In feeling my life is being controlled by my partners ex?

[Pinktartan]

Hi,

I'm seeking some words of wisdom, and getting some issues off my chest regarding my current relationship.

I have always been an independent person (early thirties, no dc), and have not had anybody to answer to for many years (travelled widely, lived in different countries etc) which is why I'm not sure if how I'm feeling is reasonable or whether I'm just being selfish?

I am now dating a guy and our relationship has reached its 1 year point so I'm starting to consider the longer term future and the possibility of marriage to this person. He has two dc who stay every other weekend and one night during the week. I have a good relationship with his dc.

What I am struggling to deal with, is (what I see as) the control his ex has over his life (and now mine). In my mind he treads on egg shells around her as he is terrified she will stop him seeing his dc.

Example- I love holidays and my passion is exploring far flung destinations, but he refuses to go away on holiday with me for any longer than a few nights as otherwise he would have to swap contact time with his dc. He refuses to ever let his parents or other family or anybody else babysit his dc in his contact time, as the ex doesn't allow it (she claims nobody else should have them in his time at all), and so we can never do anything without them, e.g. attend weddings etc during these weekends unless his dc can also attend. This is causing some resentment on my behalf as I feel we are turning down a lot of invitations, missing out on social occasions, holidays, and I feel he shouldn't allow his ex partner to dictate what he can do. He certainly has zero say in her life or her time with the dc, so I can't understand why he lets her dictate what he does.

In my view she rules his life (and now mine) as every other weekend he basically isn't allowed to go out (Friday-Monday). Obviously 99% of the time he wouldn't anyway, but I personally can't see why he can't let his parents babysit for one night, or one weekend if we wanted to go on holiday (his dc would love this, as would his parents- it is just the ex partner he is scared of upsetting). He also won't ask her to ever swap weekends in case she 'kicks off' or uses it against him in regards to courts/contact time etc.

However, his ex swaps weekends and takes holidays into his weekends at the drop of a hat. His response to her is always "yes no problem" but in private he gets incredibly annoyed over this, venting his frustrations to me (but not to her) and when I voice my opinion that I think he should tell her he needs more notice if she wants to swap weekends he gets very angry and quickly shuts me down, basically saying that I shouldn't stick my nose into where it isn't wanted and it's nothing to do with me or that I don't understand. (He's right- I don't!)

I don't think I am being unreasonable in my expectations but I am wondering if the situation I'm experiencing is to be expected when you date somebody with children as I have only dated single childless men before? I don't think he will change and stand upto her, certainly not any time soon and He doesn't appear to listen to my opinions.

Any advice?

[MrsBrent]

I don't think yabu. I think you either run or you go "ok, you can't go, I'd love you to come but I'm not missing out"
And go to the wedding/holiday/ thing you want to.

[happypoobum]

I don't think you are being unreasonable and I do think you should run.

I would not continue to date someone who "shut me down" repeatedly when I tried to have a serious conversation. Nor would I appreciate being told I shouldn't "stick my nose into where it isn't wanted." I would have left at that point tbh.

I seriously doubt that the XW never leaves the DC with anyone, so it's unreasonable for her to dictate (if it's even true) that DP can't have his parents look after them whilst you have an evening out, is his XP can't swap.

Bottom line is. he really isn't that into you. Sorry, but he has made it clear you are a peripheral figure in his life.

[TimeforaNNChange]

If you are prepared to do that then slowly you can work on a more flexible arrangement with his ex.

I think this is very poor advice. Anyone who gets involved in a relationship with someone who already has DCs should only do so if they are comfortable and accepting of the way the parent behaves from the outset.

Biting your tongue, accepting something in the "hope" that it will change, putting up with it "in the short term" is how resentments grown.
If you read the posts in the stepparenting forum, it is clear that in many, many cases, significant problems in relationships stem from the fact that a stepmum/dad didn't speak up, or tolerated silently a behaviour, dynamic or situation that they were not 100% happy with. Often, by the time it becomes a deabreaker, there are subsequent DC's in the family, which makes things more complicated and more difficult.

Do not assume that anything "can be worked on" - if you don't like it, speak up early, so that it can be addressed, and if necessary, the couple can go their separate ways.

[OutToGetYou]

Slarti I didn't say anything about weekends.

Look, I've only had relationships with men so only have a view on how those relationships work from a woman's perspective, so sue me.

[jellybeans]

I think he sounds like a good guy to put his kids first even after separation etc. Also he is sensible keeping things civil, even if at times this means things are unfair, to keep contact and avoid court/bitter battles.

[RepentAtLeisure]

I don't think you love him enough to keep the relationship going and you should jog on.

And from what she said - I don't think she's coming back by the way - do you think he loves her? I don't think I've ever told someone in my life to "not stick their nose where it isn't wanted". That's quite an aggressive way to speak to the person you love. But I think you're right, she should 'jog on'. They don't sound right for each other at all.

[Slarti]

outtogetyou

I just asked a question because it seemed like you only expect father's to have child free weekends for their new partners. I'd expect most people would have the same reaction if someone posted "women shouldn't do x" when the same applies to men.

