To think DH is wrong to threaten to not speak to DS over university choice

[DPSN]

DS has an offer to study at Cambridge but is considering turning it down to study closer to home at a university with a reputation for his subject which is nowhere near as good as Cambridge's to be near his girlfriend. I think basing a life choice on a current GF is a mistake but he is very stubborn and I cannot force him to go to Cambridge. If she is the love of his life, love will conquer time and distance but if she isn't,I think he will regret turning down Cambridge for her.
I have asked him to weigh up the pros and cons of each option carefully.
DH , on the other hand, has said he will not want to speak to him again if he doesn't go to Cambridge and would want to limit financial support.
I feel I am living in a parallel world with DH thinking he can control DS' s choices with threats and bullying tactics. He says I am too soft for saying ultimately it is DS' s life and choice.
Opinions please.

[funnyperson]

Yes there are rubbish universities and they all have wonderful websites.

I went to a fantastic university with brilliant teachers (not Oxford or Cambridge but the best for my subject in those days) ) and still marvel at the lack of knowledge of others who didnt. Why pay the same money for something not as good? Its a bit like if you were chosen for the A team why would you want to be in the B team? Because GF was in the B team?

That said, success isnt easy. I still remember feeling awful when I passed exams and friends didn't (guilty would you believe) and I still remember the cattiness of other mothers when DD got into Oxford (loud comments about social climbers and pushy mothers etc etc no aknowledgment that she got in because she deserved to) and I still remember other work colleagues when we were juniors, who didnt go to a university as good as mine, spending hours justifying why their university was just as good (it wasnt) and how only really psychotic antisocial people with Aspergers went to the best universities etc etc etc. Those who dont succeed are very good at justifying the inferior option. I've given in at least twice in my life (on job offers) and chose the inferior option only to realise afterwards how stupid I was and how lucky one is to have the superior option.

I've only in my late middle age realised how rare a talent it is to be bright, that not everyone is lucky enough to pass exams or get offers from the best places and therefore it is actually really important to be ones best self, and not choose the lowest common denominator.

[MrsGuyOfGisbo]

Agree it is not and Oxbridge issue, but a serious uni/rubbish uni issue.
We have a local uni which is dire - I know because I wasted spent £9k recently there for a PGCE that was not fit for purpose - luckily settled out for court with them over their extortion it.
The DC are aware of this and would not apply there. If they did, citing the need to be near their significant other we would absolutely not fund it. They could choose to go but would need to sort funding. As parents we should be giving a wider view. Of course they can ignore it - they are also adults - and we will still love them...but they need to work out how/if it is worth it themselves.

[mathanxiety]

JCLNE I think you are wrong about universities being six of one and half a dozen of the other. You foreclose a raft of other choices by turning down Cambridge and going somewhere else. Your choice of university at 18 is incredibly important, if you have the luxury of choice. Only someone really immature (or with issues along the lines of what Molio mentioned) would turn a deaf ear to his parents and choose based on luv.

The problem will solve itself after half a term or so when he will want to end the relationship himself as his eyes are opened to his new life.
Unless the GF falls pregnant. I can't believe I am suggesting that a clingy young woman might do her utmost to hang onto her BF but you read it here folks.

If the OP moves house then 'home' may well be the GF's house, especially if there are other friends home from university in the same area when he visits.

[Headofthehive55]

imustgodown he might have thought about it, clearly it wasn't a straightforward decision. I don't think you would necessarily take the job in a Michelin starred place, above a gastropub...it depends on other factors. Life is often about compromise.

[TheTigerIsOut]

Not to be a smug c@nt either, but I almost spilt my coffee at the "Newton kind of invented the subject" comment too.

[DadDadDad]

Thanks for the foul abuse.

I was a Cambridge mathmo and I also made the point about the world class reputation for the subject earlier in this thread. But, saying Newton invented the subject is not just poor phrasing, it's totally inaccurate.

