Holiday turning into a bit of a nightmare and no idea how to save it!!

[Janus]

We are on holiday with an old friend of ours. I haven't seen him for about 7 years as he's been living abroad.
I think he's close to being depressed. He has a daughter but separated from his wife a few years ago and sees her when he comes back to uk. She is with us too and is an absolute delight, one of the happiest children ever!
But he spends his evenings drinking and becomes a very unhappy drunk who goes on about how much he misses her etc.
He has left his job and had no idea what to do so my husband has offered him a new venture to start overseas again.
He has spent the last 2 nights telling us how much he will miss her but then we said he has 2 options, stay in uk and get any job going so he can see her all the time or go overseas. He has a specialised job so not possible to get this in uk so would need to do something like a postman. He thinks this is not suitable.
So we have been going around in circles, him getting very morose, us trying to give advice. He drinks too much and then can't get up in the morning so I or my husband get her breakfast and see to her.
He now spends the day sitting on a chair and not saying much. I'm finding it very akward now, there's no conversation and I've got to the point where I don't know what to say. We have 3 more days left and then he goes home but we stay.
I'm beginning to get fed up that he's not doing anything or saying anything with his daughter or us. He started a row last night and called my husband 'smug' despite us giving him a free holiday with his daughter and trying to give some help.
How can I get this back on track and get some happy back?

[ILostItInTheEarlyNineties]

If you are fairly close, I think you could say something to him after the holiday. Having it out with him now will only result in a tense atmosphere.

Perhaps write or email after the holiday, drawing attention to his behaviour on holiday and his negligence of his daughter's needs. You can come from a place of concern for him, he is obviously using alcohol to self medicate, but it seems to be exacerbating his depression.

Whether he takes it on board is another matter. Alcoholics often wallow in self pity and blame everyone but themselves for their problems.

[trafalgargal]

I'd suggest he does something (nowhere near alcohol) one to one with his daughter

[Janus]

Thank you, a reasonable night out, back home and straight to bed like naughty children!!

[MaryMargaret]

I agree with pps, you can't fix him or solve his problems, and he may even want or 'need' to feel sorry for himself, but how lovely for his dd that she is with you and your kids.

[Janus]

Thank you, we've both agreed tha the best way is to email once home, suggesting again his 2 choices and that he makes a decision and makes the most of whichever he goes for.
I can't do this while we are on holiday as it would probably blow up and it's not fair on everyone else.
Thanks for the advice everyone.

[Caravanoflove]

It sounds like he may be depressed and obviously the alcohol doesn't help. It can be difficult to take advice, particularly if the people giving it haven't been in your position. I mentor professionally and am trained to never give advice but to help the person find their own solution. Could you get him to think about seeing a GP about his mood/drinking and perhaps try a different approach to helping with his job issue rather than forcing him into choosing between the two options you've presented?

[ImperialBlether]

It sounds like he's really lazy. His poor daughter, having him there physically but not involved with her.

I'd be inviting his daughter on holiday again but not inviting him.

[RunRabbitRunRabbit]

God, no! Don't email him laying out his life choices, as you see them, for him later. That's such a smug presumptuous paternalistic thing to do. He knows his options FFS, he is an adult.

If you absolutely must treat him like an idiot child, send him a link to the alchoholics anonymous website.

[NightWanderer]

Honestly, I wouldn't email him. As others have said he's an adult, he will need to sort himself out. I know how frustrating it can be but there's nothing you can do for him. He's most likely depressed with an alcohol problem. Just leave him be and focus on having a nice time with the kids.

[Doinmummy]

You sound lovely Op but I would stop trying to find a solution for him - it sounds as if he doesn't really want any answers to his problem but 'enjoys' moaning about it anyway .

[Hissy]

And wake him the fuck up in the morning! Why should his alcoholism mean you have to sort his dd out? Why does he get a lie in when you're doing all the work.

Read him the riot act and tell him to sort his life out.

How dare he cause rows, call dh smug etc. If I were you I'd bring the dd mother up to speed about how crap a job He's doing and how much alcohol Hes sinking

The rest of us have to remain responsie for our kids. How come he gets to offload everything to you?

[TheWindInThePillows]

I don't quite get what you mean by 'my husband has offered him a new venture overseas'. I wouldn't get involved further with this man. He does not sound reliable, or enthusiastic or like he has a handle on his drinking. You don't want to be in business with him- he'll be like that in the business and then turn around and blame you if it doesn't work out.

Honestly, I agree with the person who said stop being so paternalistic. You are trying to fix him, find him a job, listen to his woes, enough is enough. He's a grown man, and the more you act like his parents, the more he's turning on you and acting like a teenager and being rude and badly behaved!

