to object to Chicken Pox quarantine advice?

[SummerMonths]

I understand CP can be nasty but I don't see any point in the quarantine advice. The virus is infectious for two days before the spots appear and obviously nobody knows it's coming so the virus is spread. Then the spots arrive and you have five days of house bound hell despite the fact you have already exposed people for days before.

And if the NHS were really concerned about stopping CP spreading they would vaccinate, but they don't. In fact they rely on kids getting CP young as it's more serious when old.

So can anyone explain the point of quarantine given you will already have exposed others to the virus? Isn't it rather a case of shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted?

[SpidermanLovesCoffee]

Chicken pox parties are really stupid. Just vaccinate. CP can be very serious, as a good friend that works as a pediatric nurse can tell you. Over 20 years my friend has seen kids die. Why would you risk that.

The NHS don't vaccinate primarily because of cost. They also had the MMRV ready but then all the wakefield bollocks came out and they didn't think people would go for another vaccine.

I live in Spain and the it's just been added to the routine schedule. The UK are going to be one of the few western world countries that don't eventually.

I've also been immune compromised and then CP could have killed me, so keep your kids at home. It's selfish, irresponsible and stupid not to.

[TiggerSnooze]

My son currently has chickenpox and I just came upon this thread during the inevitable googling.

I have to admit that I haven't read the whole thread, and can see that the OP started it ages ago, but I can definitely see the OP's point. My son is 3.5 and goes to nursery so I knew it was only a matter of time before he got it if I chose not to go for the privately available vaccine - so, of course, I have thought about whether or not to go for the vaccine.

In the end, I had decided that I would probably vaccinate him if he hadn't had it by a certain age, mainly because it seems like it's nastier the older you get it. Which got me thinking about the current NHS stance on it: it is well-known that it is worse when older, and particularly bad for pregnant women, so it seems that by not including the vaccination in the NHS programme, they rely on pretty much everyone getting it young through exposure (and people who would suffer more than normal are eligible for the vaccination if it's medically suitable for them).

So, where has this whole taboo around chickenpox parties come from? Why is it so wrong to deliberately expose your child to something when there is a 90% chance they'll get it before they are 15 anyway, and it's much better if they do? Obviously, if you want to make sure your child is immune you can choose to vaccinate, but if too many people do this then it will actually reduce the exposure to the virus for everyone else and increase the average age of contraction, which is far less in the public interest than having it young and spreading it round your nursery (and, let's be honest, there are other childcare options available if, for whatever reason, you don't want your child to get CP at preschool age). I suspect the reason for this taboo is the same reason as for the quarantine period at nursery: it's just not socially acceptable to deliberately infect people with viruses in our current social climate, even though our NHS policy relies on it and you could argue that the obligation lies the other way.

I should clarify that I wouldn't advocate people with chickenpox going to all public places as normal, but quarantine from nursery?! It makes no sense to me, and I'm glad we have got this over with.

[Sashkin]

Cote I appreciate you aren’t a medical professional, but if you are going to state things as medical facts please at least google them first:

Natural immunity - immunity achieved the “natural” way, not via a vaccine.

Surgical masks - Princess covered that howler.

The charming post blaming a poster who miscarried due to chicken pox for not having the vaccine - she couldn’t have had the vaccine while pregnant, and the NHS does not test for varicella immunity routinely or if you are TTC.
www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/when-is-chickenpox-vaccine-needed/

And the series of nonsense posts about getting chicken pox twice if “your immune system didn’t work the first time” - just no. An explanation of T-cell differentiation would clearly go over your head, but hopefully this abstract is clear enough:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/6321605/

(Describes patients with positive varicella antibodies (ie immune) who went on to get clinical chicken pox within six months).

Some of your comments have been grossly offensive, please don’t set yourself up as an expert when you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.

[viques]

I came out with chickenpox at Sadlers Wells theatre. Many years ago I hasten to add,so you can put down the anti bac spray! I have always felt a bit guilty about it, but didn't realise I had it until I sat there feeling the pox pop up.

[lynzpynz]

Biochemist here - whilst you don’t know you’re contagious not much you can do, soon as you do - you’re quarantined. Mostly to protect those with compromised immune systems who CP can kill.

I’ve heard of folk hosting ‘CP parties’ to expose children when young (but old enough that their immune system is strong enough to fight it off) which is kind of weird but it doesn’t seem to be as bad when a toddler / young adult usually. As I caught it at age 14 I can say it was horrific and I was really ill for a fortnight, still have the scars.

The vaccine is offered but it’s not mandatory scheduled like the more serious e.g. polio or measles - if only the NHS was properly funded...

[Mumofkids]

The only reason that this country does not offer the vaccine routinely is because there have not been quite enough deaths to warrant the cost.

[Mumofkids]

Of course you should protect more vulnerable members of society if you know there is a risk. Why would you even ask this?
But equally most children in the first 5 days are in no fit state to go out anyway. Unless you were so lucky yours only had 3 spots or something I can't imagine why you'd want to take them out? It's a horrible illness that makes you feel dreadful.

[ninjatracey]

So the very first time I post on net mums I get someone slating me straight away......thanks !

[ninjatracey]

Not true at all. See a few people who believe this. The ONLY immunity to shingles is to never contract chicken pox (herpes zoster) if its never in your system you will never get shingles. Answer have your child vaccinated.