[Imustgodowntotheseaagain]

JCLNE but it's a choice not between two things of equal standing, but between somewhere regarded as the best place in the world for that specific subject, and somewhere else.

If you wanted to be a chef, and had an offer to work in a top-starred michelin restaurant, or a solid local gastropub, wouldn't you think carefully before turning down the former?

daddadadad, don't be a smug cunt. OPs son has a chance to study at the same university as some of the greatest mathematicians in world history without a time machine or the need to learn Arabic. Clearly I phrased my point poorly.

[JCLNE]

Am I the only one who thinks neither the university you go to, nor the girl you date when you're 18 matter much in the long term?

Of course you can screw up your life royally at that age...but not by choosing one university over another. It's not like he's going to join a criminal gang or a cult or father six children and go on benefits. He's not about to ruin his life, he's just making different choices vs what his parents would choose in his shoes. But that's what adults do, and he's an adult.

Maybe he won't end up with this girl, maybe he will, so what. Some people value family and relationships over professional ambitions, whether or not they last a lifetime or a few years. Maybe he's one of those people. Maybe he'll change his mind later on and make different choices in the future. Who knows. Life is long and what you do at 18 is rarely as important as your parents would like you to believe (well-meaningly, no doubt) at that age.

[DadDadDad]

Newton kind of invented the subject - gosh, what were all those Babylonians, Greeks, Arabs, Indians doing in those millennia before the seventeenth century, not to mention the rest of renaissance Europe...

[Imustgodowntotheseaagain]

If you love maths you should think very hard about turning down a Cambridge offer. It's the university where Isaac Newton kind of invented the subject with his Principia Mathematica. Cambridge 'mathmos' love, eat and drink maths. It's nothing about 'snob value,' it's simply one of the best places in the world for that subject.

[Headofthehive55]

pan I think you are right in saying that's often the path, but not always. I did not keep in touch with a single person from uni apart from my DH!

[Headofthehive55]

I think ot is really good to talk and often you do get a sense of whether it's really what they want or are they scared for other reasons. And you can offer solutions like a car if they are worried re travel. Barriers that seem huge at 18 by 21 seem trivial.
But I do agree that loving someone means allowing them to have opportunities that are good for them. I also wonder if the gf said things like well if it all goes pear shaped, we can live together and that can be misconstrued quite easily.

[PanGalaticGargleBlaster]

Your DH is handling the situation very badly. But I agree with his view.

Quite frankly your son would be utterly mad to turn down a place at Cambridge, one of the best universities on the planet. The benefits of going to such an institution continue throughout your life, it really can be that much of a game changer in terms of opportunities and career trajectory, one that most students would give their right arm for.

All the people I knew at university who were in relationships when they started their course broke up with their partners within the first academic year. Alarm bells were also ringing when you describe the GF as ‘clingy’. University is an incredible chapter in your life, he is going to meet a raft of new interesting people, people with different ideas, different backgrounds, different nationalities and personalities, his new uni peer group will probably go on to form the backbone of his social circle for decades to come. It would be tragic if the clingy GF would be trying to steer him away from this.

Personally I would encourage him greatly to go to Cambridge and tell him he can see his GF at weekends or she can travel to see him. The problem will solve itself after half a term or so when he will want to end the relationship himself as his eyes are opened to his new life. It is inevitable that amongst his new friends he is going to meet some interesting women and some point some of those women are going to be interested in him. The chore of having to trek home at weekends and miss all the parties and fun will soon take their toll and he will soon start to question the merits of staying in an increasingly boring relationship. Equally it was not uncommon at uni for the boyfriends and girlfriends ‘back home’ to get jealous, resentful or feel like they are being left behind as their DPs life takes a very different, exciting path to their own. It is very hard to make it work.

The last place your son needs to find himself is stuck at a second rate uni and single anyway having turned down a place at Cambridge.

