to still avoid the woman who bullied me in school?

[Theicingontop]

I was bullied by one girl in school, she was the classic bully, very popular. Pushed me into muddy puddles, stole my things and threw them into bins, physically attacked me as well as spreading quite vicious (for our age) rumours about me. She wasn't pleasant to many people outside her loyal pack of friends, but I seemed to be her main target. It was completely unprovoked, based solely on the fact that I looked and dressed differently. It damaged my school life quite considerably to the point where for the last two years I barely attended, and though I went back a couple of years later to retake them, it ruined my chances at passing my GCSEs. I was an anxious, depressed mess.

Fast forward to our mid-twenties and we still live in the same town. I see her regularly in town, and I avoid avoid avoid. I won't make eye contact, I won't acknowledge her presence. She was in the queue behind me the other day and I didn't even look in her direction, I just don't want to see her face. It's actually still quite painful to think of all that she put me through, for nothing, just for her enjoyment.

I went to a gig with an old friend recently, a rare night out for both of us. This woman was there too, because apparently in recent years she's gotten over her aversion to 'disgusting grungers who don't wash and wear goff makeup', and has married the drummer in a local band that was playing that night. The woman came over to us, and hugged my friend. I realised who it was and walked away without a word.

Friend defended her, in her words "She's alright now, she's really changed. We get on really well now." Now, this woman targeted my friend too, albeit not as severely as me, so I'm at a loss trying to understand why my friend would suddenly want this woman in her life. Yes, it happened years ago, but I just don't understand the need.

Friend thinks I am being completely unreasonable, and living in the past. I don't think I am, in fact I've gone long ways to put the past behind me and never think about those terrible years. I just don't feel the need to have the woman that tormented me for years, in my life. So it seems this woman is part of the same social circle now. Am I being unreasonable in not acknowledging her?

[AgentZigzag]

Tbf though rainrain, it could be argued that someone leaving their DP and children after 20 years of marriage to shack up with a younger model, maybe would deserve a swift hard kick up the jacksie

And saying you want to mete out violence on an OPs behalf I would see as support and a demonstration of how unreasonable the wanker who's upset them has been.

It would be incredibly sinister if it spilled over into RL and you made good on your word though

Denying you've taken part in bullying/abusive behaviour in the past does seem quite common though, like on the stately homes threads when adult children have confronted parents about their behaviour only to be made to feel responsible for it or that they'd got hold of the wrong end of the stick at the time.

I suppose not a lot of people are big enough to admit to shoddy behaviour in the past.

[nickelbabe]

no, fuck that, I wouldn't.

I've got plenty of bullies and I would never speak to them again.
I have crossed the road from them, and will probably always do.
i'm 36 now, and it still affects my life everyday.

I've got some school people as FB friends, and those that bullied me are not.

[BrokenBritain]

Confession time....I was a bully between the ages of about 10 and 16. I did and said some awful things, which I look back on now and feel utterly mortified. I really couldn't be any more ashamed of who I was as a child.

I still live one the same town and so occasionally see people from school around. I would never, ever expect one of the people I bullied to be all friendly with me, I assume that they must really hate me and think I'm a bitch and all the other words that have been used on this thread.

If I get the opportunity to say I'm sorry then I do, but sometimes I just hang my head and walk away.
I think you are totally right to ignore this person, or do whatever you need to do to feel ok. You should not feel under any pressure to be all matey.

However those who would talk about taking revenge, being violent to them etc. if somebody I bullied wanted to do that to me I would think that's quite unreasonable because a) I was a child, a messed up child b) I deeply regret my actions and would never treat anybody like that again as long as I live, and c) it was 30 odd years ago, there is nothing I can do to change the past but I have spent the last 30 odd years trying to help people and to be a better person than I was. How much time has to pass before I have earned forgiveness?

[Plomino]

No , you are def not BU .

I too was bullied when I was 13 till about the age of 16 . I honestly think that it affected my career choice , because I wanted to stand up and defend people like me against victimisation . It definitely shaped who I am , because when I left , I swore that no one would ever make me feel so low and worthless , and just plain frightened , EVER again . And they haven't . Looking at me now, you would never know .

