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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think Oscar Pistorius deserves the benefit of the doubt?

217 replies

SilverMoo · 19/02/2013 19:10

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? I think the media circus around this is really unfair and am shocked so many people are ready to jump on the bandwagon and call him a murdering woman hater before he's even been tried. Just that really.

OP posts:
HollyBerryBush · 19/02/2013 21:23

Hello!

We, well you lot, are talking about differnt laws ina different country with differnt legislation accordingly.

I'm sure his trial will be conducted according to their laws.

xkittyx · 19/02/2013 21:32

Can I just say, as someone who grew up in Southern Africa with firearms in the household, you'd have to be an utter, blithering idiot to fire wildly through a shut door having not properly ascertained who is behind the door.
Asking for a tragedy. Clearly I should be more grateful than I realised that I made it to adulthood without a family member blowing me to bits.

runningforthebusinheels · 19/02/2013 21:37

YABU - as jins said he deserves a fair trial, not the benefit of the doubt.

I'm thinking his explanation of events is a tissue of lies, carefully constructed after the event to explain the physical evidence at the scene.

Intruders hiding in locked toilets, him able to fetch the gun from under the bed, but unable to tell Reeva wasn't in the bed? Hearing movement in the toilet and not saying 'That you, Reeva...?' before shooting through the door? Just does not ring true.

Hopefully the forensics will be able to shed more light on what actually happened on the night - and the real truth will out.

Lizzylou · 19/02/2013 21:42

I heard today on the news that he had his prosthetics on. I also heard that he was high on steroids. I think the steroid matter won't hold any water because he was about due to race, so surely would have been regularly tested?

Whatever. Too much is being made of Oscar and not enough of a woman who was shot to death and buried today. Because she was not a world famous athlete I suppose. I'd be boiling with rage and grief if I had known and loved Reeva.

It will all come out what actually happened on that night. I do know that friends who live/have lived in SA don't buy the shooting intruder in the loo theory.

Innocent until proven guilty, yes. The rush to try and absolve OP is distasteful imo.

ballstoit · 19/02/2013 21:46

The phrase 'benefit of the doubt' is a bit odd, but I understand the sentiment.

The SA judicial system is clearly very different to the UK's, and the reports I've read (such as the one linked in the Guardian) are reporting what has already been said in court.

It's all speculation until forensic evidence is released, but he has had a chance to defend himself in terms of the bail hearing. Although, there do seem to be questionable elements in his version of events. Such as, why his girlfriend would lock herself in the toilet if she was just popping for a wee in the middle of the night. And why he wouldn't check the bed while he was getting the gun out from under it.

farewellfarewell · 19/02/2013 21:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FreudiansSlipper · 19/02/2013 22:02

He can buy the best legal team he will get a fair trial they shall make sure of that

Innocent until proven guilty what like jimmy savile, OJ Simpson and many other guilty people who have slipped through the justice system do you have that much faith in the legal system in South Africa Hmm

He is guilty hopefully justice shall be done

ledkr · 19/02/2013 22:05

Would you feel the same if he was just a bloke from down the road??

MadameCastafiore · 19/02/2013 22:13

One of dh's work colleagues lives very near him. He said intruders are rare as security is shit hot.

maddening · 19/02/2013 22:15

I saw a news story about a man whose house was being burgled and he ran to get his gun from his bedroom - he saw his bedroom doorhandle turning and show at the door - when he opened it it had been his 7yr old daughter who was coming to see her parents as she had woken scared - his bullet hit her in the head and she died.

It has happened. In order to proceed there must be proof it was not accidental - the bloody cricket bat must be it - it is possible he shot in the dark and didn't see her but to then hit her on the head with a cricket bat - or even the other way round.

thebody · 19/02/2013 22:20

Yes agree op but can't think he isn't as guilty as hell of shooting her in a fit of rage as she kicked herself in the toilet.

thebody · 19/02/2013 22:21

Locked not kicked

somewhereaclockisticking · 19/02/2013 22:29

He did shoot her and he doesn't deny that but says it was an accident - he shot her 4 times whilst she was locked in the bathroom. I think once may be an accident but 4 times???? I think if it was my daughter I probably wouldn't want him to get a fair trial at all and if he was my son I'd stand by him but couldn't defend his actions. FOUR times.

somewhereaclockisticking · 19/02/2013 22:32

Maddening - that's a terrible story about the father but he didn't shoot his daughter 4 times whilst she was locked in another room. This story just doesn't make any sense. First he says he thought she was a burglar then he was jealous she might be involved with someone else - why don't people just split up??

whateveritakes · 19/02/2013 22:34

It was a toilet inside a bathroom though.

