to think Oliver Cromwell might have had a point in banning Christmas?

[lessonsintightropes]

I have: 1 DH, two DParents, 2 DPILs, 1 DGmaIL, 5 sets of DUandAs, 2 DNephews, 1 DNeice, 3 DSibs and their OHs, 1 DSBIL whom we are on present terms with, plus a team of five. I am dearly lucky to have them all and a job and colleagues I really like, plus 10 cousins who I adore (and am grateful we don't present exchange with!!)

Even if I limit £10 gifts to children, in-laws and colleagues (which will be seen as slightly Grinch-y), £20 to siblings, parents and partners and £50 for DH my present bill this year is £420. I am also hosting Christmas (totally my turn and happy to do it) with a food bill of circa £250 including drink. Posting (including homemade cakes to very close relatives overseas, and cards) probably about £70.

£740 so far... without counting in drinks at work dos and any home decs (minimal as I'll reuse last years with the possible exception of a tree).

This is ludicrous and I can't afford it - and DH and I are extremely lucky to have good, well paying jobs. Our family has always had what we think is a reasonably low limit on ££ value of gifts and I don't think our per person levels are very high, particularly when hearing friends and colleagues talking about spending £100+ on partner/DCs (and this is before we even have any).

It seems such an extravagant and unnecessary waste of resources we'd be better off saving.

So... was Oliver Cromwell right to ban Christmas? Or is there a way to make it cheaper (before I get completely flamed I also work on average 60 hours a week and so can't make homemade presents as I'm usually shattered at the end of the working day and we're househunting on weekends). First world problem or something others would like to fix too?

[Notcontent]

I generally just buy for my dd and my parents. There are a few relatives I buy for every year because of a complicated family set up, and it would look very bad if I suddenly stopped.

The whole buying for the sake of buying thing is completely out of control. There are so many people getting into debt because they feel under pressure to buy stuff which they can't afford and which ultimately no one needs.

[GrendelsMum]

LOL at Mrs Jupiter Jones!

[Mintyy]

Why on earth are you buying presents for uncles and aunts??

[ForalltheSaints]

Oliver Cromwell and his supporters were wrong on this and so many other things, and the US and the UK suffers to this day from the emotional retardness that his era brought. I've never been sure whether or not Oliver Cromwell or his namesake Thomas Cromwell (Henry VIIIs' Peter Mandelson) were worse.

[Bettercallsaul1]

MrsJupiterJones That is hilarious - the MN revisionist view of history! (I'm sure it could be extended to many. other topics...!)

[FunkyBoldRibena]

It's all so bloody ridiculous.

Being accused of being warty and horrid because you don't buy into the commercial crap kinds makes it into a self-fulfilling prophesy. People don't feel they can admit they don't like it in case they are accused of being bah humbuggy. Well, bollocks to them I say.

Our christmas day is much like all our days spent at home together; food we like, a trip to the allotment or a walk around the village, wood burner on and me pottering - the only difference is there will be little sport on the tv for himself to watch.

And I can sow next year's onion seeds as the winter solstice has been and gone; get in.

[DameDeepRedBetty]

I've tried to sell Secret Santa to my (adult) family, but failed with some of them. One sister has Taken Umbrage, as she's already bought loads of stuff, and so has one of my SILs. The other SIL quite simply didn't listen to my words on the phone and just kept on talking, but that was the one who's madder than a box of frogs anyway.

Another of my own sisters has announced she's not doing Christmas at all, so there (she has no DCs so fair play to her), and the third said it sounded like a good idea but only if everyone joined in, then ended the conversation abruptly due to WW3 breaking out between dnephew and dniece, and we haven't managed to speak since.

[DamnBamboo]

don't buy so...

[DamnBamboo]

Just don't so many gifts. You don't have to. Christmas is about so much more than spending money

[donnie]

hmmmm....perhaps Cromwell's love of chopping the King's head off is a little OTT . If he'd had his way this place would be like North Korea.

[ilovesooty]

I loathe Christmas and think Cromwell was right.

[squoosh]

By all means stick some warts on your face and ban Christmas if that's what you want OP. Personally, I love Christmas, and even like getting gifts for, shock horror, the adults in my life! I know the MN mantra is 'Christmas is just for kids'. Fuck that I say, Christmas is for me and the ones I love. No matter their age.

If you can't afford it have a conversation, maybe you'll find that they feel the same as you.

[MsJupiterJones]

I like the idea that OC banned Christmas because his MIL was coming to stay for two weeks, his sister was only buying presents for children, his decorations didn't match the hall carpet and he didn't get the delivery slot he wanted from Ocado.

Should have just pointed him in the direction of the Christmas bargain thread and he'd have had a much rosier view.

[Bettercallsaul1]

No, I love Christmas, warts and all!

[RiceBurner]

Hi OP,

FYI, not everyone 'does' gifts at Xmas. (We don't. We don't do cards either.)

And I can't tell u how much more I/we enjoy Xmas now, having decided to stop all the shopping madness. (So much less hassle & stress!)

It's traditional to buy gifts to show love/appreciation at Xmas. (I was brought up to do it, so I know that & I used to do it too.) But one day I realised that I didnt enjoy it. (Not short of money, just didnt know what to get people and ended up buying inappropriate/overpriced stuff and wasn't at all happy about it.)