Curiously , I met my tormentor after stopping her car in an area of North London , that I would never have dreamed of seeing her in . Her face , when I got out of the car was an absolute picture , and believe me, she knew that I'd recognised her. I left the probationer to deal with her , and didn't say a word. But she knew . And so did I .

[FellNel]

I don't think you can have forgiveness BB - at least you can hope for it, but you have no right to expect it. That does not mean that you should not continue to try to make amends as best you can though. But those amends have to be unconditional otherwise they mean nothing.

[AgentZigzag]

That's a very brave post there BB.

The bit about being violent back to the bully is more about trying to get rid of that awful feeling of powerlessness.

I know I had a bit of an aggressive stage when I was in my 20's, and when I thought about what other children did to me I'd fantasise about just punching them straight in the face again and again, mostly to try and wipe the memory of how painful it felt to have such spiteful and isolating things said to me.

Repeatedly punching them in the face would have hurt less than what they'd done to me, it can be that bad.

I agree with Fell, you should never expect to be forgiven for anything, forgiveness is totally a choice for the person who does it to make.

In saying you expect them to forgive you and they haven't is turning it round into being their responsibility again! Can you see how you've done that?

You have to live with the same situation you created just as the children you bullied have to.

[BrokenBritain]

I know you're right FellNel re hoping for, rather than expecting forgiveness. I guess what I was trying to say is that I would totally understand somebody blanking me, or just brushing me off. What I wouldn't really understand is somebody actively trying to hurt me or get revenge, for something that happened 30 years ago when we were 10. I would quite like to be judged on who I am now, rather than who I was then, but i know it's not always as easy as that.
For what it's worth, what I did as a child has definitely affected my career choices too Plomino. When the realisation of what I had done hit me, at about age 17 it was like I developed a consience overnight and I really woke up to my behaviour. I found the guilt and self loathing really hard to process and self harmed in secret for about 5 years because I just couldn't forgive myself.
Eventually I grew up and realised that all I could was spend the rest of my life trying to make amends, and consequently have turned down opportunities for well paid, high profile jobs in favour of staying in low paid work where I feel I am actively helping people.
I am certainly not any sort of mother Theresa! But I really am doing everything I can to redress the balance of the harm I have caused. And I really am very, very sorry.

[HerLordship]

I'm sorry BrokenBritain, but I'm struggling to muster up any sympathy for you.

I too self harmed for years, but it was due to being bullied. Something I didn't ask for, deserve, or have any control over. It has affected me every day since I left school (I am now mid thirties), in that is has given me cripplingly low self esteem and lack of confidence. I wonder if those that you bullied feel the same way? It has affected everything in my life; jobs, friendships, relationships, social life. Everything.

I really don't think you (or any other bullies) have the right to start trying to lay down the law about how your victims should feel. I don't think the fact that it was a 'long time ago' excuses your behaviour!

[FellNel]

Without wishing to sound unkind BB if you cannot understand the concept of needing revenge then perhaps you have never had your life blighted by the fear and the emotional pain inflicted by another person?

[FellNel]

for people who have been emotionally scarred by their treatment at the hands of someone very cruel it may as well have been yesterday. It never leaves you and it shapes everything you do/are/feel from then on.

[qazxc]

YANBU at all. Why do your friends think you should want this person in your life?

[SoftKittyWarmKitty]

OP, I totally sympathise because I was contacted by one of my main bullies on FB about three years ago. She sent me a friend request and a 'how are you, so nice to find you' type message . After pondering on it for a few weeks including considering replying with unabridged details of how utterly shit she made me feel I deleted both the friend request and the message without responding.

I was bullied mercilessly at primary school - I was ostracised, cornered in the corridor and threatened, had money, toys and belongings taken from me (either by force or blackmail) and generally treated with complete contempt. I hated school so much that I ran away twice and hid in a derelict house about a mile from home rather than go to school, after which I was the one labelled as a problem child and made to see a child psychologist (who was useless). My mum parents did nothing when I mentioned that no-one liked me, telling me that all kids fall out and we'd all be friends again next week. It went on for about 4-5 years and I contemplated suicide more than once.

The two main ringleaders were friends with each other and everyone else (bar me and one or two others) were friends with them, but in order to stay friends and not become victims themselves, the other friends would do the ringleaders' bidding. This meant that it wasn't just two people doing the bullying but most of my class. I was their biggest victim. It only ended when I went to a completely different secondary school to them.