[Molio]

In this situation I'd ask first about being worried about STEP and the pressure to get sky high grades, whether if that pressure was taken away does he actually still like the idea of Cambridge or does he now feel he doesn't want three years at that pace. If I got a sense that he did still want to go, I'd advise him strongly to accept the offer and just try his best re grades/ Step and say all the stuff about gf visiting/ love conquering all etc etc (not that I have great faith in the latter). I'd probably stop short at airing my views about the gf but the rest of the siblings and I talk quite freely, so I'm sure we'd all say to each other what we thought.

Essentially I'd speak fairly frankly but with some necessary editing around the subject of gf's dodgy attitude.

No idea what I'd do if he decided to give up the place anyhow but my attitude would be determined solely by what I felt was his genuine wish re. Cambridge itself, taking gf out of the equation, because to me that would be the key thing.

[Floisme]

How do you think you could stop them?

[Molio]

I'm criticizing someone else's DC's gf Floisme. I'm not sure what I'd actually do, if anything, if someone like that hooked up with one of mine. I don't think I'd sit by idly and let mine make a really daft mistake if it was possible to guide them in a better direction, in the name of 'support'.

[Floisme]

Whatever you may think of them, criticising your children's girl/boyfriends never ends well.

I'd have thought we'd know that on here of all places

[Molio]

Hoth that's not her vice or even a particular vice. Her vice is putting pressure on the DS to stay near her mum too, giving up a great life opportunity. That's a very big negative and bodes extremely ill for the future. In my opinion the comments directed at that self-absorbed outlook are richly deserved. If she were a bf and slightly older she'd be castigated as being seriously controlling.

[mathanxiety]

I am with your DH on this one, at heart, though I would exhaust all other options before the nuclear one. Where you study makes a huge difference to your prospects. You get one chance to set yourself up for life.

I agree if she had half a brain she would be ordering him to Cambridge. If she loved him she would want the best for him.

Please tell your DS to always, always, always use a condom.

[hellsbells99]

Molio - my DH lives in the city he was born in and he is not as dull as ditchwater!
Op's DS should be allowed to make his own decisions but obviously with input from his parents. He needs to look at the course content etc, look to see if he thinks Cambridge will suit him - if not, then of course he should look at his other choices. As a Cambridge applicant, I am sure his other 4 choices are all good universities. As previous posters have said he may feel that the Step exams are too much. And yes, it needs to be pointed out to him that his love life is probably not the best reason to base his decision on as he will be home for more than half the year. But Op has said they will also be moving away so where will home be? Perhaps the fact that he won't be coming back to his current home town during holidays etc is also influencing his decision.

[boys3]

infatuated teenagers and decision making - never a great combination.

I do think it is the role of parents to provide construction challenge and alternatives that could be considered (although the father's initial reaction was hardly constructive)). Some may believe that learning from one's mistakes is always right. I'd say that some mistakes are best avoided if at all possible.

I'm not sure the GF deserves all of the opprobium being heaped on her. We've only had one side of the story, and that is all we will ever get on this one. I struggle to see how some of the frankly quite unpleasant comments add anything of value to the thread.

[Headofthehive55]

Oh I'm sure he could find a worse gf than that! Her only vice seems to be she has no interest in leaving her city.

He could find one that is very worldly wise and introduce him to all sorts of illegal recreational pursuits.

[Molio]

It's realistic OWTD. She sounds as dull as ditchwater and deeply oppressive. Any change of gf is likely to be an improvement on one who insists the bf stays near her mum, at significant cost to himself.

[DadDadDad]

"Brainwashed" is a loaded term - I'd say most children are pretty much "brainwashed" by their parents purely due to the fact that they live with them for 18 formative years!

But a good parent will hopefully encourage their child to think for themselves and make their own decisions, but I don't think that stops a parent giving a strong opinion when the decision is life-changing and they sincerely feel that the child they love may come to regret it.

[Headofthehive55]

outwiththedogs I'm with you. What a horrid thing to think- to trade up! No doubt those views are shared by those graduates mentioned a page or so ago who thought people who were not Oxbridge were not worth talking to!

There is a lot more to life and people than where or if you went to uni.