To think taxpayers shouldn't pay for people to learn English?

[angelos02]

£20 million to be spent on this. If you move to a country you ensure you can speak the language surely? It is being spent on female muslims not that I think this is relevant.

[LongWayRound]

Many of the recent immigrants to Germany are from Morocco and Algeria. They aren't fleeing a war. More likely, they are being conned by people traffickers into believing that once they get to Germany they can easily find work and a high standard of living.

[PaulAnkaTheDog]

Schwab that was my problem with the post. Frankfurt sounds like she was just waiting for problems and is almost revelling in them.

[Schwabischeweihnachtskanne]

Frankfurt we're in Germany too - integration courses are free for people who qualify for Arbeitslosengeld II (the old Hertz IV) and some others - most people on low to no income get it free. There are free language lessons in the reception centres and free courses on German law by lawyers using interpreters have started recently in some of the Munich reception centres partly because of concerns about attitudes to women - both asylum seeker women and local women (but not the specific centres for asylum applicants with a low chance of being allowed to stay in the country).

We have 600 asylum seekers in our small town and, whilst there have been problems they have mainly been inside the refuge homes, and nobody has stopped walking the streets in the dark or anything.

Obviously there have been problems in Germany - the Koln attacks on NYE for example. Equally obviously anyone breaking the law should have their asylum application rejected and be deported. Your posts sound a bit unhinged though, when you complain about people "wearing leather jackets, laughing and talking on mobile phones" .


The question of whether it is good to give people who are staying free language and culture lessons is not the same as the question of whether to let people in in the first place!

[evilcherub]

Totally agree Frankfurt. Europe is being changed beyond recognition. We seem to be going back towards medieval times. The Suffragettes must be rolling in their graves!

[tobysmum77]

I think the thing that puts my hackles up immediately is when people start spouting on about 'the taxpayer' and 'the public purse'.

Nothing in life is either all good or all bad, including immigration. People who identify negatives are branded as racist (which undoubtedly some are, but others will be taking a more balanced view) and those who push that the more people we have in the uk the better somehow see themselves as a higher life form, on mn anyway.

But 20m for English language classes isnt something that many people will be losing much sleep over is my opinion. People are far more worried about housing and wage levels.

[Frankfurt7753]

Of course they are 'refugees fleeing a war', yes they're all young men, wearing leather jackets and talking on their mobile phones, laughing, smoking and drinking cans outside the place my husband works and hanging around in groups intimidating women, you don't have to 'buy' my personal experience you'll have it yourself soon. Good luck!

[PaulAnkaTheDog]

Frankfurt your experiences might have been useful if your words weren't seething with hatred. You talk like someone who awaited problems and proudly shouts about them when there were a couple. I'm sorry, I don't buy your personal experience.

[IPityThePontipines]

How is it "nasty" to want people to be able to learn a valuable skill?

What a peculiar choice of word.

I'm a UK taxpayer too, believe me, there far more pointless things the government wastes my money on.

Also, they aren't immigrants, being housed near you, they are refugees fleeing a war.

[Frankfurt7753]

No actually, I'm a mum of a 3 year old boy who has seen the town my husband moved to for his job here in Germany change beyond all recognition when they changed an old disused factory down the road into an immigrant centre. I was homesick but not when I read your comments, just wait until they get their European passports and move onto the UK and then see if you feel the same way, and yes before you say it, I think I will stay here!

[Justanotherlurker]

Frankfurt, obvious troll is obvious, must try harder.

[Frankfurt7753]

Wow what a nasty bunch of women you lot are, of course it's a waste of money, it's not free over here in Germany and why should UK tax payers have to pay money towards it. I'd love to see your faces if 1,000 (mostly male!) immigrants moved 5 minutes walk away from where you live, like they did to my family here in Frankfurt, thanks to mad Merkel and her crazy open door policy. Fancy some port-a-loos next to your homes would you, being attacked (as my friend has been) and told not to walk alone in the dark even though you live 10 minutes away from work because there's been a huge increase of muggings?? Wake up you deluded idiots, oh yes we must help them, haha don't make me laugh! Let them live next door to you and then let's see if you feel the same way, you have no idea and your ignorance is dangerous.

