...to expect a 3rd year NHS GUM student to know what a Canestan pessary is?

[LividofLondon]

Seriously, she didn't know what I was talking about which I thought was piss poor considering it's a well known (and well advertised), widely available product used to treat a very common genital problem. Then when I explained to the GUM doctor who was supervising her that I had vaginal soreness brought on by sex, like a graze up there, he seemed to think I meant soreness as in tenderness/bruising and poked and prodded me inside to try and find the bruised patch. He was even talking about possibly doing a scan to find the problem. In the end he couldn't see anything wrong and gave me a thrush pill to take orally just in case I had that. It turned out that quite simply I suffer from vaginal dryness and sex was making my skin sore (think friction burn inside), which was causing thrush-like symptoms. Thank you Google, MN and Replens.

[AlphaBravoHenryFoxtons]

Was the medical student a she or a he? Your OP says both!

[Clarinet9]

Pishedorf not until after I posted maybe YOU should RTFT

Alpha yes indeed it does but it doesn't say whether she was a medical student or a nursing student. GMC is pretty clear about specialist training posts/grades and the CCT (certificate of completion of training -I guess the clue is in name)

[Pishedorf]

clarinet ... The OP posted the medical student comment at 10:46. You then posted at 10:57 'nowhere has the OP said medical student' so I'm afraid YOU need to RTFT again.

[Pishedorf]

(Eeek a catty comment where is the emoticon)?

[Clarinet9]

The 'attitude' is consistent with the location colloquial language on a chat website, I read nothing in her posts to indicate that the OP wasn't perfectly 'understanding' in the consultation.

Again the OP is not in clinic to 'understand' the nerves of the student she simply expressed her surprise at the lack of knowledge the medical student had. Since she is now being criticised for her lack of 'understanding' she may well be wishing she had waited another few months to do so!!

[Pishedorf]

Even senior doctors (registrars) don't have CCTs yet. They are for hospital consultants and GPs.

[Clarinet9]

No I need broadband and to type faster whilst not doing 5 other things and watching TV at the same time.

Now I am off to do something more productive with my time!!

[Pishedorf]

clarinet well as you said to me earlier on it's my opinion you don't have to agree with it. I think the OPs attitude about the student is horrible. piss poor doesn't equal surprise. And I'm fully aware OP wasn't there to understand the level of student nerves but a bit of basic common courtesy is in order when reflecting on the event 2 months later.

[LividofLondon]

Pished, fair enough. Yes I know she would be using text books not the NHS site, it was just to highlight how readily available very basic GUM info is to everyone (and how easily someone with an interest in that field could quickly learn the basics).

"I think the problem is the titles of the medical hierarchy can be confusing. So in this case she was a medical student, still in university. Probably around 20-21 years old. Not qualified to practice."
Quite possibly, but would she be doing the consultation on her own if she was still at uni? She gave me the impression she was a trainee GUM Dr (I really wish I could remember her exact words), in which case it highlights a communication issue doesn't it.

Anyway, I was very patient, friendly and polite to her, didn't give her any inclination that I was surprised she didn't know what I was explaining to her, so no harm done. MN is where I can unleash my inner unreasonable self that I hide from the outside world

"I am quite surprised by a junior doctor not knowing what a pessary is though!"
Which is what my AIBU is referring to. Quite simply, I was surprised at someone who told me she was training to be a GUM Dr not knowing what a pessary was, and (especially as a woman) not having heard of the widely available and advertised Canestan, used to treat one of the most common complaints a GUM Dr will encounter.

[DertieBertie]

If she's a 3rd year medical student (as opposed to a 3rd year junior doctor, who yes, should know what a pessary is), then YABU. It's December. There's a good chance (depending on what medical school she's from) that she's only had 3.5 months in a clinical environment after 2 years of not seeing patients and this is almost certainly her first GUM placement. Pessaries are also becoming increasingly unpopular. She is not qualified to practice. If you are not comfortable with seeing someone who is still very much learning the basics then that's fine- just decline to see students in the future.

[melodycool]

My tuppence worth ..... Canesten is a brand name, she may have been more familiar with the drug name of clotrimazole

[Pishedorf]

Yes OP she would be taking a consultation on her own at that stage because students have to learn how to take a medical history and the best way of learning it is to take a history. I was doing it at that stage. What happens is she will have taken the history and reported it back to the doctor and then they come in, ask questions as necessary and then he did the examination.

