to think that pregnant does not have to mean classless and entitled...

[glasgowsteven]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2561592/Pregnant-commuter-forced-sit-carriage-floor-no-one-seat-train-firm-refused-grant-special-pass.html

if you want a first class pass, buy one dear

Entitled

The problem is, in our society, nowadays, noone gives a shit about anyone else.

The idea of first class carriages, which remain empty, is ridiculous. People pay to travel on the train and are uncomfortable and unsafe because half the carriages are saved for some mythical creature who is prepared to pay more for a doily on their headrest.

I heard her being interviewed on the radio this morning, and her main issue seems to be about not getting the first class upgrade because she only travels for 3 days and so doesn't have a season ticket. This is a completely separate issue in my mind to the passengers ignoring her.

She said in the interview that she did say to the people around her that she was feeling unwell and they did hear her because they had to move to let her sit down. However, I do feel she should have been a lot more assertive. It would not have been possible for the other passengers to have ignored me if I was in her position! I would have been tapping them on the shoulder, talking loudly in their ears, and so on to get my point across. I would have been roping in likely looking passengers to help me ask the nearest people sitting down to move etc.

I am also a bit puzzled because I thought most trains had priority seats these days for elderly, disabled, pregnant passengers or those carrying children. Southern certainly do on the line that I use the most. I would (and have) asked anyone sitting there to move, if they didn't fall into the categories mentioned. I became quite expert at knowing which carriages and where these seats were, and making a beeline for them. Always apart from 1 time, people automatically moved or didn't go to sit there when they saw me and my massive bump getting on the train.

The woman in question doesn't make any mention of whether she wanted to sit in the priority seats or not.

As a general rule, I always stand and offer my seat to anyone who looks like they need it more than me, or who has reasonably asked for it. I would never ignore someone who had sunk to the floor, clearly saying they were unwell.

She sounds entitled, but I hate how these articles bring out the 'pregnancy is not an illness' comments from people, and the high-flying super-mummies who climbed Everest and ran a marathon the day before they gave birth and would never have taken someone else's seat on the tube/bus saying "None of us need it, actually!".

I've had to give up supermarket shopping at 30 weeks and send DP every time. Low BP and anaemia causing me to faint at random. My muscles are stretching to breaking point in four different directions and yes, sometimes I do need to sit down. My pregnancy is feeling very much like an illness, actually

I agree with UriGeller - well said.

As for directly asking - people should not need to be asked even at a really minimal level of giveashit. The exception to this is if the bump is not visible.

If the bump is visible, and you have a whole train carriage full of people without one person with the minimal level of human decency needed to say "here, there's a seat here if you want it", well it's a shame there wasn't a big hole they could have run the train into, because what is the point of them.

I live on this line, Journey would have been 20/30 minutes, the train could be so packed that you wouldn't be able to walk to find a guard or move to first class. The other passengers were shit in not offering her a seat if she had mentioned or been visibly heavily pregnant. Top tip for pregnant travellers is to wear your badge and ask for a seat if you need one. I never got refused but only asked when I really needed to sit down or at risk of falling.

The idea of a pass for first class is a good one, as you would head straight to first class and not try to broker a seat or try to get through a packed train. I didn't know this existed for pregnancy and would try for one next time (hopefully) I am pregnant. I think southwest trains will be unindated by requests now for the pass. Well done Daily Fail for actually being helpful in bringing the pass information into the public domain.

OP YABU. You have a go at trying to balance whilst carrying about 3 stone on your stomach with weakened ligaments and a widened pelvis on a fast moving, packed train.

Like the train company said if she felt ill she should have found a guard or pulled the chain it's not rocket science.

Yes people should have let her sit if needed but running off to be interviewed and in the paper does smack of being entitled.

There seem to be two kinds of women, those who just get on with pregnancy as though its any other day and those that become entitled, expect to be waited on hand and foot, cant do anything and seem to think they are the first person to ever have a child.

Making a pregnant, poorly woman sit on the floor of a train just shows what disgustingly bad manners some people have these days.

Agree with urigellar

RedFocus, I agree, she could have done that (assuming she could have reached the emergency cord, sounds like the passengers wouldn't have helped her there!).

HOWEVER, as a basic bit of human empathy, whilst the train was pulling into the next station after pulling the emergency cord, someone should have got her sat down properly on a chair.

Also, what if she had been feeling unwell, but not to the point of needing an ambulance. This is often the case in pregnancy. Surely it is reasonable to ask for a seat in this circumstance?

Are you genuinely saying that you would watch someone sink to the floor, clearly unwell, and just sit on your arse thinking "well they should pull the emergency cord".

Does it say WHY she wanted to sit down? Pelvic pain etc.....

As a midwife I can recall women with various issues struggling into London by train....simply becaise they had to work.

It isn't "entitled" (hate that bloody word tbh) to want to be able to sit down.

