to think that this teacher should keep his job?

[kweggie]

Dean Macfarlane, a teacher,who faced 18 months of abuse from schoolchildren is facing the sack after pushing a boy who spat at him
He became frustrated after being hit with snowballs and said youths had gone into his garden and damaged property. Macfarlane was handed a community order after admitting assault but he fears he may lose job he has had for 34 years at school in Doncaster .
I read this and wondered what had happened to the kids who apparently harrassed him, trespassed and spat at him? What would you say to your children?

[curlew]

"Hard to believe this particular busybody was taken seriously."

Yep. Very hard.

It wouldn't have happened like that in England, if that's any consolation.

[meddie]

I feel so sorry for him. 34 years to the teaching profession and these utterly vile kids torment him for 18 months until the point where he snaps and pushes one into a hedge and yet ultimately he is the one who is punished. This just sends out the message that kids are untouchable and can do whatever the fuck they want without fear.
I doubt for a minute whether they will even feel a hint of remorse for potentially costing this man his career and pension he has worked so hard for.

Yes he's the adult, but where was his protection? where was his right to go about his life without constant harassment?
Its crazy. Unfortunately asking kids like this nicely to stop their abuse towards him would only be met with derision and an increase in the tormenting, they know the system, they know that they can get away with it. He must have felt utterly helpless to stop it.

[Floggingmolly]

But it was only the loony lady who suspected abuse! The incident occurred in front of the entire class and their parents, including the parents of the child in question. There should have been no question of her being listened to, as she obviously had her own idiotic axe to grind.

[Theexisapsychocunt]

this is the end result

This is the end result of what happens when youths are left with no respect.

I just googled there are countless examples.

[curlew]

Don't worry, flogginmolly- it probably never happened. Or if it did, there was far more to it than we know.

[Theexisapsychocunt]

And can I add that nothing has been learned from this man's death and gangs continue to torment the local residents (I know the area well).

[BoneyBackJefferson]

curlew
"The hand holding incident would not have been dealt with like that in an English school."

Lol. It is too laugh.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

curlew read Generation F by Winston smith or just googie his blog "Working with the Underclass", it may put some of the stuff that would never happen in England in a different light.

[phantomnamechanger]

poor sod is all I can say really.
I just hope he is not a suicide risk.

feral kids are a huge problem in this country and some parents have no idea at all what their darlings are getting up to, both in and out of school. out of sight out of mind.
the culture is deny & claim victimisation, teacher has it in for my kid, or say poor little X , he just got in with the wrong crowd - when X is the bloody ring leader!

[phantomnamechanger]

as a former teacher, TA and now a parent helper, I can say the hand holding thing is completely OTT and the complaining parent must have had an axe to grind or been off her trolley.

what do you do when a child runs up and hugs you- shove them away?(but then that's assault too!)

I'd far rather my DC were taught by warm hearted friendly teachers than cold stand-offish ones.

[curlew]

"curlew
"The hand holding incident would not have been dealt with like that in an English school."

Lol. It is too laugh."

Sorry?

[BoneyBackJefferson]

Your post shows a huge level of naivety, I have seen similar levels of investigation when a pupil climbed in through a classroom window at break and the teacher who was inside the classroom had the audacity to stop them.

[curlew]

Yeah, sure you have.

Did you know they've banned Christmas, too?

Oh, and you're not allowed to drink black coffee?

[BoneyBackJefferson]

Its a shame that you don't believe curlew but the truth is that I really couldn't give a monkeys whether you believe me or not.

It really is just your naivety shining through.

I'm almost willing to bet that you don't believe that the complaint about inappropriate touching would have gone straight up to a "safeguarding" issue.

Oh and by the way I have a bridge to sell if your interested, only one careful owner.

