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AIBU?

To think my daughter sticks out like sore thumb as do I?

113 replies

Bellybadge · 20/09/2013 00:15

DD just started school, she is the only Asian child in her class and in the whole of reception I have only seen one other Asian child. She is a very chatty, outgoing little girl.

I am worried about her making friends because although she always tries to chat to the other children they very rarely acknowledge her, all the children in her class seem to know each other as do their mums. I see groups of children from her class playing together or running up to their friends at home time, she calls out to some of them or points them out me and waves at them, but again they ignore her.

I have tried being friendly with other mums during pick up and drop off, nothing over eager but friendly hello's and small talk but mostly they tend to ignore me too (very politely). Sometimes I have been blanked outright even though the other mum saw me smile or obviously heard me say hello or good morning. I don't know if it's because I'm Asian or because I'm not head to toe in Boden, pushing a phil and teds and rocking my large scarf and large satchel ( it's almost as if the parents are wearing a uniform too)

The school is a lot less diverse than I first thought, very white middle class, we wanted to send our child to a good school but I am now not sure we made the right decision and worry that I've just set up the next few years of her being friendless.

She hasn't said anything to me outright but I'm just worried for her. She had lots of friends at her private nursery but then her nursery was very diverse and had kids from many different backgrounds. Please feel free to tell me I'm being a prize berk and totally u.

OP posts:
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BlingBang · 23/09/2013 14:28

Or it could just be more likely that it's early days and folk haven't had much time to integrate yet and some mums will already know each other.

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Wellwobbly · 23/09/2013 10:24

Sorry Amrapaali, to sound crass, what I was trying to convey is more subtle than that.

When you are faced with a situation that is uncomfortable (us third worlders isolated in the playground), the only thing you can control is the way you look at it, and how you react. That is the ONLY thing you have control over.
Wish it were different/they would get a life/stop being so snooty/racist/cliquey/whatever, is a waste of time and attitude.

So I personally find it comforting to know that they feel AKWARD. Which is a fear thing. Which I can do something about it. Which is 1. know it isn't personal, 2. I can do something about.

That was behind my advice to stay patient, and have their children round. Once your child gets friends, the rest follows.

But, if feeling angry or defensive works for you, then go for it!

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Amrapaali · 23/09/2013 10:01

Wellwobbly reassure them? reassure them of what? That the Asian mum standing in the corner isn't an ogre?

Forgive a white person for their "fear"? Fear of what? I hope you didn't mean to sound crass, but your post is coming across like that.

It works both ways, you know. Someone whose cultural/ethnic orgins are different from the country they live in are essentially "guests" in a sense. The "hosts" can also go some way in easing their way into the community, instead of leaving it to the "other" to integrate.

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mummytowillow · 22/09/2013 18:31

When my DD ( 6) started reception I didn't know anyone. Every drop off and pick up I just stood there on my own. Sad

It was awful for about a month, then I went to a school fayre, and got chatting to another mum. Now I have 4 really good mum friends and I'm happy with that.

Give it time its still early days. Wink

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mumofwildthings · 22/09/2013 17:30

I am a white MC, Boden scarf wearing mum to a mixed race DD and DS. My DD goes to an almost entirely Black school, so she sticks out like a sore thumb, as do I! Yes, some of the mums are cliquey and not keen to befriend me, but none of it has held my DD up. She has tonnes of friends, and loves the mix of food she gets a birthday parties!

It takes a while, just keep smiling, being friendly and try not to project. There will always be someone who has a problem with something but remember it's THEIR problem not yours. Our children are growing up in a different time to when we grew up. She'll be fine.

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Wellwobbly · 22/09/2013 11:24

againstthewall, brilliant post!

OP, remember this essential fact: what you describe, comes from fear. People stick to what they know.

So your job (believe me on this one) is to reassure them. Be patient, it takes some time. Carry on being your lovely friendly self, keep asking their children to tea (focus on your daughter's social well being), and your humanity will prevail.

