To think it really wasn't necessary for Myleene Klass to mention the 'Breastapo'?

[UnknownGnome]

I was watching Lorraine this morning during which there was a feature which showed Myleene Klass visiting a third world country promoting the benefits of breastfeeding and raising awareness of the goodness of breastmilk, particularly colostrum. Formula is often watered down, or made with unclean water, therefore not the best option for many women, but they are not always aware of this.

Cut to Myleene in the studio with Kate Garraway and she is, again, talking about the benefits of breastfeeding but qualifies this by saying she is by no means a member of the 'breastapo'. Was this completely necessary? Surely it's ok to talk about the benefits of breastfeeding without making a negative comment about those who promote it?

Just realised that I haven't posed this as an AIBU, so, AIBU to think this was an unnecessary and unhelpful comment?

[MrsBethel]

YABU
She was just encouraging a moderate approach.

[drizzlecake]

I think this is mostly down to there being hundreds of thousands of guilty and defensive mothers out there. It's fertile ground for anti-breastfeeding propaganda and myth

Well what came first the guilt or the BFmafia?

Sad that we can't be more reasonable. What's notable is the absence of FF mums on these threads. So the majority of mothers dont' feel they can contribute to these threads - I think that that says it all - until that changes the BF proponents are preaching to the converted.

[drizzlecake]

As it seems that the main reason women do not start, or continue, with breasfeeding is because of a lack of support

I would say it is also possibly that many don't feel comfortable with the idea of breastfeeding and doing it in front of people who have never seen anyone do it before (to any extent), it's just not a typical thing you come across in the Uk.
How many provocativley posed women showing cleavage and breasts do you see in a week, how many breast feeding?
So opening your clothing to reach a breast in public or even with extended family members around is not something they want to do. (not my experience by the way but I used to feed in the car if I was out)

[AngryGnome]

I think that the women who promote breastfeeding have a very hard job. Yes, there are a lot of failings in breastfeeding support - in my experience HCPs were shocking, and the NCT were not great. I think that there is a lot of pressure on women with the breast is best message, but there is not always the support there to back this up - I think this can be very dependent on the area where you live. As it seems that the main reason women do not start, or continue, with breasfeeding is because of a lack of support it seems very unfair to criticise and label those who give up their time (often as volunteers) to provide that support.

My experience was that a local community nursery nurse was excellent, and LLL were very helpful (although the advice they gave me I have since been told on here was actually 'wrong' - but hey, it worked for me and DS).

I have to say that in real life I have never encountered any kind of pressure to feed my baby in a particular way; it only seems to be on MN that there is such a hostile divide between mothers who bf and mothers who ff. I wonder if a lot of that open hostility is because we are on an anonymous forum? (should probably add that not all threads show this hostility - a lot are brilliant and supportive with great advice).

[tiktok]

Chairman, in order not to ignore the rudeness you experienced in real life, let me add it is obviously unacceptable and unpleasant. Obviously. No one is in favour of people being criticised or judged like that.

[tiktok]

Big sloppy kiss (no tongues) for STG :)

[Fillyjonk75]

Myleene Klass isn't strictly necessary.

[showtunesgirl]

Nevermind tiktok, I luffs you anyway.

[tiktok]

Chairman you're rewriting not paraphrasing there.

Never mind. Threads about a thread are bad mumsnetiquette. People tried to help you - they offered support and encouragement, but obviously they cannot know all the details about what happened to you. You call them 'blinkered idiots' - nice :(

[showtunesgirl]

Why is it people get so weird about BF or not BF?

Anyhoo, MK is all right. She's always been a bit shiny shiny even way back when I used to know her. She doesn't mean any harm and her little brother and sister whom I knew better are really nice too.

[ChairmanWow]

Takes deep breath.

Me. My milk didn't come in. Any tips on how to make it happen this time
Other poster no, your son wasn't able to get the milk out.

The point way, way back up this thread was some womens inability to accept that some womens breasts don't work properly. Read the rest of the BF thread and you'll see that, yep, my breasts didn't work properly. the bit about rudeness was illustrated with RL examples of actual rudeness. I see you conveniently ignored everything else.

Now I think I'll flounce off and give my knockers another squeeze. See if I can't get them working for my imminently due little lady.

[JenaiMorris]

What sense of humour failure?

[tiktok]

Which of the kind and helpful supportive posts on that thread came from 'blinkered idiots', Chairman?

You are imagining things. Don't bother asking other queries, now will you? Someone might genuinely try to offer support and be totally misinterpreted.

[ChairmanWow]

1. Massive sense of humour failure all round. Well done for escalating this thread into a massive po-faced screamfest instead of a healthy debate.
   
2. It's okay to disagree with someone and nobody should have the fear of being aggressively shouted down (except trolls who deserve all they get)
   
3. I maintain that on my BF/FF thread there were posters who simply didn't seem able to accept that my breasts were running dry! Bit galling after all the heartbreak I went through, but hey ho.
   
