[MoonshineJungle]

I had a rat that would bite when I cleaned his cage, the other one was docile, I was advised to remove him before cleaning as it's territorial behaviour

[LuluLovesFruitcakes]

Thank you - have messaged her your suggestion LTBforGin (fab name btw!)

Hopefully she's understanding.

Efferlunt same - I've had rats loads in the past and have never ever been bitten, and they never bit anyone else.

Ratties have been put in the kitchen for the time being bcs DS isn't allowed in the kitchen - it's still a high-traffic area so they're not in exile, just that DS can't get near them right now.

[Efferlunt]

I've had at least ten pet rats as a child and not one ever bit anyone. They are usually too tame and smart. I'd send these back.

[LTBforGin]

Two of the rats have settled in beautifully and are brilliant together, but two are not happy and seem unsettled, I think they need more space. Would I be able to return them to you without the refund? I can't keep them all together and I can't afford another cage

[PoisonousSmurf]

One thing that I liked about my breeder, is that she will take rats back at any age.

[LuluLovesFruitcakes]

Any input as to how I should word this message to her?

[LTBforGin]

Contact her and see what she says.

Don't think she'll be much help though

[LuluLovesFruitcakes]

We've had them little over a week - the biggest two constantly fight. One of them got hurt the other day. So am conscious that it may be a power struggle between those two.
Breeder says they are all between 11-12weeks old (so about 12-13 now).

I did mention to the breeder that I didn't think the cage was big enough for 4 (esp boys) but she was very certain it was. I wish more than anything I'd stuck to my guns and only got 2

I do think they are stressed. The more I watch them the more I think the breeder was not entirely responsible in how she bred, kept & sold them. But that's another thread. They are very very skittish and nervy when they shouldn't be.

I don't have the space (or funds) for a second cage to separate them. Am at a huge loss as to what to do, I can't sell the biters as that's not fair to the person who would take them on. Not entirely happy to give them back to the breeder but not sure I can keep both the biters. The other two - smaller two - are fine, mellow as fuck. It's just the big two.

[IJustLostTheGame]

That should have been Furet xl. Stupid autocorrect.

[IJustLostTheGame]

Hello, former rat keeper here.
Male ratties can get extremely hormonal and if they are fighting, not play scrapping, but drawing blood on each other and being aggressive to people it might he worth considering the neutering of the worst offender. Over hormonal bucks can get quite greasy.
If their cage is otherwise big enough (I'd recommend a size similar to a further xl for four rats), and they have hammocks, toys etc and an wide varied diet I would look at neutering.
And yes, never feed them or stick fingers through the bars. Their eyesight is so bad and they are so greedy they'll just grab with their teeth first. But it shouldn't be with aggression.

[sparechange]

Have you got a big enough cage for them?