to wonder why people shop at Amazon?

[poppytripll]

Starbucks and the other well known tax dodging companies? If we need more money to pay teachers properly, fund the nhs etc then surely if we supported retailers that pay UK tax it may help? I don't buy coffee much but I use Costa if I do, as it's part of a British company that pays tax.

I also shop in Sainsbury or Waitrose because they pay UK tax as opposed to Aldi and Lidl. I'm probably over simplifying this so please tell me if iabu!

[pukkabo]

As someone else said and as I always always say when people go on about the list of companies they avoid for this reason and that- if you wish to avoid every morally corrupt company then you would be left with very little choice. Your best option is to live self sufficiently- grow your own food, have a watermill, livestock and weave your own clothes. Oh and build your own house while you're at it.

They're almost all corrupt in some way, they don't get as rich as they are without some evil scheming. I try to avoid Monsanto as a general rule but that isn't always possible because they basically own the world. Amazon are nowhere near as evil as those companies so I hope you know about that and avoid them also.

[higgle]

Because my dog food is 10 per bag cheaper with them and they deliver it to my door for free. Because they seem to have everything in the world available at a click, with on line reviews so I can see if it is any good. Most of all I'm sick of being ignored in shops, rude can't be arsed service, assistants talking to each other and not me and having to pay over 2 for an hours parking to put up with this.

Starbucks coffee is not very nice, so I never go there.

[LumionaMoonsplash]

I also love Amazon. I actually have very little in the way of consumer principles. I spend my money where it works best for me. With our limited budget I have to spend smartly to make our money go further, I despise being ripped off for anything. Why would I want to spend more for the same thing?

[Mj41]

I've just got back from my local Starbucks with my regular order - they comply with the tax laws so don't have an issue with them. The UK government should get its house in order and reduce the legal loopholes if they want big corporations to pay more tax. I wouldn't pay any more tax personally than I was legally obliged to so why should I expect companies to do otherwise?

[Minnieisthedevilmouse]

Because amazon has stuff I want to purchase.

Same reason I go to most shops.

Really don't care about the rest.

[HighwayDragon]

I love amazon, so they exploit a legitimate loophole. I would if I were them. Their customer service is second to none, their prime service is awesome, free next day delivery? What's to sniff at? They also have an enormous selection of tpbs.

[lagoon]

I love amazon always had good customer service, quick delivery amazing prices. Fast, convenient. They aren't breaking the law, there are thousands of UK companies and self-employed people who are deliberately evading UK tax they are obliged to pay, it's those that fuck me off.

[AgaPanthers]

How exactly do Amazon dodge tax?

Could the outraged please explain for me?

[BikeRunSki]

Because I live in the countryside, and work on a business park on the edge of a city. I have to go out of my way to find shops other than local post office/ paper shop. With Amazon I can think "ds needs a new water bottle for school" or "i need a present for x's party on Saturday" - snd it 'a here the next day.

[Bonsoir]

Amazon is cheap and convenient. I shop there all the time.

Starbucks is expensive and unpleasant. I never shop there.

[Andrewofgg]

TucsonGirl Supermarkets on Sundays is what I had in mind.

[phoebs88]

Aga, sales are routed through Luxembourg. When you buy something on amazon.co.uk?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21, you are actually placing your order with Lux. Lux pays the UK company to fulfil the orders - I.e. The UK's activities are fulfilling orders on behalf of Lux (and it is not making sales to UK consumers itself).

It's a fairly common business model.

The UK co is then subject to corporation tax on its profits - ie the money it makes from fulfilling orders on behalf of Lux. Incidentally, last year I think their effective tax rate on those profits was around 24% - ie the headline UK tax rate. And of course they will be paying employment taxes etc.

The press at the time went a bit crazy over sales, forgetting to highlight that ALL companies pay tax on their profits, not their turnover.

At the end of the day, they aren't doing anything wrong. The taxation of internet businesses just doesn't work in the way people might expect as every country's tax laws were written a hundred years ago and haven't kept up.

[TSSDNCOP]

I avoid Starbucks because they're shit. Amazon are not.

If the Uk Changed its tax laws to close the loopholes companies and celebrities legally use, that'd be different.

[PomeralLights]

Lol at the poster who said I'd identified transfer pricing as an example of something unreasonable - you got me! I have always been a little uncomfortable with transfer pricing, I mean, it was kinda obvious the Starbucks/Amazon/every other company the big 4 has advised situation was going to come about.

However, at least TP looks at specific goods or services and compares the cost to the market. That at least is possible. In the same way that you might expect two bookshops in two nearby towns, with similar footfall, staff, overheads, pricing etc to be paying similar amounts in tax.

I do think that expecting Amazon to be able to look around, compare their business to everyone else and somehow being able to identify the 'appropriate' amount of corporation tax to pay is a bit silly.

I agree the government should change the law and to be fair, the current conservative government introduced the general anti abuse rule which is going a damn sight closer to achieving that than any other government. Ultimately, I feel sorry for HMRC workers trying to improve/change the system. We pay them peanuts but still expect them to give a monkeys, as if being a tax inspector is a vocation, and it doesn't matter that everyone hates tax inspectors both for A) collecting their taxes, which of course are too high, and B) not collecting ENOUGH taxes from Amazon/Joe Bloggs down the road/anybody as long as it's not the plumber who's a 'decent chap' coz he'll do a couple of hours cash in hand.

[ArtVandelay]

Because i live in Germany and I often need English things. If i can get it locally, i do.

[Andrewofgg]

And I live in England and want German books. Before amazon.de there was one foreign-language bookshop in the centre of London and a small selection in the bookshops of some University cities. Now I have the same choice as if I was in Germany.

If only orders from amazon.de could come to the Amazon lockers - and Amazon tell me they are working on it.

[Andrewofgg]

And of course Amazon pays business rates on its warehouses, or "fulfilment centres" as they amusingly call them, in the UK. And tax on the fuel its trucks use. And so on.