Getting defensive, blaming the situation, forgetting the fear (and your need to forgive them for it) - is counter-productive.

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Wingdingdong · 21/09/2013 11:51

Oops that was long Blush.

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Wingdingdong · 21/09/2013 11:50

Plenty of mothers at our primary school wear Boden - not just white ones! As somebody else said, it's about what's easy. Boden make it easy, shopping online is easy, delivery service is good, there's a 90-day return policy and the clothes wash well and can be tumble-dried. I probably do wear Boden as a kind of uniform, just because it saves thinking...

Whilst the whole Boden thing is really tangential to your OP, the principle at stake's the same. The other mothers are probably not racist in any way (though obvs I'm not there, don't know for sure) but they probably are tired, time-pressured and taking the easy/lazy approach. If they've all known each other from pre-school, it's so much easier just to carry on chatting to the people they know.

Don't forget that pretty much every mother will be concerned about her 4yo starting school for the first time, whether or not they've been to pre-school. They'll be worried about the lunches, about the long days, about whether their child is making friends, about whether the other kids are ahead in various ways, about whether their own child can be relied upon to go to the loo in time, etc... And nervousness is going to make everyone seek security in the certainties of what they do know.

It's hard on you, but I think you're going to have to make a little bit of extra effort. Smiling and saying hello shows you're friendly but doesn't necessarily show that you want to make friends. What do you think you'd tell your DD to do in a similar situation? If she saw a group of children playing together and wanted to join in, would you advise her to stand a little way back and smile/say hello when they passed, or would you suggest ways of being more proactive?

Given that all the mothers will be really focused on their kids, maybe a way in would be to earmark a group of women you like the look of (maybe check out their faces as well as their clothes and buggies Wink), and go up to one or two of them and ask how their DC are settling in. If you think that may be too controversial (eg their child has been seen crying) go for a safe topic - are their DC having school lunches? Do they like them, are they eating anything? Someone's bound to have a fussy eater or a story of how their PFB came home having eaten just pizza, chips, pasta and chocolate cake (my DD!) and everyone else will join in. Or ask if anyone's DC is actually telling them anything about what happened that day at school...

If you find that you're overwhelmed by the mass of uniformity, try turning up early. If you're the first one there for a couple of days you can pick off parents one by one as they arrive. It'll be a lot easier in the next week or so than after half term.

Good luck!

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threelittlebigpigs · 21/09/2013 00:20

My child is mixed race & I did purposely choose a diverse school for her to attend. So far she is playing with lots of different children & is excited about all of them. The fact they are in her class means she thinks they're her friends. She has already commented on a boy in her class being black - merely in a making an observation kind of way - & this surprised me as she is used to being around different ethnicities. I do think that some children are aware of race when they are this age because they are constantly comparing themselves to others. On the playground I have found any one that I've spoken to friendly & happy to chat about any inane school topics. If I don't know someone I find that noticing something about their child is a good ice-breaker & people are usually always comfortable to talk about their son/daughter. Give it time OP & risk a few sentences to the person nearest to you if you're feeling brave. Hopefully, before you know it, you'll be feeling much more comfortable & at ease. I do know quite a few other mums from pre-school so that has been helpful but it doesn't mean that I'm not happy to chat to anyone nearby. I really hope that race issues are not the root of the problem.

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notthefirstagainstthewall · 20/09/2013 23:57

Well is she there as an "Asian" child or a child that doesn't look like all the others? I'm Asian looking (mum from Goa) and personally loved being the girl that had naturally fantastic skin, thick dark hair and Asian figure rather than looking pasty/sunburnt and worrying about having to dye/perm/straighten my mousey brown hair to something more exciting.

I do get that that in largely white middle class area you will be perceived as different.I still get asked "where I'm from" despite being born to a nice farming family in rural Sussex. However mostly it's genuinely from trying to gauge how you'll react to them. People constantly assume I'm vegetarian for example despite being the daughter of gamekeeper.