[phantomnamechanger]

I know of a case where a PITA pupil was put in detention by an NQT for foul and sexually suggestive language. Aside from all the admin of incident reports sent to the tutor for pupil file, issuing detention slips (ripped up by PITA), kid still being a PITA in subsequent lessons etc etc, failing to turn up to first detention, this then involved the deputy head phoning the parent to explain the problem and set up the detention, the head of year collecting the kid from the last lesson of the day to escort them to the detention and the head of dept standing guard on the door to prevent them walking out. They decided to try the window instead - 2nd floor - head of dept then leapt across the room and grabbed the kid who was half out the window by the scruff of the neck FOR THEIR OWN SAFETY - cue screaming and shouting from kid about abuse and I'll have you and all the rest of it. Teacher concerned was in fear of suspension pending full investigation. Thankfully common sense prevailed and it all blew over. But never underestimate the power that pupils actually have over staff, and the trouble is - they know it.

[youarewinning]

I don't think he should lose his job.

He was assaulted and he retaliated in self defence. I defy anyone to stand there and accept being spat at without moving a muscle after 18 months of abuse - just because they work with children

[kali110]

He shouldnt have put his hand in the child, bug should he have lost his job or got a conviction? No it shouldnt have even of gone to court! Was this guy not even allowed to defend himself?
Problem is these kids know they can do anything because they know they can get away with it! Im disgusted. Disgusted that their parents let them get away with it

[kali110]

Plus why should he have had to move? This guy was innocent. This country does piss me off sometimes, criminals have more rights than victims.

[Crumbledwalnuts]

Perhaps people with less personal and direct experience of this kind of problem are more inclined to be understanding towards the harassers.

[curlew]

I am not even remotely sympathetic or understanding towards his harassers. They are obviously gits.

That is quite a separate issue from whether or not somebody with a conviction for assaulting a child should be a teacher.

[Crumbledwalnuts]

Perhaps I just mean people with less personal and direct experience of this kind of problem who have a sort of naivete as a result about human reactions after 18 months of bullying.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

How can you view the harassment as a separate issue, it is the prime cause for the whole incident.

If they hadn't been harassing him the "child" would never have been pushed.

[curlew]

OK. We have very few facts. All we know for sure is that he admitted assaulting a child and was given a community order for it.

We know there was harassment. We don't know whether the child he assaulted was part of that. We don't know how far the police were involved, or what the magistrate said about it, or whether the harassment was taken into consideration, or anything. So all we can say for sure is that as he now has a conviction, he can't be a teacher any more. Sad, but true.

[babybythesea]

My family are teachers and as a consequence so are most of our family friends.

I have seen 3 incidents happen to various people:

1. Teacher beaten up in his office by a parent, and pretty badly worked over. Parent was charged, teacher kept at it for a bit but couldn't stand the idea it might happen again and gave up, and moved cities.
   
2. Teacher accused of hitting child, in a classroom full of children and another TA, all of whom saw nothing. However, teacher was suspended while a 'proper' enquiry was held, with the threat of loss of pension. Teacher came close to breakdown because he was close to retirement (about 3 years away) and was terrified he'd lose the means to live. Proved innocent in a month (yes, 'tis how long it took the formal enquiry to proceed and deliver it's conclusion, despite TA saying from the outset there was no way it happened as she was there). Teacher packed in teaching 6 months later.
   
3. Almost identical incident to that described by Midnite, except the teacher in this case was persuading a reluctant child into the classroom by holding out her hand and saying "Come on, we've got lots of fun things to do, like painting, today." Parent of another child witnessed and made complaint. Teacher was investigated, although three weeks later was declared 'innocent'. Teacher is still teaching but was under huge stress and is now terrified of putting another foot wrong as it is on her record.
   
   Quite a few are now extremely wary of how they touch children to comfort them etc (and by that I mean whether they hold hands, or offer a quick hug).

[BoneyBackJefferson]

"We don't know whether the child he assaulted was part of that."

Macfarlane said that he was involved,

"he can't be a teacher any more."

if it is decided that it will go to a formal hearing that will be down to the misconduct panel.

As to whether a school will employ someone with that on their CRB is another matter.