It has affected me so much. I'm a people-pleaser with very little confidence and am not assertive at all. I've just started counselling to get to the root of my stress, anxiety and OCD-type compulsions, so I'm hoping that will help me to deal with the after-effects of the bullying and my other issues. Those who think that bygones should be bygones IMO have not experienced the complete and utter all-consuming pain that is serious bullying. OP, I don't blame you for walking away. I would too.

[BrokenBritain]

FellNel i totally appreciate what you and others are saying.
I have had my life blighted by the fear and emotional pain inflicted by others, I don't want to get into a competitive "I was abused more than you were" type conversation, that won't help anyone. But suffice to say I have experienced physical, sexual and emotional abuse and I honestly don't feel a desire for revenge.
Maybe once I did, and maybe it's different because I know how it feels to make a series of massive mistakes and regret them for a lifetime.
I definitely don't want to be buddies with the people that have hurt me! But I also don't wish them any harm.
I really don't want or expect any sympathy, that's not why I posted. I just wanted to try to explain another side to the same story.
Will leave the thread now. I'm sorry if my posts have upset or angered anyone.

[Darkesteyes]

Just remembered an incident in drama class. we were putting on a play and they put me in charge of costumes. One of the "cool girls" was playing a housewife so i was trying to source a flowery dress and an apron (ok i know thats a stereotype but i was only fourteen at the time.) She started on me in history lesson saying that she wasnt going to wear it and if i made her look frumpy she would put me through a wall.
This is one of the people who wanted me to make up the numbers on sports day which was mentioned earlier upthread.

[Darkesteyes]

Soft Kitty im sorry to hear this. Ive done it too. When i was 14 i took a bottle of whisky from my parents drinks cabinet and a box of paracetamol and sat there in the living room drinking the whisky. I never got as far as taking the pills (that time) because DB came home ,caught me and rang my mum at work who came home and had a go at me cos she had to leave work This was because some girls in the year above had started to wait for me after school to terrorize me and threaten to beat me up.
Instead of dealing directly with them the schools answer was to let me go home half an hour early disrupting my education and treating me like i was the problem. Nice bit of victim blaming there.
I was told that one of these older girls was caring for her mother who was in a wheelchair "so we have to make allowances"
Same for the boy who used to sit opposite me in science and bite off bits of his pen and spit it in my hair.
And on a couple of occasions follow me home from school and push me into a hedge and stop me from getting away by holding my arms.
He turned up in my home town again (after a spell in prison) about 7 years ago. He would yell my name in the street and when i turned round he would be pretending to go about his business. Probably an overreaction on my part but the SL trust very kindly gave me a rape alarm.
Scary thing is sometimes he comes over all friendly and says hello and waves at me And at school what did they say about him? Yep "we have to make allowances" because hes a foster child. Unbelievable.

[Ginebra]

I think its your prerogative not to let her off the hook. but i would stare thru her and hold her eye without blinking rather than avoiding eye contact. let her feel judged.

[Megatron]

YANBU at all. I often wonder if bullies read these kind of threads and feel bad. If they struggle with what they were like at school and ever try to make amends? I dont really know how you can forgive someone who made your life hell for years.

[VictimOfBullys]

I was badly bullied at school. I went to a 'rough' school, and I stood out like a sore thumb because I lived in a 'nice' area, and apparently spoke 'posh'.

It wasn't just one or two bitches, it was practically all of the 'hard' girls, and even 'nice' girls joined in with the bullying because they where scared of getting picked on as well.

I was physically attacked on a daily bases, the school did fuck all about it, because "they're from broken homes" "they don't have a dad" "they're in foster care" e.t.c you get the idea.
In fact I was the one who they tried to punish, as I was too scared to go to school, I would skive off, and because I wasn't attending school, the school threatened to put me in a residential unit.
Yes, you read that right, I was skiving because of bullying that the school did fuck all about, so they were going to lock me up with the sort of scum who were making me skive school in the first place!
Fortunately, I turned 16 before the panel meeting was held, so they couldn't do anything about it.