Btw....I notice the OP didn't come back

I agree that it's crass and bad mannered not to offer one's seat to the pregnant woman - I'd certainly have offered her mine and I'm in my seventies with dodgy hips and knees.

I know I'm petty, but why does the DM insist on photographing pregnant women always patting their bump? We can SEE she's pregnant.

I suspect there was no guard to be seen. I've never seen one on my commuter trains.

She does sound entitiled in her attitude, but I think she has a point. If full time workers holding a train pass are entitled to sit in 1st class past a certain point in their pregnancies, then part time workers should have the same entitlement.

I'm pretty disgusted at the other passengers anyway. Surely it is common decency to allow someone feeling ill to sit down, whetehr pregnant or not.

There must have been a guard if she was refused permission to sit in first class by a guard.

I repeat my point that the train service was ultimately at fault as it should have been up to them to ask someone to move from a priority seat if they were not going to allow her to sit in first class.

AS for her, we've all said it. We don't know if she wanted to sit down just because she is pregnant or because she is struggling due to pregnancy. I am well aware that many women struggle in pregnancy, just as many women feel perfectly fine and fit and able to stand. We do 't know if she actually asked people or not. We don't know a lot of things.

" AS for her, we've all said it. We don't know if she wanted to sit down just because she is pregnant or because she is struggling due to pregnancy. I am well aware that many women struggle in pregnancy, just as many women feel perfectly fine and fit and able to stand. We do 't know if she actually asked people or not. We don't know a lot of things. "

...and yet that hasn't stopped people here from judging her as "entitled"...which says more about them that it does her.

Hmmm so season pass holders get upgraded. How come? Either pregnant women need the seat or they don't. Why is the health and and safety of an occasionnal commuter less important to them. If she was woozy and fell over they'd have alot more bad publicity then this.

Shame no fucker would stand up and give her a seat though!

I would have given her my seat without being asked. I would have been pain because of arthritis, but I would've done it all the same.

Just goes to show how utterly lovely I am.

It isn't explained very well in the DM article, but the conversation about being allowed in first class happened at a separate time to the sitting on the floor train incident. She went to apply for an upgrade, but was told she didn't qualify due to not having a season ticket. The woman in question explained it more clearly when she was Radio 5 this morning.

Blimey, so expecting a bit of care and consideration from others is "entitled". Glad I've been told

When I lived and worked in London and because of my disability was allowed to drive to the office with parking available.

On one of the few days I couldn't take my car I would use the underground. No-one ever gave up their seat, even though some were designated for those with a disability or pregnant etc. It would often be a city 'gent' sitting in the seat while I stood in front of him trying to balance on two sticks. They would look me up and down and open their newspaper wider to hide me from view.

On one occasion a guy standing suggested the man give me the seat, which was met with a snort and he ignored us both. Nice.

I have on more than one occasion given my seat to a pregnant women who looked to be struggling more than me.

I just hope karma gets some of these people but unfortunately won't be there to see it.

OP

What did you mean by the word "classless"? I don't think it makes sense in the context of your post.

When are we going to be a society that thinks its important for pregnant women to be entitled to a seat? Do we still need to be in a debate whether a pregnant woman should want a seat, surely we should give her the option of deciding herself.

This train company has a policy which applies to some but not to all. This is unfair and it should be the case that if you pay the price of a ticket you are afforded the same rights as someone who has paid for a season ticket.

HappyMummyOfOne: 'There seem to be two kinds of women, those who just get on with pregnancy as though its any other day and those that become entitled, expect to be waited on hand and foot, cant do anything and seem to think they are the first person to ever have a child.'

Well, I definitely don't think that that I should be waited on hand and foot, or that I'm the first person ever to be pregnant. However, when I'm not pregnant I don't faint or projectile vomit if I stand for too long. So I can't exactly carry on as normal.

I think her point is that she wants to avoid the situation occurring. I've had a couple of bad 'woozy' episodes and basically it's all I can do to sit down and not faint. At that stage, finding the pull cord or asking round for a seat would have been beyond me.

I won't travel on a peak train without a booked seat for this reason - but I don't think South West trains do seat bookings, so she obviously needs a different solution.

However, I do feel she should have been a lot more assertive. It would not have been possible for the other passengers to have ignored me if I was in her position! I would have been tapping them on the shoulder, talking loudly in their ears, and so on to get my point across. I would have been roping in likely looking passengers to help me ask the nearest people sitting down to move etc.

I don't think that's fair. I had a pretty rough pregnancy, beginning, middle and end (culminating in hospitalisation) and when I was ill, I was ill. I was sitting quietly, whether that was the floor or a seat, avoiding any kind of movement, including talking, because that made me feel even more ill. I remember being unable to speak, because I was trying to avoid vomiting in public!

HappyMummyofOne Yet again, you have grossly simplified reality. Sometimes, carrying on as normal is not possible.