It's not prejudice, it's not wanting to get it wrong .I find people just avoid if it's not obvious what they should should do. If you are are clear about what you and your values are you'll both make friends with people who are like minded. But you do have you have to make it easy for people. After all that's what Boden and Joules do.

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ukatlast · 20/09/2013 23:57

Quote OP: ( it's almost as if the parents are wearing a uniform too)-
this is what people mean when they moan about the politics of the school gate.
It happens to loads of us: if you are a slightly older mum you may be blanked by the younger ones, if you are overweight, you may be blanked by everyone, if you don't look like the sort of person they want to be friends with for any reason, you may be blanked...so it's not necessarily a race thing at all. Some of them may just have really bad social skills (maybe not in a middle class area so much) and cannot meet your friendly gaze for anxiety reasons.
I would advise you to keep 'trying your best' for the whole year before 'giving up' and I'd be surprised if things didn't improve for your daughter fairly quickly.

I was blanked for a long time when my first child was in reception because I put him in a small village school in England 10 miles away. We were regarded with suspicion but by the end of the year, they had all thawed out and we were doing playdates...then we had to move abroad for DH's work and expat communities were much more welcoming from the 'get go' as friends move on in unstable expat circles so you have to be willing to let newcomers in. You might still get those who can't see past an age difference or weight problem or lack of Boden as you say.

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Bellybadge · 20/09/2013 23:27

Thank you beatricequimby I almost didn't type that for fear of that being jumped on as another example of my own attitude problem or arrogance. Unless you have grown up with that kind of predjudice no matter how subtle you cannot imagine how real it is and also how hurtful it can be when you suspect your own child might have to go through the same thing.

OP posts:
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Bellybadge · 20/09/2013 23:23

I moved to this town several years ago after growing up in a large multicultural city, we chose the school based on the ofstead report, recommendations from friends whose children had attended the school in previous years and also on my ability to take and pick up DD to/from the school with relative ease as I don't have a car and a baby to consider too.

OP posts:
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mumandboys123 · 20/09/2013 22:10

you wanted a 'good' school? what did you look for, exactly? did you assume a 'good' school was one in a middle-class, home-owning area where there are plenty of educated parents, a good portion of mums able to do school runs and who are wearing Boden? or did you actually look at a cross-selection of local schools and make a choice based on what you considered best for your child.

In my experience, the best schools are rarely the ones that anyone wearing Boden whilst sporting a Phil and Teds would look twice at.

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beatricequimby · 20/09/2013 21:50

'As a person of colour I think I do know when I am being blanked due to the colour of my skin.

Absolutely. Me too. And I am not sure if you can really get it if it doesn't ever happen to you. And yes I think children do notice skin colour and ethnicity. Not always but sometimes. They don't necessarily think about it in the same way as adults do but it can occasionally cause issues.

FWIW I was very keen that my mixed race children attend a diverse school. The way it has turned out they have been to two primaries, one very diverse, the other less so. Both have been absolutely fine. I think my desire for a very diverse school was based on my own school experiences in the 70s and 80s. But schools, and many peoples' attitudes have changed for the better since then so the likliehood is that things will be absolutely fine.

I also think that intial cliqueness is often based on kids having been to nursery together and this will stop being an issue over the coming year.

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Teapigging · 20/09/2013 21:48

I agree with those who have said that some people are in denial about subtle forms of racial 'othering' that go on quietly in an everyday basis, and I can understand why the OP is anxious.

I don't think anything in her post necessarily suggests ethnicity is an issue here. Having said that, I have recently moved from a diverse bit of London to a very white village near a city with a large population of ethnic minorities, and I am gobsmacked at the generalising, often negative comments by apparently benign, educated white people about 'the Asians'. Including the 'Asian driving' of non-village mothers dropping their kids off at the village school.

Good luck, OP. I hope your anxieties turn out to be groundless.

