to want to ask those who intend to vote UKIP a few questions about their policies?

[PdHeatonsingingfafafa]

Let me ask you this. Has anybody here actually looked at UKIP policies? If so, perhaps you can answer some questions for me.
1: UKIP say they want an amicable divorce from the EU. How smoothly do they believe that can happen?

1. UKIP want a 5 year hold on immigration. To do so, they think that it is essential to leave the EU as the EU allows citizens of member states to move freely. Ok, what happens to the 2.2 million Brits living in other EU nations? Do we force them to return? It has to work both ways. 3: A flat tax rate can never work. I imagine this is why the party cannot decide whether or not they should have 1 rate or 2. Their 2010 proposal was a rate of 31% for everybody. That is evidently a major tax break for the rich whilst the poor pay more. Is this something you support?
   

4: A return to the grammar school education model would see communities being ripped in half and children unfairly separated. Who here thinks that is a good idea?
5: UKIP want to increase defence spending to facilitate the building of extra warships and nuclear weapons. When a member or supporter asks why soldiers aren't paid more, be sure to also ask why they'd squander money on these projects?
6: UKIP oppose the HS2 because of the damage it would do to the countryside. However, they also support fracking which would cause even greater damage. How can there be such contradiction? They also oppose manmade climate change. On what evidence do they take this stance?
7: UKIP plan to double prison spaces. How do they propose to fund the building of new prisons and of keeping twice as many inmates? Who will take up these extra spaces? What crimes will become punishable by incarceration? Who will suffer from cuts made elsewhere to fund this?
8: UKIP is proposing "tens of billions" of tax cuts and had set out £77bn of cuts to public expenditure to deal with the deficit. Where will these cuts be made? After increased military and prison spending, the cuts in public spending will have to be a lot higher to compensate.
9: They wish to repeal the hunting ban. This appeals to a minority of people whereas the majority of the country supports the hunting ban. Can you guess which section of society would benefit from the repeal?

It seems to me that most of these policies were plucked from thin air to try and hide the fact that they are a one policy party. Perhaps, by answering these questions, you can change my mind?

[ThingsThatGoBumpInTheNight]

Not a ukip fan either but their proposals for family and disabled/disability policy look pretty good although a work in progress I'm told because they didn't have many policies set in stone until earlier this year

[Ericaequites]

I'm an American, a registered Republican since my 18th birthday. I find the Tea Party faintly embarrassing, but they are alive and well.
The UK was mad to link up with the EU, and would be better off without them. Not everything in their Manifesto could be implemented, but less regulation and home rule are fine things.

[aardvark99]

Well done claig and WetAugust. Many cogent points raised.

I shall be voting UKIP at all future elections.

[claig]

Oh, and most of the the other points that the OP mentioned, thinking that no one could possibly be in favour of, such as a flat-rate tax and the return of grammar schools, and more prisons and tougher sentences for criminals etc, I as an old-school Thatcherite Tory am in favour of. Because two things are for certain - I am no progressive and 'manmade climate change' is a fraud.

So let the revolution continue, let there be an end to the climate catastrophe spinners, so the people can once again be winners!

[claig]

"Claig please tell me that you are a Tory Party mole, trying to destroy UKIP from the inside?"

I abandoned the Tories at the local elections and voted UKIP. I am not sure if I will return to the Tories for the general elections. I probably won't because in my area there is no danger of a vote for UKIP allowing the flint-faced former communists to sneak into power.

So I will probably stay with UKIP since I agree with them on leaving the EU, on mercury-free lightbulbs, on no GM crops and on their belief that 'manmade climate change' is a fraud.

[claig]

"You also seem to have invested their leader with almost messianic qualities, you also make reference to 'the revolution' on a couple of occasions and forecast landslide election victories on a scale unseen in British politics."

Composhat, you have to get a bit of a sense of humour. I am having a laugh. I am bigging up UKIP and the revolution for a bit of a laugh. The more I exaggerate about the scale of the revolution and the coming tidal wave under the leadership of the great Farage and the demise of the progressives, the more of a laugh I am having.

Even though I would like to believe that what I say is true, I know that alas it cannot all come to pass, but nevertheless there is always truth in jest.

So let the revolution carry on and let the progressives sing their swan song!

[ComposHat]

They apologised about their 'light touch regulation'. They will apologise about this when it is finally exposed.

claig There is a difference between a failure to regulate properly as happened in the financial crisis and a gigantic global conspiracy of the type you envisage happening in climate change. If you can't understand the difference, there really is no hope for you.

With reference to the financial crash, do you really think Nigel Farage as an ex stock broker, and the leader of a party almost totally bankrolled by an investment banker [Stuart Wheeler] who was hugely enriched by the 'big boom' in the city would have introduced more stringent regulation of the city?


As someone mentioned upthread, you appear to have mixed up a load of pet left wing and right wing complaints and arbitrarily decided that UKIP is the solution. You also seem to have invested their leader with almost messianic qualities, you also make reference to 'the revolution' on a couple of occasions and forecast landslide election victories on a scale unseen in British politics.

Please don't try and back track on your use of the term revolution, you've used it so many times that it would be disturbing if it wasn't so comic.

It will be a tidal wave of such proportions that the liars, cheats and frauds won't know what to do.

Don't kid yourself about UKIP. this is a revolution.

Be under no illusion, the rise of UKIP is a revolution, it is the rise of the people against the privileged progressives who have conned us for so long.

