to think the teacher shouldn't have called DN a bloody stupid twat?

[wetspringday]

DN was working on a compter yesterday and leaned back in his chair (shouldn't have done this) but he knocked over a cup of coffee that went over coursework. The teacher yelled at DN and called him a bloody stupid twat.

DN wasn't bothered and seemed to find it quite funny but I think I'd probably have to say something to the teacher concerned along the lines of it not being acceptable. DN is in Year 10 by the way (15.)

AIBU?

[olivertheoctopus]

I'd be cross, yes. No teacher should swear at their pupils. And they prob shouldn't leave cups of coffee next to coursework either but she's presumably cross with herself about that particular fact.

[GoblinGranny]

And you know what?
A lovely big mug of sweet delicious coffee help you do that.
Or three.

[Picturepuncture]

So yes then.

[xylem8]

'are we all so blood thirsty that we cannot accept teachers have bad days, are human and may occasionally lose it.'

..being professional means keeping a lid on your emotions and NOT losing it!

[Blissx]

cory (love your very well thought out posts by the way) - when you say "Mummy shouldn't deal with it", in the case of the OP, "Aunties shouldn't deal with it' either!

As not only the student but the parents were not offended by the outburst, it should end there. The Aunt shouldn't have wanted to involved and that is what most of the initial posts were saying. Then it got weird after some MNetters focused on the hot drink. The OP has long gone from this thread-I can see why!

[TwistTee]

I think what people are missing here is that this wasn't normal behaviour for the teacher. The shock from the other children suggests this. No, it isn't acceptable, but are we all so blood thirsty that we cannot accept teachers have bad days, are human and may occasionally lose it.

My mum, former teacher in a country were corporal punishment was the norm, but who never hit a child, once lost it with a teenage girl who disrupted the class to the point the lesson couldn't continue and then refused to leave the class. Mum picked up a black board ruler and smacked it across a desk in anger. It broke, the girl left the class in shock and mum came home so upset with herself. It is one of the few times I have seen my mum cry and she is fairly tough. She was a great teacher as many of her former students will testify to, but on this one occasion she felt she let herself and her class down by letting the girl get the better of her.

[cory]

My children are enormously precious to me. If they were struggling or suffering or unable to cope I would be right there for them. What they don't need is for me to intervene when they are already coping.

This 15yo was not struggling or upset: he was amused at the teacher's faux pas.

He was not upset so he doesn't need help with that aspect.

He was amused which shows he recognises the incongruity of it- in other words, he doesn't need help to understand that swearing in a professional setting is wrong; he already does.

I don't see what he needs help with.

[C999875]

Cory. I hate to differ with you here, but my child is a teenager and please believe me if anyone refered to here as a "twat" then I'd be dealing with it! Not even I use bad language to here so I would no way in hell let anyone else do it. Although I do agree with letting them sort things out to a certain degree, Parents wont be there forever, but the use of offensive language by a teacher to me is crossing the line.
I get the impression that a lot of people seem to think parents should see their children/neices/nephews as precious when they reach their teens, but all children are precious to their familes regardless of their ages.
Let's be honest if this lady's D.N was 5 you'd all be up in arms and saying "Go in sort it out, How dare she talk like that to a young child", and yes rightly so. Yet because he's 15 some people seem to think they should just get over it. Also is there any wonder why some teenagers do not know how to use acceptable language when professional adults cannot control their language. Or, is it another case of do as I do not as I say. xxx

[cory]

KellyElly Wed 22-May-13 09:23:25
"If you called a client or colleague a twat in the workplace it wouldn't be acceptable. As the classroom if the teacher's workplace then it's clearly not acceptable. A twat is not on a par with cunt granted, but it's the same as calling someone a dick head, which is still pretty unprofessional. I doubt the teacher in question would speak to a parent like that so why is it ok for them to speak to a child like that?"

Most of us are not saying it is ok. We are saying Mummy shouldn't deal with it.

I would be livid if my boss called me a twat. But I would not expect dh to go in to sort her out.

And equally my dc would be horrified if I stormed in to school to deal with something that they see as part of their remit.

Of course, they are not adults yet; there are some areas where I would still intervene when I wouldn't for a grown-up. Prolonged bullying, for instance, or depression. But these areas are getting fewer every year. Mostly I say to them: "well, what do you think you need to do to sort this out?".

Parenting teens is about learning to gradually withdraw control over their lives.

[Picturepuncture]

OdFod.

I've been having this circular discussion for days (well I have been also, you know, living my life). I was pointing out to you that you weren't adding anything new to the discussion. My insight into the other posts comes from reading them as they occurred as part of the ongoing discussion. which was interesting when it started

[KellyElly]

Picturepuncture Thank you for your analysis of other posters comments.