4. Some of us have have had people being incredibly rude to us about how we feed our babies (see the RL egs in my PP, plus other posters). Is it anti-BF to even mention it? Of course not. Breastfeeding advocacy as an idea and very often in practice = good, zealotry = bad, and likely to scare women off.
   
5. I'm betting that virtually everyone, if not everyone posting on this thread is pro-BF. I certainly am. Why would I have been asking for advice about how to maximise my chances this time if not?
   

Chill pill and sense of perspective desperately needed. Dread to think what someone finding this randomly on Google is thinking right now .

[BumBiscuits]

Forget to put in your love eggs today, Bampot?

[BumBiscuits]

'Is it the done thing to report posts slagging off celebrities? '

So it seems pictish. MNHQ in for a busy day deleting all posts slagging off slebs.

Suggest they start with searches on Piers Morgan, Cherie Blair and Peter Andre!

[tiktok]

Shag, I agree with you when you say "In ten years of involvement with breastfeeding advocates and advocacy, the worst I've witnessed is someone young, inexperienced and insensitive saying openly she felt it was 'selfish' not to breastfeed. The odd disapproving glance at someone bottle feeding, a silly and tactless comment. "

That's my experience. As well as being a breastfeeding counsellor, I work with bf supporters, and they are acutely conscious of what they say and how they say it. I come across some naive comments - one person (not a trained supporter) told me she found it hard to believe people when they said they didn't have enough milk because she never had that problem. But these comments are very rare, and they're not meant unkindly, on the whole.

I do see the occasional bit of judgmentalism against ff on these boards but if it comes to a competition, the nastiness and venom against bf supporters wins! The thread I linked to before is an example of people simply misremembering and misinterpreting things, too!

[DioneTheDiabolist]

Really Shagmund? I don't think that at all. No one is saying that BF advocates are an organized group determined to make new mothers feel bad. But there are certainly individuals in this movement who do. Or do you think that the posters here are lying?

The first hours and days post partum are a very sensitive and vulnerable time in a woman's life. Insensitive BF advocates should have no place on maternity wards. They are damaging.

[tiktok]

ChairmanWow, you say you posted recently on the breast/bottle feeding board, and you complain about some of the help you had. In fact you said "The response was a mix of helpful tips and blinkered idiots who refuse to believe a woman's breasts function anything less than perfectly."

I checked your thread.

It's here.


www.mumsnet.com/Talk/breast_and_bottle_feeding/1682733-Tips-to-bring-my-milk-in

No 'blinkered idiots' at all. Just kind people who offered sympathy and understanding and some good leads. Makes me wonder why people like me bother (though I am not on that thread).

True bullying, true 'blinkered idiocy' about bf/ff does sometimes happen here. It is quickly jumped on.

[Shagmundfreud]

The language used by people trying to discredit breastfeeding advocacy is consistently pretty horrible on this board.

'Breastapo', 'nipple nazi', 'titty taliban'. Lots of talk about breastfeeding advocates being 'strident', 'hysterical', trying to 'force' mothers to breastfeed. Constant insistence that all mothers have the right to choose how they feed their baby, implying that breastfeeding advocates think otherwise. Insistence that breastfeeding advocates commonly see formula as 'poison' and mothers who ff as 'bad mothers'.

In ten years of involvement with breastfeeding advocates and advocacy, the worst I've witnessed is someone young, inexperienced and insensitive saying openly she felt it was 'selfish' not to breastfeed. The odd disapproving glance at someone bottle feeding, a silly and tactless comment. Definitely nothing worse than the disapproving looks and regular comments of 'you're not still feeding that baby!', while I was breastfeeding.

And yet apparently there is an organised body of really horrible, cruel and frankly weird women out there who campaign to remove choice from other people, and who deliberately perpetuate falsehoods about formula and formula feeding.

I think this is mostly down to there being hundreds of thousands of guilty and defensive mothers out there. It's fertile ground for anti-breastfeeding propaganda and myth.

[BegoniaBampot]

Ha, ha - just been deleted for calling someone a sheep (I think).

[TheBigJessie]

I think I have a sense of humour. But then I would.

However, I actually have a broad, if shallow, understanding of world history. When you say, "breastapo", "titty taliban", "breastfeeding nazi", etc, I am outraged. Not on my behalf. I am outraged on the behalf of all the people who have suffered/are still suffering due to those groups. It minimises their suffering.

No wonder we need Holocaust Memorial Day. No wonder that although the world said, "Never again" after that, it fucking has happened again. And again.

I understand her motivation for saying it. Maybe she thinks it's worth it, if it saves more babies dying right now from badly prepared formula. That's an opinion she has a right to hold. But most probably, like lots of people, she didn't even think about what she was saying before she said it. And that I cannot respect. Ever.

[Bakingtins]

Comparing anyone who advocates for breastfeeding, even if you find their methods over the top or offensive, to any Nazi organisation (or the mafia) is totally U.

[comedycentral]

WTF is up with her.