AIBU to not want strange men sleeping next to me post operative?

[bracingair]

I am due to have a c-section in UCLH and I was chatting to one of the midwives. She said post natal you are in a 4 bedded bay. Partners can sleep over, and they don't like the curtains closed so they can keep an eye on u. This is not my first so very likely DH will not stay overnight.

I think it is wonderful that women can have their partners over if they want, but I do not want someone else's partner right by me! I know resources are stretched but I think it is putting me in a position I am very uncomfortable with. AIBU and if not, what can I do about this?

[samsam123]

get rid of the men they should be at home doing the housework

[ImperialBlether]

Before Spock, even!

[ImperialBlether]

LadyCybil, you say, "To (possibly mis-) quote Spock, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" - I think John Stuart Mill got there before Spoke.

[elliejjtiny]

There's no easy answer to this. When I had DS5 by EMCS I was in HDU for 2 days and then the postnatal ward for 6. DS5 started off in NICU and then joined me on the postnatal ward for the last 3 days. With DS4 I had a planned CS and was on the postnatal ward for 3 days. He was in NICU/SCBU for 4 weeks.

Both times I was traumatised by the birth and being separated from my baby. Both times DH was looking after our older DC's so couldn't visit much. He was being considerate to the other women and took the DC's home when they started to get restless (after about 10 minutes usually) so I had nobody to help me. Often I had to queue up for meals, fill my water jug and make my own breakfast with all the men who were doing it for their partners. Most of the visitors had no regard to the fact that most of the women on the postnatal ward will have had a C-section or traumatic vaginal birth and many of them wouldn't feel like celebrating. Their excited shrieking wasn't helpful when I was on my own without my seriously ill DS4.

When I was in with DS5 one of the new granddad's was peering round all the closed curtains and had a really good look at me breastfeeding (I'm not talking about a quick glance and a "whoops, sorry" I'm talking about a full on stare, lasting over a minute).

One old lady poked her walking stick in DS5's direction and made comments. Several people loudly questioned each other about why DS4 wasn't with me.

Other people's children (7-10 year olds who should have known better) were coming into my cubicle, asking me why I was crying and telling me that their baby brother/sister was cuter than my baby. If one of my children had gone into another ladies cubicle they'd have been taken home immediately but this dad refused to leave until the end of visiting time. I got PND both times and it was hardly surprising.

When people suggest this idea they are assuming that all visitors are kind and considerate but IME a lot of them (more than half) were rude and obnoxious and the rest reminded me of what I didn't have. The midwives judged me for DH not being there. By the time DS5 and I were discharged I was such an emotional wreck that the midwives called social services. It was a lot better when we were home and DH could help more. DS5 is now 10 months old and I still cry when hospital visiting is mentioned.

[bruffin]

Private rooms are a great idea but if you're in one night perhaps you can afford the 250 pounds. If you're in a for weeks and weeks you just can't

I had bupa at the time when I went in. They wouldnt cover me for a private room unless I had a cs and then I would be covered from the time of the cs. My consultant did everything they could to avoid a cs and was actually in theatre ready for one when they gave forceps one last chance, so was never covered. Thankfully they did feel sorry for me and gave me a private room anyway. I was moved out of it for a while but Head Midwife went mental and got me moved back in straightaway. I discovered later that once i had married dh, i had automatically been put on his Simply Health (or whatever it was called then) policy and even though it was past the normal 3 months of making a claim, they did cover me for so much a day for staying overnight in hospital, so got a nice cheque, however it still wouldnt have been anywhere near enough to pay for 49 days of private room.

[AbbeyRoadCrossing]

Yeah they mix the two. A separate issue but I did not like being with new mums, partners and their babies when I thought I might not get to meet mine.
Private rooms are a great idea but if you're in one night perhaps you can afford the 250 pounds. If you're in a for weeks and weeks you just can't

[IceBeing]

bruffin wow I didn't know places mixed prenatal and post.

That is yet another dumb idea. The needs of those two groups are totally different. I would say having family in overnight before birth doesn't make sense.

Afterwards, it is frequently the case that you would not wish to separate mother and baby, but that the mother cannot look after the baby alone. IF there aren't going to be staff to help then it has to be partners....

[Eltonjohnsflorist]

Good point gnome - and in those cases of emergencies, sometimes under general they are probably in a worse position than many similar planned surgeries.

[GnomeDePlume]

I think that for the people who struggled post CS the issue is that they are being treated by the hospital as post-natal when really they should be treated as post-operative.

After no other surgery would people be routinely and seemingly deliberately left to cope on their own to the extent to which post-CS mothers left to cope.

I know that CS are routine surgery but they are still major surgery.

[bruffin]

I am still 4 years later trying to recover from the effects of that total 6 day period of time
Unfortunately for people like me it wasnt just have 6 days,it was 7 weeks. Postnatal and prenatal were mixed and I dont think i could have got through if it meant that dhs were allowed to stay as well. Not only did i have the 6 weeks of monitoring, I had 2 days of inducing, then 24 hours of labour then kept in for 5 days afterwards. I went in end of July and came out 22nd September. That is a long time to have to share with strangers, without their dhs as well. I know I was an extreme case, and thankfully was given a private room afterwards which was nicer. But other practicalities. At what point would the dh be allowed to stay. In my case could he have stayed every night just in case things kicked off and I went into labour or all the 5 days afterwards.

