Who is BU? DS1 or Ex's fiancée? Step-parent related.

[TigOldBitties]

Have had a fraught weekend thanks to some issues with DS1. I should firstly say that DS1 is an adult (21 nearly 22) with a child of his own, also that I don't have any particular animosity towards his dad. His dad/Ex is not a horrible person, bit of a womaniser and not been that present in DS1s life at times but has been really trying since DGS was born, plus we split up when I was pregnant and I have been with DH ever since so there are no bitter feelings from me. Although I think DS harbours some resentment.

The fiancée, I'll call her T, (also please bear in mind that his dad has been engaged 3 times previously in the past 10 years and so that status holds little weight) has been with Ex for 3 years, they now live together, she comes across as alright and has 2 children of her own, but generally DS meets his dad outside of ex's house so he see's little of this woman. DS didn't attend their engagement party so in total has met T 6 times.

This weekend DS went to his dads house, where T now lives too, to have lunch and watch the football. He took DGS with him. When DS turned up, T answered the door and said "There's our boy", she then asked "How's my grandson?", DS said he decided to just act normally to this. Apparently, as the day continued, she made lots of comments in reference to DS about being their/our/her son, DGS also being hers/theirs/ours and talking about how they could be a nice little family etc. DS said this was really winding him up, but he wasn't commenting on it. She then made a comment about being his step-mum and how she hoped she could be like a second mum to him, DS then explained to her that he already has a mum but that he was pleased she was making his dad happy.

At this point, which I think was just after lunch, an almighty row kicked off. T accused DS of being rude and ungrateful, being coached by me and indoctrinated to hate her, treating her unfairly because he is very open to my DH (been with me since DS1 was born), not wanting their family to succeed and various other scathing comments about me, DS1 and our family. DS countered that she is crazy, deluded, he barely knows her, his dad has to meet him outside of the house so her children aren't upset, she is just one in a long line of women and lots of equally nasty comments about how dare she speak about our family.

I can't work out who is being unreasonable, obviously the row sounds bad but was DS1 being over sensitive, rude and ungrateful or was she being insensitive, over eager and bit unrealistic in how she thought DS would relate to her? I can go into more detail but this is already too long.

[TigOldBitties]

Sorry Fenton, which baby are you referring to? She doesn't have a baby with ex, sorry if I've given that impression.

[EldritchCleavage]

rip her weave out her head and wring her neck with it

This made me laugh!

[ShinyBauble]

I've had this too! My ex had been seeing his GF for about 6 months when she turned up at our sons birthday party and expressed surprise that I'd been invited! Then the two of them sat facing me and delivered what I can only call an appraisal of my parenting skills and a list of constructive advice. She had no children. I found out through friends that they intended to go for sole custody. Shortly afterwards DS was diagnosed with autism and they lost all interest.

At least he's an adult OP, and he can see all this stuff very clearly for himself.

[Fenton]

I mean your Son's child

[TigOldBitties]

Sorry Fenton I've been doing school run etc, my grandson is actually 4 now, so not really a baby. I probably should have made that clear in the beginning.

And yes Eldritch, I was a tiny bit seething with rage about it! DH did have to death grip me in bed while I whisperingly ranted about my fantasies of weave related injuries I could inflict. Don't know why but an attack on the weave really meets my angry criteria!

TBH I think ex probably expects I will be mightily pissed off about the whole thing and hasn't been in contact for that reason. In the past whenever there has even been a minor issue with DS he would just call me and dump it in my lap so I can only assume that thinking I'm annoyed is why he hasn't been in contact.

[TigOldBitties]

Ok need more advice please because now I am actually struggling to not drive across London to punch the pair of them in their fucking faces!!! DS1 has just come in from work, totally foul mood and of course its because he has spoken to his dad today.

Ex has said the following, (without offering an apology or even any sympathy for how yesterday went):

T is very upset and has decided that she cannot be around DS, she also doesn't want him near her children (he is by this as he's not ever really even spoken with the children) so he can no longer go to their house and she thinks that ex should stop seeing him every other weekend as they currently do.
T also wants an apology from ME (????!!!!) and DS. She thinks I need to look at how I have raised him!!!!!!!!!! T was apparently so angry she was "going off on one' all night and nearly came round here to 'have it out with me"
T was only trying to be nice and make them a proper family and was apparently going to invite DS and his family for Christmas but won't bother now.
Ex then said he doesn't want to get involved and pick sides (how THE FUCK is that supposed to happen) but that he lives with her and their engaged so he's just got to go along with her because of all the "agg" and was then doing all oh you know what women are like kind of speech about DS cutting him some slack.
Ex finished with the comment that maybe they should just "sack it off" and he would try and see DS in December but if not, hopefully in the new year.

