To expect my ex to spend his contact time with DD together?

[ItsDecisionTime]

I've posted here before about the trials and tribulations of my DD not waiting to travel to the USA this summer for an extended period of time. Unfortunately, with 2 weeks to go, and DD already on school holidays, we still have no firm arrangements in place.

Last night on the telephone, DD 12 - for the first time - decided to initiative and tell her dad that she didn't want to spend 5 weeks overseas in the summer but would prefer him to travel to the UK and spend time with him here so she can introduce him into her life. It resulted in a shouting match between the two of them and she ended up being both proud of herself for very eloquently putting her point across but at the same time, visibly upset by his reluctance to back down.

During the course of the conversation, it transpired that, for a period of 5 weeks, he only intends to take off 7 days holiday and the remainder of the time will organise for her to attend activity groups from 8am to 6pm every week day. Not only is this DDs worst nightmare but what's the bloody point? He's dragging me through the courts to increase his time with her on the basis that he only gets to see her in the summer yet can't even be freaking bothered to organise the time off.

I've looked after her on my own over the school holidays for the past 6 years and have taken unpaid leave to cover any period I was unable to take annual leave.

Anyone have any constructive thoughts on what I should do next? I guess I'll be in court any day soon but they aren't yet aware that he isn't going to take the time off if she goes over there. Thank you.

[financialwizard]

Time my ex is also about the money and we had exactly the same situation. Eventually the judge told him to wind his neck in but it took a few hearings with the ex not getting proper representation for the judge to do so. Ex was happy forking out for letters but not the presence of his solicitor at court. Deluded fool.

[JackieTheFart]

Wow. What a complete and utter arse!

[flippinada]

What a difficult situation. I think you've handled this very well and you've obviously done a great job with your DD who sounds thoughtful and mature.

Your ex sounds like an absolute dick. Isn't it sad that he'd rather "win" than spend time with his daughter? Says a lot about what kind of person he is.

[NancyOsbourne]

I have no advice at all but I just wanted to say from someone who doesn't have a relationship with their father since my parents divorce, that your daughter sounds like she is amazing, mature, bright and strong. At nearly 20 years her senior I wish I had her strength.

OP I think you sound like you are being incredibly fair and justified.

[ItsDecisionTime]

Thanks everyone. Next available directions hearing is 5th August so we can relax at least until then. Off on holiday on Friday and we are really looking forward to it.

Wonder if ex has worn a strip in his carpet yet pacing up and down thinking of the mistakes he's made and the consequences. I hope so.

[digerd]

Oh dear. Your ex is behaving like a defiant, stroppy, irrational teenager, and your amazing DD as a responsible, considerate, mature woman. He should be so proud of her instead of being obsessed with his own ridiculous issues. That threatening text to you was just

[Cherriesarelovely]

Tbh which of us would cope with that situation, even as an adult?

[Cherriesarelovely]

Poor you and your Dd. Just cannot understand how your ex can't see how difficult this would be for his dd. Being in a different country, away from all her friends, being sent to activity groups for such a long day with complete strangers. He is being totally selfish. Your Ddsounds brilliant. Why on earth can't he just accept your Dd going for the week he is off? There is NO way my Dd would cope with that situation and no way I would make her.

[exoticfruits]

Surely your daughter 's wishes are taken into account if she is 12yrs old? She sounds very mature because she has come up with alternative suggestions. I wouldn't have gone to day care at 12 yrs and certainly not in a foreign country.

[MadameGazelleIsMyMum]

Good for your daughter, able to express herself so well. Sorry you have such a twat of an ex. Keep taking your solicitor's advice and hopefully the Court will see the self interest behind your ex's actions.

[DoubleLifeIsALifeHalved]

Your daughter sounds lovely, and I bet you're very proud of her :)

Your ex on the other hand, is a selfish brat.

[bubblebabeuk]

Marking my place. I really feel for you OP xxx

[sashh]

OP


Put parental controls on so if it is brought up in court you can say you were not expecting it etc and that it can't happen again by accident.

It sounds like he doesn't want to compromise but, here is another possible one, could one of your dd's friends go with her? Maybe not for the whole 5 weeks but for a a week or a fortnight.

That way she would have someone with her at whatever activities he has arranged.

I think the idea of spending some time with her grandfather is also a good one. Could grandad visit your ex and do a few things with dd rather than the activities?

[ChippingInWiredOnCoffee]

What an utter bastard - can't think why he's your ex

Your daughter sounds lovely - I would hope the courts would listen to her if it came to it... but really, it's all bluff isn't it, there's no way he's going to take you to court in the UK is there?!

I wouldn't allow her GF to be responsible for her - there's no way he's going to stop his son taking her out and then he couldn't make him bring her back, you can't give someone responsbility for something they have no control over.

Keep her here, as she wishes, and let the stupid twat try to deal with it through the courts.

[ItsDecisionTime]

Jedward understand what you're saying but I wasn't even at home and we certainly weren't expecting anything from him and certainly nothing so vile. I think the fault lies with him for sending it, not me for unwittingly not putting measures in place to ensure DD doesn't see anything he may send at some point.