[Sallyingforth]

Yes they currently stay in the country they register.
But this is not a permanent lock. There is no border control within Schengen and they are free to move about where they wish. And eventually they (and their children) will become full EU citizens.

[Schwabischeweihnachtskanne]

The chart Laura posted shows asylum applications - once you have applied for asylum you have to remain in the country that you have applied in. The rules may change - Germany wants them to as part of the battle to get countries like the UK to take something closer to their fair share - but atm the rule is that asylum seekers cannot move about the EU the same way EU citizens can, once they have registered their asylum claim.

[Schwabischeweihnachtskanne]

Sallying forth that is quite simply not true.

Refugees currently have to stay in the first EU country they register in - one of the main arguments of the British campaign to remain in the EU is that the Dublin regulations allow the UK to deport asylum-seekers if Britain is not the first European country that they arrived in.

[Sallyingforth]

Laura
That chart only indicates how far the refugees have managed to travel from their entry point before claiming asylum. It doesn't mean their journey has ended in those countries.

Having gained EU residency they will be free to continue moving west if they wish.

[LauraMipsum]

Just popping this up here. The UK is definitely not dealing with a greater proportion of migrants than other countries.

[Schwabischeweihnachtskanne]

rosewithoutthorns In 2014 the European nation that accepted the largest number of refugees in proportion to its population was Sweden (81 thousand asylum seekers lodged asylum applications in Sweden in 2014 - there were only 32 thousand applications in total in the UK, a despite its much larger pre existing population). Integration courses (language and culture lessons) are free to anyone not from the EU in Germany despite the fact that 203 thousand people arrived in Germany and lodged asylum applications in 2014 - and now those numbers are in the millions.

Claims that the UK is dealing with a greater proportion of immigrants than countries who fund free language lessons simply ridiculous.

[merrymouse]

We can discuss this without reference to racism and it will still be true that people brought in on a spouse visa will more likely than not have a spouse who is paying tax, and having improved their English will be more able to pay more tax.

How are childcare, housing and travel costs paid for while they are learning English.

In exactly the same way that they would be met if the weren't taking a few EFL lessons.

[Ellieboolou27]

I find that reading any post regarding immigration leads to the op being labelled as racist, see, this is the problem, are we not allowed to have an opinion on these matters. I think those of you who are quick to label posters who are racist for having a view / opinion need to spend a month or two working in a benefit centre ( I speak from previous benefit experience). How are childcare, housing and travel costs paid for while they are learning English...... Yep the taxpayer

[unlucky83]

But it's the Mirror ...they have to put the most negative spin on it because it is a Tory policy. I would guess they have chosen the very hardest questions they could find in the test ...
(Perfect eg of why I hate two party politics and the biased media (left or right wing) that goes with it - they blur the truth )

[TheNewStatesman]

"They have done this for years and it works for them." You mean the Swedish? I would hardly say that. Sweden is widely felt to have the poorest integration record of any European country. The Swedes have tried very hard, but the nature of their economy does not "mesh" well with mass immigration.

[MrsGradyOldLady]

The fattest obviously.

Actually I only know that because I've just done that quiz and I got that wrong. ..

[FinestGrundyTurkey]

Haven't read the whole thread but has anyone linked to this in the Mirror today?

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/quiz-could-you-pass-david-7203301#ICID=WA_mirror_pol

it says the course will cost each participant £1200.

the wording of some of the example questions is unnecessarily convoluted - I think the average British Sun reader would struggle to answer correctly

& I got this one wrong, & I'm quite good at English

What is the superlative form of 'fat'?

fattiest
the fattest
fattest

[rosewithoutthorns]

*want

[rosewithoutthorns]

They have done this for years and it works for them. They have a smattering of immigrants that do unbelievably well due to the immigrants having to adapt.