DS is really upset, he's stormed off to the gym in tears and now isn't answering his phone, he kept saying why can't his dad ever just pick him.
I am incandescent, I don't even want to speak to my family about it because I know I will get even more worked up. I don't know how to help the situation and I just feel overwhelmed with guilt and anger.

[EldritchCleavage]

That's absolutely awful. Seems T may have known what she was doing-that Ex would take the line of least resistance and drop his son and grandson.

But still-don't speak to your Ex or T, not least because DS may not want you to, and both of you might be better off sleeping on it rather than reacting in anger.

I feel so much for your DS. There's no disguising that he is not very high on his father's priority list.

[ShinyBauble]

If you say anything it will just carry on the drama. Let her vent at your ex.

I would just say though that you seem dismissive of her as a person in your ex's life. A three year relationship seems fairly steady to me. If you really think she could be dumped and forgotten by next week, then don't worry about it. So much of the post is about her.

But his Dad has let him down by saying he won't see him. That is much worse than anything she has done. Maybe you could encourage your DS to focus on his own little family to distract him for a while. Do his girlfriend and baby live with you too?

[FunkyBoldRibena]

I am a step mum and I think she's a bit of a loon to be honest.

I would sit down with your son and ask him what he wants to do and if he wants you to do anything. I would probably persuade him that the best response is no response at all as she is obviously just a loon.

[TigOldBitties]

Hopefully DS will be home soon and we can talk about it more, I am just so angry with ex and myself.

Shiny, I am relatively dismissive of their relationship as its something I've seen so many times before.

Bit of background, ex is someone I've known since I was a child, we went to primary school together, grew up on same estate etc, much like my DH. He was a friend of my DH's brother and is the cousin of one of my very good friends. Its only through her that I have usually been able to track him down in his more absent moments.

In the past 10 years he has had 3 other engagements, on of the relationships lasted four years. He has always admitted, even recently that he's never not cheated in a relationship. He has 2 other children with a woman he saw on and off for 10 years, he has been a shitty to them as to DS and they now all live in majorca and he hasn't seen them in ages too. In the past 21 years I've probably encountered 30 plus women in connection with him, often he's had them on the go at the same time.

He asked T to move in as a sign of commitment after cheating on her, they got engaged for the same reason.

From what DS and my friend say, he is just coasting along in this relationship like all the others, enjoying the rewards until she leaves and he replaces her with someone else within a month or two.

So yes I am dismissive of her, and I suppose DS always has been too, thats probably why he found yesterdays behaviour so annoying.

[misskatamari]

Oh my god your poor son. His dad sounds like a big bloody wimp.

I agree with others that you getting involved is not going to have happy consequences - but I totally understand your want to. T is being completely unreasonable and Ex is behaving like an idiot not standing up to her.

Nothing you say will be able to change that though so just try to be there for your son and help him deal with being utterly let down by his dad again

[ShinyBauble]

But truthfully, that makes me feel a bit sorry for her. It sounds like she's getting treated like shit all around, no wonder she's a bit manic. If he doesn't care about her, why would he stop seeing his son to please her? Maybe like you say, it's one of those situations you have to live, because it doesn't make much sense to me.

It could be the case that she feels under-appreciated (very likely from what you say) and made an effort to try to reach out to your son and build bridges, only to get knocked back. If she did use the wording in your OP, she sounds a bit desperate, but it's your ex who sounds like the villain of the piece.

[ShinyBauble]

Actually OP, I didn't mean for my post to come across as so unsympathetic. Obviously your son is the priority and should be. I hope his Dad grows a pair and calls to apologise.

[TigOldBitties]

Thanks Funky, love that name btw, I think thats the issue if DS does nothing he feels like he won't see his dad and I think he's just reached his limit of being a last thought rather than the priority.

I feel really guilty about it all and I want to help him but truly don't know what to do.

[Dri2]

You all sound like you really like this kind of drama. She was ridiculously overstepping the mark, but was she actually unkind before your DS kicked off? Your anger at the situation can't be helping your son.

[TigOldBitties]

Shiny I don't deny ex is a shit, I really don't. However I have no interest in feeling sorry for this woman, her problems are her own, she is over 30 and has her own children, if she is unhappy in her relationship then thats her lookout and not something that should be of concern for my son.