Change is coming, the people are rising and the elite is declining.

Claig please tell me that you are a Tory Party mole, trying to destroy UKIP from the inside?

[claig]

And if you can't debate me, then why don't you debate the rest of the excellent posters on this thread such as WetAugust, or are you finding it difficult to find answers in the New Labour manual of spin for her too.

[claig]

"claig appears to be so indoctrinated that she simply doesn't see anything around her"

Hold on, its called thinking outside of the box.
I answered every one of your points and you have been unable to challenge any single point. If you have any good New Labour/progressive arguments then let us hear them and I will refute them one by one.

[PdHeatonsingingfafafa]

I haven't backed out of the debate, I was simply busy with real life stuff. Plus, claig appears to be so indoctrinated that she simply doesn't see anything around her. There's no point trying to debate with somebody like that.

[Caster8]

I thought the op did want to start a proper debate, as she[I presume] listed some detailed points. But she is not interested in peoples' answers to them. And now people are listening to the points in her post, she appears not to like it. It has backfired on her. I wonder how her facebook post is going. Not on facebook properly, so I wouldnt know.

[TraceyTrickster]

I was lucky enough to go to grammar school. My very working class parents had not a clue about education but due to this move, I benefited hugely. Made loads of lovely friends- kids from my primary went to a host of schools.
I am a huge fan of grammar schools.
And just because a child wants to go to uni, does not mean they should- if it is of no possible benefit (ie not academically cut out for it), why send them?

The OP seems to want to start a bunfight.

[claig]

Oh and also use of revolution is intended to have a comic effect since revolution' is an exaggeration of what is really happening. We can but dream.

[claig]

UKIP won't get 50% overnight. It won't happen by the next election, but rest assured that the progressives know it is coming and are conniving, ducking and diving and every one of their age old lies reviving, in an attempt to forestall the inevitable.

'but there is no giant global conspiracy to explode'
They apologised about their 'light touch regulation'. They will apologise about this when it is finally exposed.


"We have had rainy days but now we will see the sun, the revolution has just begun"

I am using the word 'revolution' as a joke since revolutions are usually socialist uprisings of the people, but this is an uprising of the people which is not socialist. And I am also using the word revolution to highlight the tidal wave of UKIP support and the real as opposed to the phoney catastrophic climate change that it will bring to the opposition parties.

[ComposHat]

They called Farage a fruitcake and implied he was unhinged. To be compared with such a great figure as Farage is an honour that money can buy

Tweasels thanks for pointing that out, how the fuck did I miss it? Laughed so hard I had a coughing fit.

I think it was Claig's stupidest post on this thread, although there are some crackers take this one:

Now UKIP are 25%

-Most opinion polls put them on about 11%.

what will they do when UKIP is 50%

It won't happen, not least because they are a single issue protest party, campaigning on an issue that comparatively few people get very vocal about. But mainly because no political party has managed to win 50% of the popular vote in a general election since 1931. Claig do you really think UKIP will win an unprecedented landslide in the next general election?


they will all start apologising for climate change and admitting that it was all a sham, as UKIP expose their shameless scam

I hate to point out that a minor flaw in this brilliant piece of rhetoric, but there is no giant global conspiracy to explode. But don't let that get in your way.

We have had rainy days but now we will see the sun, the revolution has just begun

Y'know how you got really cross when people called your beloved leader and his party a bunch of fruitloops and closet fascists. It doesn't really help when you write things like the above, which sound like they came from an early and even more batshit crazy draft of Mein Kampf

[Tweasels]

I joined in earlier, and backed out laughing.

Nothing in life will ever, ever be as funny as this comment:


"They called Farage a fruitcake and implied he was unhinged. To be compared with such a great figure as Farage is an honour that money can buy"

[claig]

'I think most of MN are too busy laughing at this thread to join in.'

Well then they need to stop laughing at the OP and tell the OP why they support UKIP!

[usualsuspect]

I think most of MN are too busy laughing at this thread to join in.

[Caoilainn]

I live in Kent, number 4 of your list already happens. Why not grammar all over?

[ComposHat]

blackcats thanka for joining, It was like being caught in the middle of UKIP circle jerk.

[WetAugust]

Lol Caster

Un-looned by association?

[Caster8]

When Cameron had to stop insulting the UKIP voters because there were too many of them, and too many potential voters, I did wonder when is a loon not a loon? When there are too many of them?! So were the original ones not loons to start with, or are there just more of them now, so they cant have been loons to start with?!

[claig]

"Craig, you seriously sound unhinged."

They called Farage a fruitcake and implied he was unhinged. To be compared with such a great figure as Farage is an honour that money cannot buy!

[WetAugust]

Very true Babybarrister. UKIP always do well in the European elections but so far have failed to translate that to success in the domestic Parliament. This time I predict they will probably do even better in the MEP elections and by 2015 it will all have been forgotten by the time we vote in that General Election.

What would, I think, sway it for UKIP would be for Nigel to be included in a TV debate with the big 3. He is an outstanding orator (when he's not insulting people). Some of his European Parliament speeches predicting the Euro crisis and Greek problems are very persuading. It could produce another 'Cleg effect'.

However I very much think that none of the 'big 3' would debate on TV with him.

[blackcats73]

I'm watching this thread with amusement. It's refreshing to read non standard mumsnet views.

However I agree with compos. Craig, you seriously sound unhinged. If you lot ever had any power I'm emigrating to a nice civilised European country, Holland poor Germany I think!!