If she was a qualified doctor training in GUM then she would have done the examination and introduced herself as a doctor.

But she wasn't a junior doctor therefore your AIBU is moot. Yes, I would be surprised if a junior doctor didn't know what canestan was but I am certainly not surprised that a student didn't know as they are still learning. Some facts don't always stick straight away given the massive amount of knowledge we need to learn.

I also don't think it's reasonable to expect her to know by virtue of her gender. She may never ever have experienced thrush herself and I doubt she sits at home watching TV and seeing the canestan adverts either.

[Pishedorf]

It may not highlight a communication issue as you can't remember what she said. Laypeople don't understand the medical hierarchy and that's not their fault, it's confusing and the names of the job roles are changed all the time.

[LividofLondon]

"My tuppence worth ..... Canesten is a brand name, she may have been more familiar with the drug name of clotrimazole"

I've used both "Canestan" and clotrimazole (only use the latter now as it's a fraction of the price!) and quite possibly mentioned both to her (arrgh, wish I could remember!). But putting aside her medical training I'm still surprised at a woman not having heard of Canestan, whether she's had thrush before or not. I mean, I'm not a man but I still notice adverts for products aimed at men. It's almost one for a general knowledge pub quiz question

[WidowWadman]

If all you needed was a canesten pessary, why didn't you just go and buy it off the shelf?

[Pishedorf]

OP she's a 20-21 year old girl. Just because she has a vagina doesn't mean she will automatically know what canestan is! I only did at that age as I suffered with the most horrendous recurrent thrush (shudders at the memories). Some lucky girls don't experience it!

[LividofLondon]

Widow, as I've mentioned upthread, I'd been self-medicating but whatever the problem was it kept recurring. Therefore I thought it best to get the underlying cause looked into by a HCP.

[LividofLondon]

Fair enough Pished. You're right, I suppose we notice adverts for thrush more if we've had recurrent thrush ourselves.

[ScrambledEggAndToast]

Not even trained nurses seem to know what pessaries are. When my sister was in hospital, one of the nurses tried to give her one to take orally Luckily she was on the ball and pointed out her mistake.

[VivaLeBeaver]

I don't think I'd have known what canestan was when I was in my early 20s.

[VivaLeBeaver]

And I've noticed a lot of medical students now Introduce themselves to women as "trainee doctors". It slightly annoys me. They freely admit they do it to try and get away from the negative connotation of being a student.

So that they're kind of hoping the woman thinks they're a qualified Dr who's training in obs and gynae. Whereas its actually the qualified SHOs, (or Vts or st1 or st2 as they're now known) who are training, either in the specialist discipline or on their GP rotation. Its naughty of them. But they're meant to see so many births and they're worried a woman will say no to a medical student but yes to a trainee Dr.

I don't let them go and ask the women themselves as I think it puts the woman in an awkward position. I ask on their behalf and the student has often said tto me "can you tell her I'm a trainee dr not a student". Eh, no I won't.

And they do go and take histories on their own. They then have to go back to a qualified person and tell them word for word what's been discussed.

I think if anyone introduces themselves as a trainee you can safely assume they're a med student.

[Musicaltheatremum]

It's the trainee that is the problem word. Once you qualify you now to foundation years 1 &2 then you go back to being a trainee in the speciality you want to do so for GP it is ST1 2 3 and sometimes 4. ST = specialist trainee. So you could be in your 6th year post qualifying and still be a trainee. But then you never stop learning.

[CalleighDoodle]

Chocolate up your chuff

Love it

[TeacupDrama]

once you graduate you are a doctor not a trainee doctor, there is still loads more training but you call yourself doctor as soon as your name is on GMC register normally within a couple of weeks of results often before graduation ceremony

no-one that has graduated would describe themselves as a trainee

a 3rd year student in december will generally only have been on clinics since september and in rotations, students are not taught trade/brandnames as when prescribing must use generic name

medical students start by taking histories these are then checked later, they have to then present cases

[PiperIsTerrysChoclateOrange]

Perhaps she doesn't watch TV and never had thrush.