Unless you have a shotgun, one bullet is just going to have the "burglar" come out shooting at you. Four means business.

maddening · 19/02/2013 22:38

Exactly - it is a plausible defence and believable as you can imagine the scene. There are many cases where it has happened. But I doubt the authorities would just jump to the point of charging him and taking it to trial if there was not v good evidence to support his version of events - they must be pretty certain to move so quickly.

woopsidaisy · 19/02/2013 22:40

The guy shot four times onto the bathroom, without even checking who was there?! And that is supposed to make me go poor him!

maddening · 19/02/2013 22:40

Sorry if the evidence did not support his version of events and instead points to murder.

Trekkie · 19/02/2013 22:48

I was just watching this on the news with DH and there are a lot of things odd about his version of events.

Hopefully whichever side is the truth have convincing enough evidence to quiet any ongoing speculation.

2rebecca · 19/02/2013 23:44

If my husband heard someone in the bathroom and we were supposed to be the only 2 people in the house I would expect him to presume it was me in the bathroom not a burglar, particularly if he hadn't checked where I was before he started shooting. It makes no sense.
When I first heard about this and heard he'd shot thinking it was a burglar I presumed she'd come to visit him as a surprise and had popped to the bathroom before going into his bedroom. That scenario made some sense. The shooting someone you can't see in a bathroom before checking it's not the person you share the bathroom with makes no sense. If he didn't mean to kill her he was off his face on something.

fraggletits · 19/02/2013 23:44

I just look at his face, standing there in court and think 'Why?!' - tragedies happen all over the world, everyday - but Oscar was a hero, on the world stage with absolutely everything to lose, they'd only been going out 3 months - so I know what you're getting at when you say benefit of the doubt, it's just so unbelievable that he murdered her in cold blood.

I'm wary not to condem from 'facts' I've read in the papers (i hark back to comments I made about Amanda Knox having never actually been a witness at the murder she was accused of being part of)....but, I don't think it's looking good for Oscar - it's unbelievable what happened, but his defence is even more unbelievable IMO.

Reeva didn't deserve to die like that, no one would, she was absolutely beautiful and I hope her family can find strength in these dark days.

MaryPoppinsMassiveSack · 20/02/2013 00:06

This reply has been deleted

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LaurieFairyCake · 20/02/2013 00:17

That is tasteless Shock

MrRected · 20/02/2013 00:38

There is no way, if you haven't lived in South Africa that you could understand the cold fear that runs through you when you think your house is being broken into in the dead of night.

This, and this alone, is what drove me away from my country. The place I was raised. It happened to me and I will never forget the wobbly legs, every sense on fire and a desparate desire to protect my children.

Opportunistic home invaders in South Africa kill and maim. They are driven by a desire to stay out of the South African penal system - South African jails are literally hell on earth.

Now I am not saying that Oscar is guilty or not guilty. I was not there, so I have no way of knowing and that's for the court to decice.

I am saying, that I understand that crippling fear. The knowledge that if they are in the house, they WILL kill you, if you are lucky it will be quick, if you aren't lucky they might rape you before torturning you. It happens. Every single day in South Africa.

LegoWidow · 20/02/2013 00:44

I think he's telling the truth. Either way, he killed her and nothing changes that obviously, but I think - implausible as it is - I find his version to be more likely than the alternative.

The media seems to have made his mind up (though having said that - I saw several tweets from journalists who were in the court today, who intimated that they believed him).

It's just heartbreaking all around really. Poor Reeva. My heart goes out to her family - and to Oscar's too. He just looks shell-shocked (bad choice of words - not trying to be funny) in the pictures in court.

I think he'll be convicted though. I just can't see that he won't be. Even if the judge believes his story, I think he'll still rule that it's murder, even if he intended to kill someone different.

I agree with whoever said that the trajectory of the bullets must surely prove whether he had his legs on or not.

If he is telling the truth, I wonder if he physically felt her in bed before he got up to get the fan, and that's why it didn't cross his mind that she was in the bathroom (having got up when he was getting the fan). I kind of get the bit about being confused about where someone is in the middle of the night. I got up to the loo the other night and was convinced that my DP was in bed next to me. I got the shock of my life when I walked in the bathroom and he was on the toilet. I can see how he could be confused - coupled with the vulnerability of being on his stumps and being wary of intruders generally - but obviously it's a huge leap from that to actually grabbing (or indeed having in the first place) a gun and shooting someone.

It may sound like I'm blindly believing him - but I'm not. There will be a lot more to come out. If the rumours about her head being bashed in by the cricket bat, or about steroids prove to be true, then I think it's a whole different story. I wonder if those rumours can be true though as wouldn't the prosectution have mentioned today if she'd been brained with a cricket bat? Maybe that will come out tomorrow.

Whatever the outcome - it's just horrific.