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strangething · 20/09/2013 21:48

I got to the end of primary school before realising that, you know, the reason Sophie had browner skin and hair than most of the other kids in my white middle class school was because her parents were from a different country, I thought that was just how Sophie looked. I knew Jaya's parents were from India (same as Sophie's) because her Mum came in around the time of Diwali and showed us how to make Indian sweets. So I just don't think kids see that kind of thing.. like others say more likely to be that they know each other and so u feel uncomfortable.

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Retroformica · 20/09/2013 21:44

There will be other mums with reception kids just like you - ie) new, yet to make friends etc. target the other new bees for play dates at the park or house.

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Mumzy · 20/09/2013 21:34

By the way you will be spending at least 7 years in the school playground you are only 3 weeks in which is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Echoing what others say The friends for your dd and yourself will come.

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Mumzy · 20/09/2013 21:27

If your Dcs start school knowing no one it can take time for you to make a set of friends there. Everyone is sizing each other up as no one wants to be stuck win the clingy or mad parents you'll soon find out who they are. I suggest be friendly and you'll soon find quite a few parents n he Same situation as you.

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BettyBotter · 20/09/2013 20:58

We live in an almost completely monocultural area. My dcs are mixed race (but I'm the white half or their mixture) and for a while I felt very out of the loop in the playground. It wasn't because of their ethnicity but just because most of the dcs had been to a preschool that ds hadn't been to. All the mums already knew each other. But within a couple of months the invitations to tea had started and once the dcs got to be friends, the mum friends follow naturally.

Another thought. I have taught (KS2) in 99% white British areas and the absolute opposite in extremely mixed multi ethnic parts of London. IMO the children in the monocultural schools have been more inclusive towards the few children of other ethnicities coming into the school than those in the very mixed area, perhaps because the dc wasn't part of an identifiable group but was just another child. In the very mixed schools children were much more aware of their own ethnicity and ethnic groupings - not a bad thing; but it did mean that as they got older the prejudices of parents started to show through (Turkish kids told not to be friends with Greek kids etc).

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aintnothinbutagstring · 20/09/2013 20:32

My dds school is a bit like that op, ie. there is a mum uniform (if you want to partake in it, I don't) and its a predominantly white middle class area. Luckily theres a good number of asian, latin, black, mixed race (my dd is mixed, black african and I'm white), if not for that I'd think about moving.

There will be some lovely normal mums if you have a good look. And children will choose their own friends regardless who their mum is friends is with. My dd is best friends with alpha-pta-mum's dc (probably much to her distaste!).

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Dobbiesmum · 20/09/2013 20:23

2 points for you:

  1. we are not exactly in a multi cultural area, I can count the amount of Asian families with children at our primary school on 2 fingers. When I see the children at pick up and drop off they're surrounded by friends, just like everyone else. My DD has a little crush on one of the boys btw Smile
  2. I get ignored by most of the Mums too, for no other reason except the all have their own little groups they automatically fall into in the playground. (No Boden or Phil and Teds here, it's more of a 'look at my second hand bargain type of place!)
    What happens to you isn't a reflection on what will happen to your children, please try not to worry too much, she will make her own friends in her own time.
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HeadsDownThumbsUp · 20/09/2013 20:17

Agree that you don't sound sneery in the least. Other posters are attacking you for the most peripheral element of your post. Funny way to show you that there's nothing else going on...

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Wilberforce2 · 20/09/2013 20:14

My ds5 has just started in reception class in a white middle class school (we are white) and a lot of the Mum's are exactly the same sadly. A lot of them know each other from pre school (there are 8 kids in his class from the same one) and I have tried to join in conversations and say hello but I get nothing back. We are only two weeks in so I'm hoping it improves!

I know that my little boy doesn't notice race yet he just notices hair colour and what kind of bag/packed lunch box the other kids have, so I would doubt that the children are not including your daughter because you are Asian.

Really hope things get better for you, it's not nice x

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