Thing is with ex, and I'm not sticking up for him, but I know him to some degree, I've been in his life and he in mine for 40 years, I was in a relationship with him and he's spent numerous nights on our sofa/in the spare room since we split. He's a prick of boyfriend, in the sense that he cannot keep it in his pants and is totally unreliable. However he's completely upfront about it all, he's basically a loveable rogue, but he would never be violent, or controlling etc I've wondered whether he has some sort of sex addiction.

I don't think he knows how to be a father or in a long term relationship as his own father was never around and his mum just went from violent man to man so has no example.

I am absolutely furious with him and I do pity T or any woman that has the misfortune to get into a relationship with him a it is such a colossal waste of time but in terms of concern for her at this point or excusing her behaviour now I just cannot find it within myself.

[ShinyBauble]

Yeah, of course. It's easy on MN to look at all angles, I've been on the receiving end of posting a problem and feeling frustrated that some MNers seemed fixated on points that felt totally irrelevant to me!

[FriskyHenderson]

Doesn't sound like there's any need to do anything because she's not likely to be around for much longer. She's acting out of the delusion that every woman wants her man can't think why and as you say, what could be more dramatic and point scoring than getting him to choose her over his son?

Your poor DS though Is he worried he's going to turn out like him?

[TigOldBitties]

Dri2 I resent that comment, I think I've made it clear I'm not enjoying this.

I do have a bit of an issue with my temper but I have been very controlled in that I know I am livid, DH and my parents know, but I have just been 'miffed' to DS and made it clear that its on his behalf, for example he complains and I agree that it is outrageous. I'm keeping a lid on it around him. Please don't mistake my use of mn for venting as a reflection of my real life behaviour.

I certainly don't relish this drama, ex has been the primary cause of drama in my life and I do wish that I could have had a life without him as otherwise my life is very uneventful. This is the first big thing that has kicked off with him in 7 years. Ex is an anything for a quiet life type of bloke so he will just be working on that basis and I am trying to prioritise DS, maybe T is enjoying it but I don't think anyone else is.

[TigOldBitties]

Frisky no I don't think DS is worried about that. I think he may worry how the stuff with his dad will leave him, will he have issues etc. DS has grown up with DH and I, he doesn't remember DH not being around, he doesn't remember a time before DS2 was born, he has always had 2 parents and a stable family, he has just also always had this other man who turns up and has a laugh then normally buggers off for another extended period.

DGS was born when DS was in his late teens, he is still with DGS mother, they are planning on moving in together in 2015. He used to drop DGS to nursery every morning and pick him up every evening, he now does as much childcare as he can and spends lots of time with him and his girlfriend so he is already a much better father than his own. I'm not aware of him cheating either so I think he hasn't got the same issues.

[SarahAndFuck]

I would wonder about two things.

Either she was being over friendly because she was trying to hard to make him like her and she wanted to fit in so to speak. Perhaps to make your ex feel she's fitting in with his family and they like her.

Or she was deliberately doing this to wind him up so she could claim she was 'only being friendly' and he had overreacted and been nasty to her. To cause a rift between your DS and his dad.

I don't think in either case your DS was being unreasonable if he did speak to her the way you said he did in your OP. She made him feel uncomfortable and it sounds like he was direct but polite about that.

[reelingintheyears]

I thought it sounded like she was winding your DS up deliberately too, if she's never been that close to him, having only known him since he was an adult, why else would she suddenly come on all Mumsy.
And she can have only known your DGS since he was one years old, not even since born.
I'd stay away, listen to your DS but reassure him that you and you DH will always love him.

[Thisisaghostlyeuphemism]

Your ds is well out of it. The woman is an idiot and your ex is weak and stupid.

I feel sorry for ds but actually I the long run I think they would bring little to his life. V tough to see him hurt like this though.

I would do nothing, tell ds to do nothing. I bet ds dad will be in touch in December as though nothing has happened.

[TigOldBitties]

I hope you're right. He does seem keen on having a relationship with his dad. I don't think before this I was aware how much he was bothered. I'm still surprised as they really aren't that close, and I did wonder if DS just did it because he felt obliged to but now it seems he gets something out of it.

It does seem as if its been brewing for a long time. As I said in my OP I suspected DS might have a bit of resentment towards his dad but he clearly has quite a bit in regards to the way he's been treated.

Makes me feel very guilty.

[TigOldBitties]

DH has come home and called DS who has said he will come home. He was sitting in Tinseltown apparently