Secondary school splitting classes by gender for certain subjects

[6timesthefun]

We had a parents meeting at the secondary school my dd will be starting in September and during the meeting the head told us that the classes are split by gender for science , English and computer studies so the curriculum can be tailored towards the groups.

My dd is not "girly" at all and I have come away imagining that she is going to be reading books about princesses and makeup. I'm sure that's not the case BUT AIBU to not see any need to split the classes for these subjects alone.

This school wasn't one of our choices so I am aware I might be thinking through this too much but it doesn't sit right.

[Celticlassie]

I think schools do (for the most part) recognise that all pupils are individuals. When I say I select based on gender, it's one factor that I use to select texts for a class. All boys' classes are not going to enjoy the same texts. All mixed sex classes aren't going to enjoy the same texts. Sometimes a 'less academic' class will do really well on a more complex text. It's an individual thing.
Personally, while I have had single sex classes on my timetable in the past, I'm not sure whether it's a good thing, especially in my subject. It's always good having a mixture of viewpoints, and having both sexes can help with that. I can see that in science and maths, where boys often dominate, it may be better for girls to be in single sex classes, but I find a lot of the high achieving girls in my school dominate regardless.

[sorenofthejnaii]

I would hope that schools recognise that there are quiet pupils who need coaxing out. There are boys who might still struggle in an all boy's class because they are just quiet and non competitive. I really hope the teachers recognise this.

[LunaLoveg00d]

The only lesson our school does this for is PE.

[Somerville]

I don't believe in gender so I can't get my head around offering different books based on the biological sex of pupils. Sounds like it will reinforce stereotypes.
And some of the books mentioned as for boys are some of my favourites. Lord of the flies. War poets. Macbeth. MACBETH!
Not for boys. For all of us.

Sorry, I know this isn't really the point of the thread, OP.

[Celticlassie]

I find that boys are more engaged with novels like Lord of the Flies. In addition, in a secondary school in a town in central Scotland, where I had a very disengaged class, the boys really enjoyed gang stories (which would in some cases reflect their own experiences) and a selection of poems relating to different sports / sportsmen. I agree with a pp that in mixed gender classes there can, at times, be a push towards literature to appeal to boys, as they tend to be more reluctant readers. Obviously there are exceptions to this, but believe it or not, we generally find that different genders enjoy different literature. (What do I know though, I only teach them? )

[BoomBoomsCousin]

You're right to be concerned. Splitting into single sex classes is a lazy way to try to tackle the sexism that seems to be ingrained in our schools.

While separating pupils to enable more targeted teaching sounds good, sex is not a determinant of one's learning style. As with many things where there is a statistical difference between the sexes on average, there is more variation within the sexes than between them. If your daughter has a learning style that is more similar to typical male learning styles she may be less well catered to in a single sex class with other girls. Splitting classes within a school should either be random or on the basis of a demonstrated leaning towards a particular pedagogic style, not just on the basis that they share a characteristic that, on average, is associated with a particular learning style.

[branofthemist]

Personally I would want to know more before I judged.

Girls are often put off by the sciences. Perhaps the reason they are doing this is to benefit the girls and get work towards changing this.

I can't say it's definitely a good thing or a bad thing at this point.

I have friends who children go to the local single sex private schools. And up until year 10 the boys school schedule is very different to the girls. They say because boys and girls learn differently. Don't know how true their theory is, but my friends really like it.

[KiteCutter]

I have to admit that my first thought was WTF but reading subsequent posts and relating it back to my own secondary schooling (4 years in an all girls school, last three in a mixed one due to a move) I can actually see the benefits.

And actually WRT differing texts in English I'm still slightly peeved that at the mixed school all the texts seemed geared to try to stimulate the boys' interest - the war poets, Macbeth, A Kestrel for a Knave, Another Bloody War (and this was 30 years ago and these are just the ones I remember). I wasn't a girly girl - I think my favourite author at the time was Stephen King but I know I was very jealous of my friend who studied Midsummers's Night Dream and would much have preferred some variation in theme (I purposely chose Jayne Eyre as my "free choice" book).