If such a simple and reasonable question makes you tell someone to sod off then there's a good chance you need to get a grip. HTH

[Mummaaaaaah]

sorry but I think YABU. He's a dad and the DC have to come first. I say this as a parent and as a child of divorced DPs. They went through a hellish divorce and then my DF met and married my step monster mother. She did everything to put her DCs first and to DFs credit he stood up for his time with us. It was very upsetting for us in so many ways, and so I think your DP is absolutely right in protecting his time with DCs and putting them first. You need to get to grip with the fact that DCs ARE more precious and important than you, an adult. Wanting to waft around the world is one thing, but if you love this man, you have to love all of him and that includes his DC and the current set up he has in terms of his time with them. If you are prepared to do that then slowly you can work on a more flexible arrangement with his ex. She may well be worried about you and the influence you will be having over her DC. We are only seeing one side of the picture here. So YOU need to try to see the bigger picture. And if you really can't, then I don't think you love him enough to keep the relationship going and you should jog on. Sorry!

[milliemolliemou]

Sorry if x-posting but if OP is really right about the XP being able to swap her days when it occasionally suits her and DP not feeling able to - then there's a problem with the dynamic. If he's truly afraid the XP would go to court to limit his time with DCs over his requests for rearrangements, then surely he could keep a record of the times he's been adaptable to suit his XP? Consult a solicitor/CAB? It seems odd, too, that the pattern of the access doesn't seem to allow for DP and OP to take DP's children on holiday for more than a long weekend. Or that OP can't go to weddings either on her own or with DP and DCs. It needs to be sorted by talking or, OP, just walk away however sadly.

[OutToGetYou]

Slarti - it's a guy we are talking about here and a guy I have experience of. If you think it's important to be more general please do so in your own posts.

Otherwise sod off and stop being goady.

[CharlieSierra]

Before you have children, and after your children are grown, you get to do lots of things together as a couple and travel child free to far flung places if that's what floats your boat. When you have children, these things largely stop, for the duration of the time they are dependent. That's what you sign up to when you decide to reproduce. Unfortunately in a case like this, he signed up to it, but you didn't. So now you have the choice to compromise and accept his situation, which you had no part in bringing about, so it will be hard, or find a bloke with no kids who is free to enjoy his life fully with you. Which is really what you deserve. Separated parents already get a lot more 'free' time than they would ever have if they lived together. On the other hand even 'together' parents could take a day off for a wedding occasionally, so that's not an unreasonable ask. When I left ExH my kids were grown up and there is no way I would have considered dating a man with dependent children, their interest absolutely have to come first.

[Claraoswald36]

I wouldn't like exh using a babysitter when he only has the kids eow and a weeknight plus he works awY or not. He shouldn't need to he can swap contact around if he wants to go to something. Not sure he ever has either. I occasionally send the kids to sleep at a family friend who exh also knows.
I think requesting contact variables with plenty of notice is fine - I don't understand why op partner won't do it. But I mean occasionAlly - not all the time.
On the other hand he sounds like a really committed dad which is v attractive IMO but I have dc though

[headinhands]

Your dp is the problem, not her. If he's shutting you down when you talk to him move along.

[MeridianB]

FWIW, I am writing as a step mum - I'm not an ex.

I think the court case is the crucial element here. He obviously had such a bad relationship with his ex that he was forced to fight for custody. I think the experience may have stung him and make him cling to his children even more than most NRPs, understandably. He probably feels sad and bruised by the whole thing and worried sick about his children and how things will go in the future.

It just sounds as if he has a LOT on his mind and can't really commit very much time or emotion to a relationship right now.

It is unusual for a Dad to not be flexible with just one day or night, and this may change with time, but as others have said, he clearly WANTS to be with his children. His ex cannot dictate who the children spend time with during contact but she may pressure him to give her first refusal if he cannot/chooses not to be with them.

Agree that you are on different pages. Don't wait for things to change. His availability may gradually become more flexible but then you could be beset with different kinds of hassle from the ex that will drive you mad all over again.

[crs80]

I agree with the last post except I would say that although his ex can stop the children seeing their Dad if she chose to retaliate should he say anything to her then it would only be temporary as legally he has a right to see them and if it's court ordered then eventually she will have to play nice as it were & the court look very unfavourably on any parents that withhold access unless it's a very good reason; in the end going down that route solved all the problems and relieved my oh of all the stress involved in dealing with his ex 😊

[LittleLionMansMummy]

Pinktartan I agree it's frustrating and for the record I don't think the way you described him talking to you and dismissing your feelings is right either. If the relationship has legs then of course he should be taking your feelings into consideration and working with and not against you.