[Mimosa1]

I'm going to go against the grain and say that having my DH there was a lifesaver - nearly literally. I was too weak after birth to get out of bed to pick up and feed my baby (PPH and needed 2 blood transfusions) or walk to the loo unaided and I don't know what we would have done without him. Any discomfort at having other ladies' DPs in the ward at UCLH was massively overweighed by the comfort of having DH. I was moved to a private room with an ensuite the following night (LO was born this year in feb so possibly before the rule change?) and I agree it was much better. And the sooner you get home the better. I was in for a week but only 3 nights after the birth. I thought the acute care there was marvellous although the post natal ward is grim. Congratulations on your pregnancy and good luck with your section and hope it all goes well!

[CultureSucksDownWords]

The "being safe" thing works both ways though. Some women only feel safe with their partners there (and therefore also with other people's partners around), some women only feel safe when visitors and partners have gone and it is a woman and baby only space. These two views are obviously incompatible, and one is not more correct than the other.

The solution as others have mentioned is to have individual rooms and not wards, with ensuite facilities so that partners can stay and not be in the space of other women. All new hospitals should surely be built like this, but older hospitals are going to find it difficult or impossible to do this. As maternity is clearly not a priority for the NHS/govt, I don't see this improving in the near future.

[IceBeing]

I would have killed to have DH with me overnight in the hospital. He was sent hoe at 2:30 in the morning and I was left to look after a newborn when I was only 30 mins awake after a GA.

I got stuck in hospital for 5 days, genuinely struggling to meet DD's needs let alone think about my own damage, with no help between 8pm and 8 am. I had a side room for most of that time not that this made any difference, except there was even less chance that anyone would come and help if I dared ring them for it.

I am still 4 years later trying to recover from the effects of that total 6 day period of time.

Obviously proper postnatal care is the answer. But I can't quite believe other feeling uncomfortable about men being on the ward is more important than new mothers and new babies being safe, given apparently there is not likely to be a sudden increase in post natal funding.

[Thymeout]

I also think the question of babies sleeping in a nursery during the night should be revisited.

This was standard when I had mine and we all benefited. Mothers were able to catch up on their sleep and babies were looked after by people who knew what they were doing. No one was kept awake by someone else's baby yelling in the next-door cubicle.

It's one of those ideas that are good in theory but have a lot of disadvantages in practice. It's a lot easier to bond and learn to bf when you're not sleep-deprived and frazzled.

[WhirlpoolGalaxyM51]

Yes agree.

• increasing the amount of care that is expected to be provided by partners will lead to more reduced staffing levels and a downward spiral.

[Inertia]

It seems that post-partum women are presented with the options of accepting whichever is deemed the lesser of two evils. Either accept that the nursing and midwidery staffing levels are too low to provide a safe level of care, or encourage partners to stay overnight so that the already overfull wards have to accommodate double the number of bodies, double the number of people using the inadequate toilet and shower facilities .This is when women are bleeding and leaking everywhere, feeling utterly exhausted, vulnerable and stripped of their dignity- so the way to deal with an understaffed NHS is to make women recovering from birth share their sleeping space and toilets with men they don't know?

Surely Mumsnet's fight shouldn't be to pick a side from two equally poor options, but to fight for safe, adequate midwife and post-natal care for all?

[wanttosqueezeyou]

morage

Of course, some people choose to move away, but many people can't afford to live near their family in this country. Also there are areas where there is very little work available and people are forced to move.

[Weebirdie]

I can see it rising as people start to say - we are too young to not be working.

My husband started a second career after he did his 30 years in his first one and 12 years later he's still working and showing no sign of ever wanting to slow down.

[morage]

My state retirement age is 67. I won't be able to afford to retire before then. My father worked till 65 when he got his pension. My mum was able to retire at 60, as women could get their pension then.

[Weebirdie]

With retirement age increased, I know very few women in their 50's who are not working

People didn't have access to education here until about 40 years ago so we have a young work force, and the women and men who are working into their late 50's were educated abroad and came back to build the country when they were asked to by the new ruler. That would be people like my husband and his sisters.

But no one here works till they're 65 unless they chose to. People generally work for 30 years then retire on pensions or start up their own business to pass the time and keep active.

[Weebirdie]

Whirlpool, every country has its good and bad points and whilst we've got this aspect of life right there are things we still haven't managed yet.

When a person is admitted to a government hospital you get given an attendants card and the family generally sets up a roster of who's going to be attending and when, then when you're on your way home the next person is waiting at the main door to receive the card which is then checked against a security list. You get a nice wee fold down bed and there are toilets just for the attendants even if the patient is in a single room, and you are also given your meals. Neighbours even offer do it for each other. Its just the way it is.

[morage]

Whirlpool - Good point. I wonder if it will continue over the next few generations.
I guess that in that kind of extended family, everyone gets more support from each other.

[morage]

With retirement age increased, I know very few women in their 50's who are not working. And I know a lot of women this age.

Also I know in some European countries, families do not move about as much as in Britain. A friend in Germany says where she lives, family rarely move far away. Here it is common for people to move away.

It is fine for families to do the caring, but in Britain it would mean a lot of people would have no one to care for them.

[WhirlpoolGalaxyM51]

Weebirdie said the men would stay with men as well, morage, so it doesn't sound like it's to do with that.

Just we don't really "do" extended families like that over here, in the main, I guess. Just a different culture.