In answer to your points - comment one actually starts with At 15 I cant see a problem with it, hence the fact the poster is saying at 15 being called a twat shouldn't be a problem.

Comment 2 - I applaud your psychic skills that enable to you know that the poster stating 'this is not an issue' is not actually saying that calling a 15 year old a twat isn't an issue and is actually referring to whether the poster should complain to the school.

The last one points out that 'the world is not going to end', it doesn't advocate using the word twat in every lesson. You are reaching here, really reaching.

You seem to have jumped on my post and feel the need to prove your point - quite frankly I have no idea what that point is. Are you someone that needs to be right? Is this issue close to home? Are you just an argumentative person? Delete as appropriate.

[Picturepuncture]

The second two comments are referring to whether or not the OP needs to complain to the school not whether or not the teacher should have said it in the first place.

The last one points out that 'the world is not going to end', it doesn't advocate using the word twat in every lesson.

And the first you've quoted casts doubts on whether or not the incident happened as the teenager recalled.

[KellyElly]

I'm frustrated at people not seeing the subtlety between 'yes, shouldn't have said it, but no real harm done, no need to complain' and 'yeh, that's fine, we sayz that sort of shit allz da time'

The sort of comments I was responding to don't really convey the subtlety you are referring to. See below -

At 15 I cant see a problem with it... although is he sure that the teacher said twat and not twit..

This is not an issue. It just isn't.

Oh for fucking, cunting, twats sake lighten up. Teachers are believe it or not human, the world isn't going to end if they respond in a perfectly normal way to something that is going to cause them stress, especially at this time of year.

[GoblinGranny]

You limit your life in the classroom and school to within the limits permitted for the children, Pear?
How odd.

[Picturepuncture]

As a teacher I don't think it is right for teachers to take drinks into class. The kids can't do it why should we

By that logic, I assume you also wear school uniform and get your homework diary signed every week?

Whatever happened to trying to set an example?

The key word there is trying obviously on this one occasion the teacher slipped up. The very fact that the DN in question was sniggering about it proves that it isn't a routine occurrence. The teacher slipped up, once. Like, well, a human might.

[Picturepuncture]

I'm not assuming it was aimed at me.

I'm frustrated at people not seeing the subtlety between 'yes, shouldn't have said it, but no real harm done, no need to complain' and 'yeh, that's fine, we sayz that sort of shit allz da time'

[ConferencePear]

As a teacher I don't think it is right for teachers to take drinks into class. The kids can't do it why should we ?
Secondly I would be horrified if a colleague spoke to a pupil in this way. How can we expect kids to speak properly to us if we don't speak properly to them ?
Whatever happened to trying to set an example ?

[KellyElly]

Picturepuncture Yes they did. Sorry are you assuming for some strange reason that my comment was aimed at you?

[TwistTee]

Can't really see the issue with the coffee either. Don't 15 year olds drink hot drinks. Sounds like health and safety gone to far to suggest the teacher can't drink a cup in his classroom.

[TwistTee]

Sounds like the teacher just lost his rag. I can't really see that anyone was at fault. 15 year olds rock on chairs, it's what they do, and sometimes teachers lose their rag. Both parties probably regret their actions and will be a little more careful in future.

[Picturepuncture]

Sorry Kelly, did anyone say it was acceptable?

[GoblinGranny]

Exactly cory. When my DS was on work experience, one of his jobs was to make tea and coffee whenever it was requested.

[KellyElly]

If you called a client or colleague a twat in the workplace it wouldn't be acceptable. As the classroom if the teacher's workplace then it's clearly not acceptable. A twat is not on a par with cunt granted, but it's the same as calling someone a dick head, which is still pretty unprofessional. I doubt the teacher in question would speak to a parent like that so why is it ok for them to speak to a child like that?

[cory]

xylem8 Tue 21-May-13 19:50:18
"15 year olds are actually not allowed to work in kitchens"

No, but in any workplace the other employees are likely to have coffee around: I am sure they do so in all the places where dd's friends work.

Certainly this was the case when they did their work experience; I know dd's work experience place well; they drink coffee and tea there. (And swing pick axes.)

We are not discussing whether they should be allowed to work in the admittedly very dangerous setting that is a professional kitchen, but whether they should be protected to the extent of not being in the same room as somebody else's cup of coffee.

At school they cook and do chemical experiments- how could they manage food technology if they are not allowed to be in the same room as a hot liquid?

As a parent surely it is your duty to prepare your 15yo against the not at all distant day when they will be working in any workplace? If they can't be in the same room as a cup of coffee at 15, how are they going to handle independent life (and possibly a factory job) at 18?

I expect my teen to take responsibility for part of the family cooking: to not get her involved in this would seem like parental negligence, seeing that she is going to have to cater for herself within the next few years.