[LouBakesCakes]

And if the NHS were really concerned about stopping CP spreading they would vaccinate, but they don't. In fact they rely on kids getting CP young as it's more serious when old.

They don't because of cost. They had the MMRV vaccine but when all the wakefield shit was done they didn't think people would want it. It comes down to costs though.


They rolled out the vaccine when dd was younger in our area i got her done it only lasts 10yrs apparently so she got them so its catch 22 really with the vaccine

The vaccine hasn't been out long enough to have this data.

[Onlyoldontheoutside]

I've never thought I'd had chicken pox although my bro and sis did when children but I am immune to it.Im not a medical marvel I just must have had the virus but no spots.
I do think that female teachers who are thinking of having children who have not had cp would be sensible to have the vaccine, it's not perfect but it is inevitable that they will come in contact with children with it.

[BarbarianMum]

Ds2 came down with cp the day after we'd visited the very packed Natural History Museum - we probably infected hundreds. Once we knew though we kept him away from people as much as possible although I did still have to do things like the school run (him in a buggy with the raincover on).

I do think there is a slight hysteria on mumsnet where cp is concerned (yes it can kill - rarely - but so can the common cold) but it really isn't hard to be considerate about trying to minimise infecting others once you know your child has it.

[theycallmebabydriver]

FFS what is with all the Zombie threads over the last few days.

Got a point to make about chicken pox? start a new thread, no point restarting a discussion from years ago

[ninjatracey]

Sorry but you are so wrong. There is a vaccine for cp if you never get cp then you can never get shingles. They are both the herpes zoster virus. Once you have cp the herpes zoster virus lives in your nervous system for life. Having cp as a child make you MORE susceptible to having shingles in later life. The vaccine for cp is available privately in the UK for around £60. Children in the USA are vaccinated against cp routinely and as a result they have almost wiped out shingles as well. The vaccine is given at a year old. There is a chance a baby will,catch it before a year then the vaccine is pointless. But its well worth spending the £60. Please also be aware that TB is on the increase and our 13 year olds are no longer vaccinated for this in school. Again its available privately (our goverment should be paying for this !)

[Tanith]

Another very good reason for quarantine is that it forces parents to keep their children away from school and childcare.

There are parents who knowingly send in children who are ill. If there is no quarantine, they will insist on sending their children, regardless of how ill and infectious they are.

With a quarantine, there is no argument.

[CoteDAzur]

No, it was not at all clear that you meant "I didn't know I had these diseases" when you said "It's believed I have natural immunity to CP" and "I am a medical marvel". It sounded like you thought you somehow got immune without getting infected with the diseases.

[Kewcumber]

I think you understood what I meant by natural immunity cote ie immunity acquired naturally not via vaccine without obviously seeming to have had the illness. I'm not sure what such not picking adds the the thread I was hardly claiming it was common. I have certainly had neither TB nor hepatitis (at least not symptomatically I'm pretty sure I would have noticed) and have antibodies to both.

[leedy]

Yes, I don't think I'm inherently immune, just had an asymptomatic infection at some stage. I do wonder if some people are more prone to not getting symptoms, though, as my sister is the same - never knowingly had chicken pox, is immune.

I have asked various relatives and they are all confident that neither of us had chicken pox and my two other sisters definitely did.

[CoteDAzur]

There is no such thing as natural immunity to chickenpox. If you are immune, you must have "got it" at some point. Asymptomatic infection is unusual but not impossible, and it can be so mild as to go unrecognised.

[leedy]

Yup, I'm immune to chicken pox without ever having had any symptoms as well - confirmed when they tested me on my first pregnancy, though I had my suspicions given that I was exposed to it repeatedly and never got it.

My flatmate in college got it as an adult having had a not particularly hermit-like upbringing and hence presumably having been in contact with the virus. It's definitely not a given that "if you're exposed to it as a child, you'll get it and be immune!".

(both my kids are vaccinated, btw)

[Kewcumber]

My various handy immunities are particularly ironic given that at the time some of them were discovered I was being treated for an autoimmune problem (of which I developed 2-3) - perhaps my immune system is a little tooooo active.

[Kewcumber]

I suspect neither the government nor the NHS want to touch that with a barge pole. - thats sort of what I alluded to earlier. Vaccinations are a hot potato just now and so many people see CP as a harmless childhood disease that it may be a pointless cost if vaccination take up is low.

It's beleived I have natural immunity to CP - my mother doesn't remember me having CP when my older brother and sister had it (though of course she could be wrong) and when I was immunosuppressed they eventually tested my immunity as I was being exposed so often through nursery and was found to have antibodies.

Interestingly I also have antibodies to TB and one of the Hepatitis's (can't remember which one) having had neither - it's believed from childhood exposure. In fact the doctors treating me when I was ill didn;t bleive that I hadn't had hepatitis and thought I was covering it up! They confirmed I would have gone yellow with that particular one and I said they were quite welcome to ask my mother when she was in later if I'd ever gone yellow! I am a medical marvel.

[JassyRadlett]

I thought that might be the case. I'm Australian, and my parents are both baffled and horrified that CP isn't part of the vaccine schedule here.

[wulfy1010]

I had chickenpox as a baby, I don't know if I was deliberately exposed to it or not, but I then developed shingles at the grand old age of 11. It developed along my optic nerve and I almost lost my sight. I know that I was a very unusual sight but it shows that early exposure to cp can have other consequences than immunity.