To move DCs from an 'Outstanding' school to an 'Inadequate' one?

[UpInTheAirAgain]

12 yr old twins DSs (Yr8) are driving me nuts wrt getting them to and from school and I have had enough. They don't care what time it is, they will not get dressed without me shouting, ditto brush teeth, hair, put shoes on etc. We are often running late due to this and if we leave after a certain time window, traffic is mayhem and it can take 30mins to do a 3 mile journey similarly on the way back. They have to be dropped at school first due to start times and I then have to double back to get DC4 who has just started Reception to school at a primary 5 mins away from home. I am getting him to school late due to the DTS's complete disinterest in getting themselves ready to leave on time. Last week I dropped them off after I dropped off DC4 and they were 30 mins late for school. They got a detention which I knew they would get but they really don't give a flying fuck!

This was an issue all through Yr7 but I did not have DC4 to get to school then!

Similarly with picking them up, where we will agree a time for me to pick them up as they do clubs after school, when I get there they will not be waiting for me and I will be sitting in the car for up to 30 mins waiting for them to deign to come out while they ignore my texts and calls. I have also had to resort to getting the office staff to help me trawl around the school looking for them when I have had appointments I needed to get to !

I am hoping to go back to work in the New Year after finding a job and getting DC 4 settled into the after school club and will not be around to wait for them and I seriously doubt their ability to get themselves to current school on time.

Outstanding school, which they are both happy at and doing well at now DTS2 is getting the support he needs, is 3 miles away with only one direct bus service in the AM and PM which DSs have no chance of getting given their current time timekeeping. Walking/cycling is dicey as main road is very busy and DTS2 has learning difficulties and I worry that he may take risks which will endanger him. It is a 45 minute walk and no other kids from our area walk that way as very few got into the school.

Inadequate school is less than a mile away. 15 min walk. Safe to walk/cycle and hordes of DC will be walking the same way. New Head teacher is making great strides to turn the school around but the school has always been a 'problem' school albeit in the more 'affluent' side to town. DD1 attended and got on OK but a desire to learn was not really fostered in her and she did badly in her GCSEs although she's now flying through her college course.

I am of a mind to move them to the crap school after Christmas and tell them that they will be totally responsible for getting themselves to and from school from that point on. The stress in the morning is unbelievable and after shouting all morning, I feel like shit all day. I want them to leave the house happy in the morning but they will just not cooperate!

AIBU?

[ravenAK]

Switch to the bus! My dc are a bit younger, but they 'get' that buses, trains, & minicabs don't wait, whereas irate parents get cross but can't actually leave without them.

I would be informing them that they are to be at the bus-stop on time. Explain that the only option for you dropping is after you've taken dc4, therefore very late, therefore they will be in bother at school.

Things they like at weekend are conditional on being ready to leave on time x5.

This is by individual twin, so if one gets butt in gear, great, off he goes. If the other is faffing, fine, he gets to be punished at school for lateness when you drop him after dc4. He also misses out on the reward you've decided on for the weekend for getting to school on time.

How they get home is up to them - if they are organised, they'll be on the bus; if not, 3 mile walk isn't a big deal for a 12yo tbh.

Inform school of all this & make it VERY clear that you will fully support all sanctions for lateness.

The relative crapness of the schools is a whole other issue - I agree with PPs that Ofsted aren't to be taken seriously these days - but they are otherwise happy at current school, so moving them really won't help, or address the key issue, which is that they're taking the piss & letting you take the strain.

[Oldmanriver]

Bicycles or a bus. They might even enjoy the sense of responsibility.

[QueenofLouisiana]

How much does your DS's learning need impact on his ability to get his act together? If he is dyslexic or dyspraxic, for example, I think you may need to cut him some slack! Would a visual timetable help him to get his stuff together? However my DS is as disorganised as yours and he's neurotypical- just a dreamer!
Go and look at the other school, you may find it is fine and making huge strides to get where it needs to be. I teach in a school on special measures and teaching, marking, management and progress are monitored so rigorously that there really is nowhere to hide. Local 'good' schools are now turning up to look at what we do as it now a model of best practice. What can they offer your DTs? Can they support the need your DTS2 has?

[MiscellaneousAssortment]

I think there are lots of good ideas on here.

Just to clarify, to the people saying 'make then' leave the house etc, how do you make two 12 yr olds?

Would you get physical? Or some other way?

I'm asking as the OP seems to have lost any control over them and I can imagine them laughing and carrying on with their behaviour whilst she rages impotently?

[Camolips]

There sounds like there is another adult in the house if dc4 is waiting for you at home. You need to share the stress equally! But agree with others. I would start the regime gently. They will get a lift for the next couple of weeks but they will need to be ready, or at least making a valiant effort (you can't expect miracles after years of being allowed to act like slugs). Let them know they will be getting the bus for the last two weeks of term and make sure they know how to do this. By the start of the spring term hopefully they will be in charge of their own destinies! Good luck!