However, I do see why he's reluctant to rock the boat with his ex. He cannot force her to swap contact weekends, so in this sense she does hold all the cards. They live with her most of the time, so he is at her mercy. From personal past experience, when the nrp does rock the boat it results in further inflexibility and animosity that the children unwittingly get dragged into. The father has everything to lose, mostly his relationship with his children either by accident or design. The reason many children choose to no longer remain in contact with their fathers is precisely because of the acrimony caused between separated parents. When this happens children begin to feel forced to choose sides and usually the nrp will lose out. It's all very well people saying he should just stand up to her, but very often that's of no benefit because it inflames the situation further to the detriment of his relationship with his children. This is why I said there can be no 'winners' in the short term. It's a case of sticking it out if you're willing to do so, or letting him go. It would be great if separated parents could both put their own emotions to one side (remember they are separated for a reason!) and truly put the dc first. But human emotions are complicated and it rarely works out that way. It's hugely detrimental to children first and foremost and new partners are inevitably caught in the maelstrom.

[Slarti]

I don't think a guy should go into a relationship if they cannot even expect to spend a week a year just with their new partner.

Just guys?

[crs80]

Your situation is exactly like mine was 5 years ago, I felt as frustrated as you & I felt guilty because I thought I was being unreasonable but fast forward 5 years and I realise how unreasonable he was (he does now too btw), unless there are serious problems the ex can never deny access, I put my foot down about 18 months into our relationship & the ex didn't take kindly to not being able to pull all the strings so she tried denying access, as soon as she received a letter from solicitor regarding court & access etc she decided to allow it again but we decided to go to court & get access sorted that way, although it's not an overnight process we all know exactly where we stand and the ex can't make changes at her will plus it stops all her drama in our lives.

[Pinktartan]

The issue for me is not to do with his dc. I understand he has his commitment and routines in place and treasures his time with them. My concern is that he will never date do anything to upset his ex and I am worried this will become a bigger issue as our relationship progresses. I am already getting annoyed when he won't communicate his annoyances with her, or that he won't allow an occasional babysitter due to her threats, and this is my issue. That he will not stand upto her.

[Bobochic]

If your DP only has his DC every other weekend and one night during the week it doesn't seem unreasonable that your DP should spend every minute of that time with the DC.

However, your DP should probably be a bit firmer with his exW about swaps. If she gets to swap contact weekends, so should he.

[Pinktartan]

My dp has his dc for one full week each year, he hasn't actually taken them abroad but they go on day trips and local activities etc.

[Pinktartan]

Just to clarify something. I don't think he's 'spineless' because he won't 'dump his kids on somebody else' and in none of my posts have I said that. So not sure where one or two posters have that idea from?!

I do get frustrated with him bowing down to every whim of his ex, and feel that sometimes he can be a bit spineless in regards to her demands, if he can't/won't change his days or weekends for us, why can't he stand up to her when she wants to change the days or weekends at little notice? He isn't happy about her doing this either, but does anything to avoid any form of confrontation and seems scared of standing upto her. But I have suggested that unless he stands upto her now she will get used to him 'doing as he's told' something yes I agree is his issue. I feel he needs to be firmer and if he wants to change a day or weekend have the strength to ask for this (I'm talking once in a blue moon not every other week).

He is also scared of her criticising him for having anybody babysit his dc and threaten him with going back to court. Something she has ranted about before which I don't think she really meant but it is something he want to avoid and will do anything to avoid even if it's at his detriment.

Thanks for other opinions and past experiences they are very helpful.

[newname99]

In my experience this won't get better for you.It's possible it will get worse especially as you are in the honeymoon phase of a relationship.You bf isn't showing empathy or communicating in a way so that you feel you heard.

Being with a separated dad can be much more challenging (and I speak as a parent already) especially if the ex is difficult and the dad has rigidity (black & white thinking). My dh let me down terribly when I had an operation to recover from a ectopic pg as he couldn't think beyond fixed contact arrangements.

I should have left the relationship at that time but was in such turmoiI I wasn't thinking straight.It has got better as I have understood/managed the dynamics but Ive wasted much energy and suspect have had to put my life on hold to deal with it.

Had I known more or had MN advice I would have left.If you stay you are choosing a more difficult life but only you can determine if he's worth the frustration and resentment you will have either accept or suppress.

[honeyroar]

Ive been in a very similar position too. I was an independent person, had moved around. He was divorced, with a remarried ex that chopped and changed arrangements and he was too scared to stand up to her. I found it incredibly alien and frustrating, I'd never been in such an "adult" relationship with someone with responsibilities. But all along I admired him and how he put his child first. I knew he was a good dad and would be that kind of dad to our children. I guess the difference with us is that we could talk about it. I could persuade him and support him into standing up to his ex and not letting her walk over him. And in return he included me, he stood up to his ex when she said it was none of my business, saying I was his son's future step mum and was going to be part of his life, whether the ex liked it or not.. I'm not saying it was easy, especially in the early years when DSS was under 10, but it got easier as time went on. As he went to senior school he formed his own opinions, own hobbies, and could see when his mum wasn't being fair. But I always knew that DSS was going to be above me on the scale, and I always thought he should be. I wasn't far behind, but I still was. Now he's a teenager, just finished A levels and about to jet off to work abroad for a few months. Suddenly I've got my husband to myself. We've had our first ever holiday on our own. DSS is independent now, and went inter railing with his friends. And do you know what? I miss him! After all that stress and, if I'm honest, initially occasionally resentment, I love him to bits and he's my family too.

Think very carefully. Do you really want this? Can you discuss it properly without winding one another up about it?