I don't recall any particular issues with maths or science and I wasn't particularly bothered being the only girl studying computing at A-level however I do know that those classes were geared very much towards the technical and programming side of things - having worked in IT for over 20 years there were many aspects of IT skills which weren't touched on at all - I've used English far more than maths or computing in that time.

I'd definitely give it a chance.

[ShtoppenDerFloppen]

From someone who has "been there" - I am as far from girly as one can get. In school, I excelled in maths and sciences (although did well in language - it was easy for me, but I didn't like it) but was always the outsider in the classes. They were very male-dominated, and I struggled to fit in. Once I changed schools after moving, I went to an all girls' school, and my confidence in the STEM subjects skyrocketed.

I know you are unsure about the setup, OP, but please give it a chance. You may be pleasantly surprised.

[Somerville]

My mind boggles at selecting suitable texts for genders celticlassie.

I really hope that isn't the reason.

[OlennasWimple]

I thought it was the dynamic of a single sex class that was beneficial, not a "tailored curriculum"

I would go back to the head to clarify what the different classes will be taught and how

[UsedToBeAPaxmanFan]

My children's secondary school does this for English and Maths, but not for science. The texts in English are the same for boys and girls, I think the idea is that boys are more reluctant to engage in discussion of the text if girls are in the class.

[mumtomaxwell]

Should add that I'm a secondary teacher and all the research I've looked at relates to secondary schools - I know fuck all about primary teaching!!

[nooka]

We moved countries partly to avoid having to send our children to single sex schools so you can perhaps guess I'm not keen on this approach (both dh and I went to single sex schools).

I'd be a bit concerned about a school that thought boys and girls were so very different, what sort of messages does that give? I mean what the fuck are 'appropriate texts for different genders'?

[TheSkiingGardener]

It depends surely. If it's to allow the diamond model mentioned above then great. If it's like a school near me (primary) who taught mainly girl groups using princesses and mainly boy groups using dinosaurs then it's a crock of shit.

[ClarkeyCat]

It must have been around longer than that - my year was split up for languages nearly 20 years ago and that wasn't exactly what you would call a "leading" school!

And I have to say, the boys definitely benefitted more from this approach than the girls did.

[mumtomaxwell]

There is a wealth of research to back this up as a sound approach to teaching and learning. I would love for both the school I teach at and the one my children attend to follow suit.

[milliemolliemou]

Something like this was trialled at a leading home counties school around 15 years ago. It was mostly done for English because the boys were so far behind thinking it soft - and they subsequently did much better. But can see it would be brilliant for girls in STEM so they didn't get overpowered. Think there should also be super-classes for both sexes who want to try national competitions/work on something together. If the teachers have any time - perhaps something to set their Teach First lot on.

[GertrudeSmellsDivine]

I taught English until 20 years ago and even back then I thought it would be better to teach certain subjects in single sex groups. Having had my own DCs go through the system in the meantime, I'm even more convinced of it.

[Celticlassie]

I know some schools sometimes do it for English so they can select appropriate texts for different genders. Obviously doesn't work for those who don't fit into gender norms, but can be useful, particularly for difficult to motivate boys' classes.

[BackforGood]

I think it sounds like an excellent plan - kind of best of both worlds - social time all mixed, but specific lessons taught in single sex groups. Seems to sit with what the researchers have shown to produce the best results.

[PurpleAlerts]

My DD went to an Independent school that did this from years 7-11 (then mixing in the VI form). They had girls and boys forms and all lessons were taught in this way except for a few subjects at GCSE where there were not enough pupils for two classes.

They had the advantage of socialising at break and lunch times but were taught totally separately. There is a lot of research that supports this so called " diamond model" of co-education.

It worked really well, especially for the teenage years where hormones are raging.

[carrie74]

I know of a school that adopts the Diamond Edge model which sounds similar to this. Separation for core subjects Y7-9, to be able to adapt methodology to gender (eg shorter, more frequent lessons for the boys as they tend to lose concentration quicker).

[springwaters]

Is it a faith school?

[Shizzlestix]

Girls should be encouraged to choose STEM (Science, Tech, Engineering, Maths) and this is one way of doing it and it helps to remove the gender stereotype that it's just for boys. When I did single sex splits, the boys' results dramatically improved. I'd do all the time it if I could whilst maintaining mixed sex groups for some subjects and for social time.