WWYD - being excluded

[Noisytraffic]

My DP is British born but his family are Asian. All but the Grandmother speak very good or fluent English.

When they are talking to each other or DP, they speak in their language, which excludes me from the conversation. I've repeatedly been upset and cried to DP so he now replies to them in English to remind them to speak it too. It works with some of them, but not all. One family member is a particular problem (the one who is 100% fluent in English, ironically).

I let it pass when I am in their house, but when they visit us, AIBU to be very offended and hurt at being excluded in my own home?

Unfortunately, it is not a language that can be learnt easily, so that is not an option. They speak a dialect of a tonal language so there are no classes etc for me to do. DP teaches me odd bits, but in 5 years, I've picked up about 10 words because it is so difficult. I'm a natural linguist, speaking 3 European ones fairly well, but this one is just beyond me.

I'm also worried about when we have children as I don't want them growing up thinking that it is acceptable to exclude people. I've already told DP that I will insist they speak English when I am there when that day comes. They will speak the 2nd language with their family when I am not around.

Any advice? WWYD?

[Mistigri]

I don't think this is an enormous problem tbh, all it takes is an small amount of consideration on each side.

The OP has to get used to being left out of conversations if she wants a bilingual child.

You can't raise a bilingual child in an English speaking environment; you'll have to do one-person-one-language which means that everything your DH says to your child will need to be in his native language and you'll want relatives to use that language with him/ her too (or the child will likely grow up understanding the language, but not speaking it so fluently). This is all the more true if it's a tonal language that will require significant exposure while the child is still very young.

OTOH, basic politeness dictates that there are some occasions where foreign language speakers need to be considerate, and meals in other people's houses is one of them.

[Rainbunny]

Cote - OP stated in her Original Post the following: "They speak a dialect of a tonal language so there are no classes etc for me to do. DP teaches me odd bits, but in 5 years, I've picked up about 10 words because it is so difficult."

So she can't easily find a language program in the way she could for a European language and writing as someone who lived in South East Asia for several years (and I'm also fairly fluent in French and German,) tonal languages are challenging in a very different way.

[BitOutOfPractice]

Nobody is getting aggressive Cote. But it dimply isn't as straightforward as saying "oh just crack on and learn the language" is it? If only it were that easy.

[CoteDAzur]

Feel free to do so. I'm not the one getting aggressive and saying you can't have your own opinions.

[AMouseLivedinaWindMill]

Because she says she is a 'natural linguist'

Yes Cote, so she has an excellent amazing idea of her own skills at learning a language. If she says this one is beyond her I kinda believe her.

[riverboat1]

Given that you speak other languages but have found no effective way to learn this one, I think you are at an impasse.

His family are being rude to not even at least attempt to translate bits of their conversation for you when in your own home. More so as they don't want you to learn it yourself, they just expect you to sit there and be fine understanding nothing.

I'd just leave the room or go on my phone when they started long conversations. No way could I sit there politely understanding nothing. I would also explain to them why I was leaving the room. I would also so what I could to reduce their visits.

I say this as someone who has learned the (European) language of my DP and his family. I remember all too well though how it feels to sit in the midst of people having a great time talking when you understand nothing. It is soul destroying. I couldn't cope long term. Equally, as an ESL teacher myself, I know that learning an 'easy' language such as English is hard enough for many people. Learning a dialect of a tonal language with no materials or teacher - I can well believe it isn't realistically achievable.

[Atenco]

It would be such a perfect situation for you to learn the language if only you could find someone decent to teach you, otherwise I do think it would be hell to also have your dcs speaking it.

I think if no-one will help you with the language you should refuse to allow your dcs to learn it.

I heard a programme about teaching Chinese (another tonal language) through singing.

[troubleinstore]

My DM 'suffered' this by the SIL's for years and years on family get togethers. She just used to sit listening to them telling stories and sometimes talking about her.

They thought she couldn't understand a word she was saying. DM was very clever - over the years she picked up quite a few words in fact almost everything! One particular day she was listening to them criticising her outfit and saying she was too fat etc etc (this was all out of earshot of the men in the other room) and she stood up and answered them back in English. Followed by repeating to some of bitching they were saying about each other behind their own backs! The looks on their faces were a picture! She then got up and asked to go home.

Nobody has ever spoken out of turn since - at her funeral they all turned up and I revelled in telling them all how fantastic she was for understanding the language for years and years and how she used to relay stories they told to us when we got home.

My thing is -pick up a few words even a sentence or two - 'Hallo, nice to see you' or something similar - let them know you are trying but please don't back down on making them speak how you want to in your own house.

If they don't - just pick up your plate and eat elsewhere - your DH should back you up. It's rude and ignorant.

Good luck!

[CoteDAzur]

Because she says she is a 'natural linguist'.

She sounds discouraged and maybe low on morale on this issue. I would imagine that is why she feels progress is impossible.

[AMouseLivedinaWindMill]

cote if op says its impossible for HER why cant you accept that?

[AMouseLivedinaWindMill]

DP said that previous girlfriends have split up with him because of the problem family member making them feel so uncomfortable and unwelcome.

Really.



Isnt it time your DH stopped their bloody visits - several times a week I am amazed you have lasted as long as you have.

Very very rude and only people who like control are happy when someone is excluded, I have seen the sly smug face on Mils face when DH family get carried away in her language leaving me out.

Op - once a month visits - suck it up, say its rude...tell them its not done, stress this to your dp, but weekly visits?????

No fucking way. No fucking way, say - enough.

[CoteDAzur]

"Only on MN would the OP be told to learn the language she has already said is very difficult to learn"

Not only on MN, at all. Do you know many multicultural marriages where at least one has a difficult language?