Although I've had the last laugh, all of the ring leaders have got ( or had, in one case) shit lifes.
One of the bitches was mentioned in a court report in the local newspaper as her 'dp' had beat her up. Feel free to flame away, but I would love to shake his hand.
Another one was moaning on facebook about 'the social' taking her kids away, and how skint she is because her moneys been stopped, and she might lose her flat. Boo fucking hoo, hope she ends up in some run-down hostel, or even better, a shop doorway. (BTW I'm not friends with her on fb, she's a friend of a friend and her page is public).
Another one of the bitches was found dead in a derelict building with a needle hanging out of her arm. So she obviously had a shit life as well.

I don't care if I get flamed for my joy at those evil bitches comeuppances, I feel the way I do because they made my life hell for four fucking long years.
(I've name changed for this anyway.)

[Ginebra]

Wow. YOu had all my sympathy until I got to the bit where you said you want to shake the hand of a man who beat up a woman.

Whether or not you hate that woman, there is nothing to celebrate about living in a World where domestic violence is so prevalent.

I get that they made you suffer, but as you recognise, you were the one who had the secure family background etc... and to actually feel glad that these people have been beaten up, lost their kids, died with needles hanging out of their arms etc... you should think about whether or not you REALLY have had the last laugh. You don't sound happy enough to do much laughing.

[rainrainandmorerain]

At the risk of straying off topic - sorry OP - the causes and effects of bullying are damn complex, and can be very hard to unravel.

One of the oddest and very sad things i have come across as an adult is people who bully (in quite adult ways - office bullying is a good example, there's no hair pulling or spitting, but constant undermining, excluding colleagues, whispering campaigns, creating whipping boys etc) - but who turn out themselves to have been bullied as children. This is not uncommon. But once people think of themselves
as having been a victim, they find it very hard to accept that they are capable of bullying behaviour too.

It's all very messy and miserable. I think schools are SO important in spotting and stopping this behaviour as soon as it starts. And they often don't.

[AgentZigzag]

I don't think that's off topic at all rainrain, there are quite a few things posters have said about the effects they've suffered that I've also been through, so that must say if there's a uniformity to the effects it might be also be possible to pin down what really causes it and stop it. (I'm sure they have in some research or other, but it hasn't done a whole lot to stop it as far as I can see)

I can't remember if it was on this thread or another one, but a poster was talking about a school denying they had any bullying problems, and that to me is the worst case scenario to have dealing with a school when your DC is being bullied. If it's in childrens nature to be like this as a group, you can't not have it going on somewhere.

[rainrainandmorerain]

I agree Agent - if schools fail to deal with bullying, the children and families are in an impossible situation.

It's the biggest factor for me in choosing a school, tbh - how active I think they are in promoting good co-operative and kind behaviour, and how they deal with problems when they arise.

I'm also very wary of anyone (teacher, playleader) who assumes from the outset that all problems are 'half a dozen of one, 6 of the other', or that all kids are 'as bad' as each other. It can be very hard untangling a situation, esp where a child has retaliated in some way - but just refusing to deal with the situation is unforgiveable.

[msbossy]

Me too rainrain. I'm trying to engineer a situation where my DDs attend schools with a healthy attitude to diversity and those with an ounce of motivation don't get persecuted.

OP YADNBU. I'm glad I went away to uni and never returned home to live. My parents still live in the same place but I haven't stepped foot in a local pub in 20 years.

BB, thank you for sharing your story. It is good to know some bullies wake up and see what they've done.

[BarbarianMum]

You don't have to be friendly with anyone, nor do you have to forgive them although if you do you may feel better.

FWIW when I recently met the woman who had bullied me when we were teenagers (school reunion), it was a very positive experience. She was so relaxed and happy and positive about her life -a different person really -it made me realise how bloody unhappy she was before (didn't think about it at the time, was too busy trying to avoid her). She didn't mention the bullying (I guess an apology would have been nice) but over the course of the evening things were discussed that made me realise how much shit she'd been dealing with at the time. Anyway, it was great to realise that that period of our lives was over for both of us (my teen years were miserable for several reasons too, the bullying was just one part of them).

[BoffinMum]

A good response to bullies is to live well.

You have to remember the reason they bullied you is because you represent everything they want to be.