The whole "present giving at Xmas" thing just seemed to have got out of hand in the UK. (Especially gifts for ADULTS!) I think we are brainwashed into believing that we MUST buy gifts ...by people who want to SELL us more stuff at Xmas?

I expect there are a LOT of ppl are like me, who actually don't enjoy the effort, time and thinking which goes into present buying, (or can't afford it), but (unlike me) they can't see any way out. (They don't want to seem mean or anti-Xmas.)

Someone has to stop the vicious circle of buying for more and more people though?

For example, I think teachers shdn't be allowed to get gifts from pupils/parents, as it makes parents feel obliged to get them something, and adds to the Xmas burden/expense. (We never bought for teachers when I was at school but seems obligatory now?)

It's a wasteful way to spend money as well, because so many presents, (given in good faith), are just not right, ie not what the person likes or wanted, useless (eg ornaments/joke gifts) or else duplicates of the same book/DVD etc.

I realised I didn't like GETTING gifts anymore either. (Once I was an adult & I could buy/afford my own.) It places so much stress on other people to know what you like or else you end up with rubbish presents?

When I was a teen, the best gifts I got (from adults) were cash. (Far better than vouchers or tokens which are quite restrictive.) But once you have your own cash, what's the point in exchanging cash?

Talking of cash, what happened to just giving a Christmas tip to binmen, postman etc? (If you want to give something to someone to show appreciation, when did money become somewhat unacceptable?)

Buy gifts for your own kids naturally. (They can't buy their own.) But I see no need to buy for other poeple's kids, or for adults who are not in dire need.

And, of course, always give to those who you know are in need, or would appreciate some help/cheer at Xmas.... if you can/want to. Just stop buying for the sake of buying & swapping gifts just cos it's traditional/you feel under peer pressure to do so.

Good food & good company are all you need to have a lovely Xmas IMO, so cut back (massively) on the gifts if (like me) you don't enjoy it and/or cant afford it! And don't feel bad/guilty!

[raisah]

//www.costco.co.uk

//www.jjfoodservice.com

[raisah]

Get yourself over to the Christmas bargain thread & pick up some lovely bargains. You could prepare your family for secret Santa next year by getting them generic family gifts this year. So they get used to recieving one gift rather than one present per person. Fill a basket with treats bought on offers & BOGOF deals for each family. So next year, you could suggest secret santa and it wont be so much of an issue.

Sign upto Costco or JJWholesale & bulk buy Chritmas food & drinks as it works out much cheaper.

Good luck.

[SunshineAndPeardrops]

YANBU, I'm due to go on maternity leave so am much more aware of spending and the cost if Christmas in general.

I have quite a big family on my side, and things seem to have spiralled a bit. DH's side is smaller but it all adds up

I thought we'd finished Christmas shopping this year. DH is one of 3 children. His brother and sister have one child each. I thought we were just buying for the kids from now on, bearing in mind this time next year me and DH will also have a child too, and it will then be completely fair. Then SIL roped me into the annual Secret Santa, with a budget of £20 for the adults.

I wouldn't mind but last year I bought a present worth £20, for my Secret Santa, and in return I got....A mug with hot chocolate and some teaspoons ....Really, did that cost £20?

I really resent letting myself get pushed into it. I could really use that £20. Even if I didn't need it for essentials I would still much rather spend it at Toby Carvery with DH before the baby comes (classy, aren't I?!!), or spend it on a treat for me, rather than get some crappy gift that I don't even like.

[Ephiny]

I don't think it should be banned, but it is completely optional (especially when you don't have children of your own). I never buy Christmas presents, and I don't want or expect or ask for any. I do love winter and the solstice and snow and skiing, but the whole commercialized Christmas thing? Doesn't appeal to me.

It's the 'compulsory fun' aspect of Christmas that I'd 'ban', if I was going to ban something! Fine for the people who enjoy all the fuss and spending etc to do it if they want to, but for many it seems to be an obligation and more stress than enjoyment, but they feel a weight of expectation to do it even when they don't want to and/or can't afford it.

[caruthers]

Christmas for me is about spending time with family and friends with good food and presents (Not a massive overspend) for the children.

Make it simple and have a good time.

[FoxMulder]

It's times like this I think how lucky I am that my family doesn't really 'do' presents. Except for the kids, and there are only a couple of them.

[boschy]

oops pressed too soon! so I do sympathise, and am liking the idea of wearing black and pudding bowl haircut.

[boschy]

My DB and I have done 'Austerity Christmas' for the last 3 years. He has a DW, 4 adult DC (all with partners) and 4 GC. meanwhile there is me, DH, and 2 teenage DC. so we have now agreed pressies only for under 18s (will have to break that to DD1 next year!)

DH's family on the other hand... expect a minimum of 3 presents per person (so FIL, MIL, SIL, 2 x DN = 15 presents for them alone!!) I try to set a budget of £20 per head for them, but its quite tricky as PIL are stinking rich and know the price of everything.

I still buy for my DM as well, because my DF is dead and I want her to have a nice time.

[GrendelsMum]

Go for it! I think an Oliver Cromwell-themed Christmas would make a welcome novelty.

[AngelaDaviesHair]

Stop giving to adult siblings, aunts, uncles and cousins. You can up the spend on birthdays to compensate, if you want. It's a gift to everyone: Christmas is less stressful and expensive.

I reckon it is still nice for partners to exchange presents, as well as parents and children (including adult children) though.