You either learn the language to at least a basic level or you don't let it bother you when it's spoken around you & do your own thing. Forcing everyone to speak your language when the family is together is never an option because it is unreasonable (especially when older people with limited language skills are involved) and it can't be sustained for more than a few minutes. People revert to the language they are used to speaking to each other in, especially when this is their native tongue which they don't get to speak with others.

It's not even just family dinners. Your DC start talking in this foreign language with your DH, and you don't understand a thing they are talking about. It's not fun.

OP says that she is a 'natural linguist' who speaks three European languages, so if she puts her mind to it, there is no reason why should not be able to learn it. I know people who have learned Japanese, Korean, and Turkish because their wives/husbands are from these countries. It really isn't impossible.

[biggles50]

How uncomfortable for you. You say you speak three European languages well, so speak to them in another language they don't understand when they're in your home.

[BitOutOfPractice]

Erm MistressDeeCee you didn't say "non-British heritage" because I C&Ped what you said. You said "Yet you married a non-British man" so you can actually off!

Nobody is saying English is superior. At all. You do a lot of deciding you know what the OP means better than she does don't you? She is quite clearly not the imperialist English supremecist that you have decided she is.

[tomatodizzy]

my efforts have been laughed at this bit concerns me a little. I suggest you chat with your DH about this, it can be very harmful. When I first started learning DH's language he teased me when I made mistakes. One day, the straw broke the camels back and I repeated all the English mistakes he makes or had made in the past childish I know but he stood there like a puppy that had been caught with a chewed toilet roll. I told him I was trying, if he wanted to make it work then I needed his support not his ridicule. So either you can be part of his family and be encouraged to learn their language or you are an outside. Ask him which one he wants?

[Cutecat78]

Only on MN would the OP be told to learn the language she has already said is very difficult to learn and we don't even know what it is (she clearly does not want to say as it may out her).

Only on MN

[Ploy]

Hi noisy,
It sounds to me like there are one or two manipulative members of the family who are using language as a tool to get at you.
I think you need to have a close look at their behaviour and name it for what it is. Unfortunately your dp is not being very supportive in this process.
Good luck with your ongoing relationship.

Mixed relationships often have extra challenges, and being able to communicate with each other honestly about stuff when it comes up is crucial. If he doesn't take your feelings seriously, you are not going to be happy.

[Sunnybitch]

Don't know if this has been said but get him to repeat everything they say word for word to you in English! In the end he will get so fed up with doing this that he will demand that they speak English

[Noisytraffic]

for you Thisaintaholiday. We considered moving for me to be immersed in the language but sadly a significant change in family circumstances made it unworkable and I can't be that far from my parents.

Thanks for super advice from so many of you. I really appreciate it.

[Noisytraffic]

Mistress Deecee - if you had read all of my posts, you will have noted that my DP and I both agree that we want our children to be bilingual. They will speak English when with me and the 2nd language when with DP's family. Additionally, with accurate reading, you will have noted me saying that I have no issue with them speaking my mother tongue in THEIR home. I merely wish to be included in conversation in MY home. Thirdly, I have repeatedly stated that I have tried EXTENSIVELY to learn the language but my efforts have been laughed at.

[MistressDeeCee]

BitOutOPractice I said non-British heritage actually.

I wouldn't dream of going into anyone's home and keep reminding them to speak English, because they are in their home speaking their heritage language. Id be interested, and Id learn the language, at least as much of it as I could. Not dismiss it as "too hard to learn".

In this the DH has said he won't bring his DCs up as bi-lingual, OP hasn't bothered to learn the language anyway, so it'll be an English speaking household. Problem solved...do what you like in your own home, when in others you have to suck it up really, or ask whats being said. Better that than crying to your DH away from the situation surely, or complaining that your DCs won't be bilingual when you're not even interested in learning the language yourself added to that if they do learn from their relatives they won't be allowed to speak it at home anyway because their mother doesn't. Add to that a situation of DH only being able allowed to speak his language with his family when not in his wife's presence, which is exactly what would happen. Ridiculous.

There are quite a few people who appear to think English is the most important language in the world, choosing to make a different language and heritage a "thing" instead of at least trying to learn and have fun with learning too, when it would make life a bit nicer. As it is, the superiority gene just has to come to the fore so rather than try to resolve its blown up into a big drama with the goal being to get everyone to speak THEIR language because they couldn't possibly lower themselves to learn the other language.

Still it does give me a laugh back home i(n a very small village) where English speakers will come into shop and speak English to me very-loudly-and-slowly-because-that-means-I-will-definitely-understand-all-they-are-saying. Which, of course, I would even if they spoke at speed and not as if I am a mile away from them. As I bothered to learn English even though I grew up more there, than here.

[BitOutOfPractice]

Yet you married a non-British man - she didn't. He's British. You sound very judgey mistressDeeDee

Anyway, I had this with my exDP (who speaks fluent English) and his parents (who speak very little English). The difference being that exDP would stop to translate, or ask if I minded if he switched to their language for a bit to explain something and his parents constantly apologised for their poor English (they were LOVELY) so it felt like an entirely different experience because I knew they were trying their best and not being nasty. So I never felt left out. Plus, I did understand about 20% of it - that helps immensely.

I'm not sure what you can do except continually remind them. Or maybe speak to them exclusively in one of your other languages and when they look puzzled say "now you know how I feel!"

[redexpat]

YANBU. They are excluding you and your DP really does need to step up and spell it out to them. Otherwisethis is how the rest of your life will be. Are you prepared to be treated like this indefinatly?