[JedwardScissorhands]

You need to make sure your emails don't just pop up. It could appear in Court like a deliberate sabotage of the father/daughter relationship, as has been said.

[TalkativeJim]

I would absolutely not allow her to go to the States to stay with your ex's father - surely that's putting her at similar risk of not being returned?

Your ex has parental responsibility: there is nothing to stop him going to his father's and taking her. I would think that you would be able to get her back, but I simply wouldn't take the risk of such a horrible situation arising.

Sounds peverse but I'm glad your ex has shown the colours you know him to have: he will now have no chance of forcing your daughter to visit or getting his way on anything in court. I daresay she will stop contact with him altogether anyway: his own fault entirely.

I would assume that she's had a rather lonely and possibly quite horrible time visiting him in the past. He sounds a nasty, nasty bully.

[SquinkiesRule]

What a vile man he is, I can understand why she doesn't want to spend the whole summer with him.

She sent him an email after the conversation to say she didn't want to upset him at all but wasn't going to the US this year and that was it. He replied her saying he had rights and the courts would rule in his favour. He didn't care what she wanted as life isn't always about what she wants. Left her feeling quite upset.

Furthermore, I received the most vile email calling me a rotten, no good, manipulative bitch who is sick in the head and needs help. Even said he will issue an injunction to stop me taking her away next week on a UK holiday

Save the emails, take them to your solicitor and let him take it to court. I thought it was the child who has rights to see the father not the other way round.
In fact I'd save all the emails, print them off and show the solicitor, he tells you to "watch your back" he shouldn't get any time with your Dd unsupervised in another country, let him go to court and let your Dd stick up for herself, I wouldn't force her or try to persuade her to go at all, she's quite a feisty girl.

[ThisWayForCrazy]

My husband can't take off all the time we have his boys. But they don't go in to sessions or anything, I have them.

I don't think he is unreasonable to not take 5 full weeks off in one go. But clearly this isn't going to work so he is going to have to compromise somewhere.

[ItsDecisionTime]

Can I just say that I didn't show DD the email. It popped up on my iPad as she was using it and read it as it was addressed from her dad.

I can, with my hand on my heart, say I don't want to come between DD and her dad. However, she has opinions - based on what, I don't know as she won't reveal her actual underlying reasons for not wanting to go. He is the so called responsible adult and should start acting like one.

I've said all along her that this started within days of me asking him to pay child support. Interestingly, in one of his abusive emails, he even refers to it saying I forged my payslips, P60 and letter from my HR manager at the time to pretend to earn more than I did therefore putting him in a position where he had to start paying. That's all this has ever been about. Revenge. I know this guy inside out and what makes him tick is money.

If he had DD's interests at heart, he would concede to her wishes initially, start to build bridges and work up to her spending more time with him. He has now firmly shot himself in the foot. There is to be no contact in the short term and a guardian will be appointed to DD together with her own legal representative to get to the bottom of why she is so desperate for short amounts of contact.

The police officer's interpretation of his email is that DD is at risk of being taken to the US and not returned. That, together with his volatile attitude means I will not, under any circumstances allow him to take her out of the country for a day, never mind 5 weeks.

Lasvegas It is a good idea to ask her GF if she can stay with him. I'm going to suggest that at the hearing as long as he is happy to take full responsibility for her while she's there.

[LineRunner]

The judge will still want to see evidence of an attempt at compromise from all parties, not just from the one on the receiving end of the unpleasant emails.

[PrettyPaperweight]

How did your DD know that he had called you a bitch via email, unless you told her or showed her the email. He does sound awful, but it isn't fair to colour your DD's judgement of her dad. Your DD shouldn't be privy to the sordid details of grown up arguments.

I agree. In the US, that kind if evidence is frequently used to support allegations of alienation and the UK courts are slowly adopting that view.
Placed in front of the right (or wrong) judge, evidence that the OP has shared with her DD the sordid details of the emails between them, she (the OP) may very well have provided her DDs dad with evidence to support his case.

[Lasvegas]

OP reading this makes me wonder if he would prevent her from returning to UK, if it was not on a date he approved of. If he wanted her to stay for 5 weeks and she wanted 2 weeks. What is to ensure that he put her on a plane home.?

My cousin had to spend 6 weeks every summer holidays visiting his dad in USA. Turns out dad was rarely at home and step mum was awful to him. As an dad now himself he never sees his father anymore.

[Snazzywaitingforsummer]

at the 'it's not about what you want all the time' from father to daughter. He sounds like a complete dick.

In one last throw of the dice, how about suggesting to her that she books a two week holiday to see her grandfather in Atlanta, and then she can suggest to her father that either a) he can come down to see her there for a few days, or b) she could add on a week where she comes to see him. Do that by email and then if he refuses there is hard evidence that he is a dick who only cares about getting his way rather than actually seeing his daughter.

[JedwardScissorhands]

How did your DD know that he had called you a bitch via email, unless you told her or showed her the email. He does sound awful, but it isn't fair to colour your DD's judgement of her dad. Your DD shouldn't be privy to the sordid details of grown up arguments.