[Mehitabel6]

I can't see that you would solve anything- you would have the same issues. They are running rings around you. As miscellaneous says you have lost control- and you need to get it back. Get tough- sit them down and tell them how it is going to be from now on. Make life very tough if they don't comply, with sanctions.
Have a list of basic rules, make them together. Make sure they understand they have to keep them to get any privileges.
Tell them they are to get all their stuff ready the night before and you will wake them earlier. They will be dressed etc before breakfast and they will get breakfast if they have time. Give them pocket money and dock so much for the minutes you have to wait.
Coming home is easier as they obviously have phones. Tell them you are not hanging around. Text you when they are outside and waiting and then set off. If they are not there drive off and wait until they text you again.

[Mehitabel6]

I like raven's ideas too.

[Betsy003]

I think 3 miles is an ok distance to walk. Kids need a couple if hours if excersise each day anyway.

In regards to exiting the house at the same time, maybe it's just a case of turning off wifi, reminding that they need to be gone, removing play stations etc. The last thing you want is them settling in for the day with their technology equipment.

[Mehitabel6]

Shock tactics needed! At the moment they hand the problem to you and know that you will get them to the right place. Give the problem back to them.

[Betsy003]

I don't think moving schools will resolve the issue. The problem is their failure to organise and motivate themselves in the morning (which you are presently enabling).

Today sit down and lay out all the facts - they will be getting themselves to school by bus or walking. You are not providing lifts.

[eurochick]

I agree that leaving them to get the bus is the way forward. If they miss it, they walk and get detention for being late.

[Mehitabel6]

Maybe they don't care about one detention- they will get very fed up if they regularly in detention.

[PorridgeBrain]

I second the pocket money idea (or similar ) Take x amount of pocket money away for each day they are not ready by x time. Have done a similar thing with my younger children and as soon as I threaten the pocket money, they miraculously get a move on :)

[Mehitabel6]

Whatever you do it needs to be them that are inconvenienced and them that lose from it- not you.

[Jaffakake]

I would also suggest trying to get tough. I went to a school 3 miles from home, albeit with a public bus service every 10 mins. If I'd faffed & been late I would have certainly received sanctions at home as well as detention at school. I had rubbish pocket money, so would have lost that, but expect my freedom with friends would've been curtailed too.

I'd suggest you start by levelling with them & explaining the new rules / sanctions & that ultimately you may look at moving their school unless improvement is seen by Easter. I suspect they won't want to be stuck in a whole new friendship situation by Easter & by year 9. Then stick with it removing assistance bit by bit until they're in the position to get the bus.

I'm minded that dts2 has learning difficulties, but having no personal experience of that, only you as his mum can say whether this advice will work for him. But for the other twin I think you need to give him the responsibility otherwise he'll never learn to get to work on time by the age he should.

Good luck x x

[KnackeredMuchly]

Sit them down, bus leaves at 7.40 - agree with them what time they must be up by by working it out together - 10 minute out if bed, 10 minute brush teeth/shave, 10 min change clothes, 10 min gather bags and shoes.

Alarm goes on at 7am then. Ignore them. If not out room by 7.10 you will go in with a glass of water and throw it over them. Then ignore them. Completely, ignore if they are late - don't remind them of the time. If they miss the buss they walk.

You have been pandering to them. They have got into a school few others could. They're bright but if you carry on like this what men are you raising?

I agree that moving schools would make them just as late.

[7to25]

Do they have phones?
Take them off them and only return them when they get into the car on time.
Every morning are ready late, they get up quarter of an hour earlier the next day. And go to bed a quarter of an hour earlier.
Earlier and earlier till they comply.
You.....be up, showered and dressed before them so that you can direct proceedings.
Get on their back every ten minutes and make them comply with your timetable.
Harness your inner sergeant major.
Getting up and out is a HUGE life skill. Moving schools teaches them that the world revolves around them.
You control food, money and all privileges; harness your power.
(Can you tell I have six children?)

[CromerSutra]

I would second them getting the bus/cycling or even walking. My Dd walks 2.5 miles to and from school every day, it's good for her. She has to leave at 7.35 every morning. Could you wake them a lot earlier? I did this last year when Dd went through a lazy stage in year 6.

[CromerSutra]

Or confiscate the phones, yes, that's a good idea!

[thisismypassword]

I wouldn't change schools just for this reason. You need to take privileges away from them if they can't do basic time keeping. This will put them in good stead for the future. Don't make such a drastic decision which will affect their education for goodness' sake!

[thisismypassword]

p.s. i went to a school 45 minutes away and took the train from age 11 to 18. I was never late. Stop making excuses for your kids and mollycoddling them!!

[Betsy003]

OP ses to have disappeared