I think I would back off, don't offer him the 'venture' again. If he wants it, he needs to sober up, get back on track and ask you to be involved. It's very unlikely he'll have the get up and go to do that which proves you really need to let him find his own way through this.

You have done nothing wrong though in offering the hand of friendship, I think you've done enough though and now need to draw a line in the sand.

[WhereYouLeftIt]

"I guess I'm angry that he says how much he misses her but when he's here and now with her he has done very little. I feed her, do her hair, put on the suncream etc and he sits there!"

I would genuinely struggle to not respond next time he says how much he misses her. Probably along the lines of 'Is that why you stay in bed and leave her care to me? And why you sit in the chair not interacting with her?' And yes it might well then kick off, but I'd rather that than have him drooping around me feeding on my sympathy like a leech. He sounds to me as if he's wallowing in self-pity rather than being depressed.

[Atenco]

He sounds like an alcoholic to me. Alcoholics always look for things to blame for their problem.

I doubt this applies, but I had a friend who was an alcoholic and I used to call him out on it, but then he would come round to my house at 6 pm blind drunk when I had the house full of kids. Fortunately he joined AA and turned his life around.

[pearlylum]

Back off OP- this is not your business. You are not a social worker.
It's not your place to be giving him " 2 choices".
I would be having a chat with your OH about the wisdom of having any future business dealings with a man who is this unstable.
Other than that it's nothing to do with you.

[StillStayingClassySanDiego]

Get the next two days done with then see him on his way.

Don't email him with your suggestions when you get back either, let him sort his life out himself, that's his choice.

[Bellyrub1980]

You sound lovely. Thank goodness his DD had you on holiday!!

To be honest, I wouldn't send an email either. Unless he came to me again, specifically asking for my advice.

And I also agree with PP who have said do not do any more business with this man until he sorts himself out. That's what all future emails should be about really. But wait for him to approach you.

You sound like a good, loyal friend. But what is he doing in this friendship anymore? What is he bringing to the table?

Unless he admits he has a drinking problem and asks for your support in breaking the habit, I would just quietly slip away from the friendship.

[OneFlewOverTheDodosNest]

I don't think I'd be able to refrain from some pointed comments about being a father involves actually looking after his child. Honestly, he gets a week to see her and it sounds like you've been the one actually parenting her the whole time.

My sympathy would be firmly with his daughter, not her self-pitying drunk of a father. I understand that it's easy to want to save someone, but if you were more removed from the situation you'd see that he's refusing to help himself and trying to blame everyone else for his situation.

[OneFlewOverTheDodosNest]

I don't think I'd be able to refrain from some pointed comments about being a father involves actually looking after his child. Honestly, he gets a week to see her and it sounds like you've been the one actually parenting her the whole time.

My sympathy would be firmly with his daughter, not her self-pitying drunk of a father. I understand that it's easy to want to save someone, but if you were more removed from the situation you'd see that he's refusing to help himself and trying to blame everyone else for his situation.

[Emeralda]

I wouldn't email him. I wouldn't get involved in any future ventures or holidays. If there wasn't a child involved, I'd probably have asked him to leave by now. Loyalty to old friends is great, but if you met him now, you probably wouldn't be friends, would you? And he's not being a great friend to you. It might be different if he was family but even then, emailing would be over-stepping. Good luck.

[Phineyj]

You can't make a difference to him but it's good to make an effort with his DD. It's important for DC to have kind adults in their lives. Doesn't matter if they're not related. Give up on fixing the adult.

[SpringerS]

My guess is that he has a drinking problem, isn't really all that interested in his daughter but every alcoholic loves a sob story so that's why he says it every evening.

I have a relative like this, he isn't a drunk (though he may be a bit too fond of prescription meds) but he loves his sob story about not being with his kids. He's always campaigning for fathers' rights or on Facebook posting about parental alienation and how awful it is that he never gets to see his kids. The thing is though that he actually has quite a lot of shared custody with his children and sees them very regularly. But when he does have them, he largely ignores them or palms them off on other family members so he can continue on whining about not seeing his kids. It's infuriating.

Some people just love their sob story regardless of their reality.

[Janus]

Thank you. I think you could be right. Perhaps it's time for him to be the go getter here. He knows the offer is there and maybe he has to say he really wants it rather than us having to chase him.

[Rachel0Greep]

I agree re not emailing.
I also agree about waking him up in the morning, good bang on door, 'rise and shine, daughter is raring to go..'.

Sounds like you are making sure that she has a lovely holiday, which is great.

[ILostItInTheEarlyNineties]

I don't think you can ignore how he's behaved on the holiday. I would have to pull him up on that and the way he's treated his daughter and walked all over you and your husband.
He probably will react defensively but some of what you say may sink in. At the moment, he seems oblivious to how self absorbed and ungrateful he is being. I couldn't let that go, even if it damaged the friendship.