to be incredibly annoyed and hurt by FIL?

[toweraboveyou]

Last night was my SIL's engagement party. My FIL got very drunk as usual. As I was with my DW and 2 young DCs, I left with DW's grandfather as I couldn't fit in the same as car as DW and 2 car seats.
As we were ready to leave, FIL announces that he and MlL will travel in our car too. DW's grandad and myself waited 15 mins for my inlaws to come out of the pub. When they did, my FIL insisted I get out of my seat so he could sit in the front. I said that as I was already buckled into my seat, it was probably easier if he sat in the back. He refused and slammed the door. He then opened the door again and tried to undo my seatbelt and pull me out of the car. I refused to budge and asked him if he realised how childish he was being. My DW asked him what was wrong and said he said that her tosser husband wouldnt move. Bear in mind, he has no physical reason to sit in the front. In fact, I'm considerably taller than him.
He then said that he hasnt liked me for the last 6 months and that this was the breaking point, threatening that beating me up was the next step. He then refused again to sit in the back saying 'I do not sit in the back of cars'. He stopped my MIL getting a lift home with us and walked home instead.
In the last few years, he has ruined several important events whilst drunk, including his other daughter's wedding. He was also punched by a taxi driver after starting a row at our wedding.
Today, he has slinked away again with his tail between his legs without any sort of apology. My DW spoke with MIL and she said, 'You know hat he's like when he's drunk'.
Am I wrong to be sick of his behaviour? He is a bully and a coward and he never suffers any consequences for his actions.

[MidniteScribbler]

If I had moved and let him get his own way because he had a tantrum, what example would that have set to my DS?

You would have set the example that it's pointless to argue with an intoxicated person and that being the bigger person and walking away from a fight is the safest and most sensible course of action, rather than provoking an already irrational person in to an argument over a completely irrelevant and senseless thing such as where you sit in a car, which is not really any victory at all and can lead to you getting in to an argument. An argument in which people can get physically injured or killed.

That's the lesson that I want my DS to learn.

[FeistyLass]

I am very proud of tower for how he dealt with it
Well, that's all that matters then

[MrsTower]

Hi
Firstly re the house, I just want to clear up why it isnt easy to just move out now. We are of course hoping to move long term, but as it stands, we are in a three bed ex council house. The third "bedroom" has a desk and a wardrobe in it, the two DCs already share a room. We pay about £100 a month more than a council tenant would, but getting a council house is as many places in the uk nigh on impossible. Due to the area, there arent two bed houses, unless they are new builds and therefore more expensive. There are flats, but either council and hard to get, or private let and costing more than the house. On top of the rent issue, we would also need to find a bond and removal money (neither of us drive, so cant even just hire a van) and have no spare money at the moment.

Speaking of the money, yes I am a sahm but I am also disabled, so no chance of me getting a job towards a higher rent.

I said to my dad about him not seeing the kids before he "finished" his threat. He said something like "you know where this is going" rather than "im gonna knock your block off" iyswim? Obviously I never want to risk my children seeing this performance again, so they will not see him where there is a chance he will be drunk. Cutting him out completely would be difficult, but I would do it if partial cutting out didnt work.

I am very proud of tower for how he dealt with it.

[FeistyLass]

Actually diddl I think the op did choose to have a confrontation. If he had swapped sweats there wouldn't have been an issue. Swapping seats wouldn't have been about rewarding FIL's bad behaviour. It would have been about keeping any confrontation to a point where everyone was sober.
Also, if FIL is as bad as OP says (and I have no reason to doubt it) then the MIL is probably living in an abusive relationship so, of course, she would have went with FIL and the op knew that would be the case.
Look, my SIL is very unreasonable. I call her on her bad behaviour. I don't condone it or sweep it under the carpet and I'm not suggesting the op should. My df was often completely unreasonable. You make a call on whether you accept such bullying/abusive behaviour, and then you react accordingly. I just think it's unfortunate that the op decided to make this the point where he took a stand.
I think the op knew what the outcome of his actions would be and chose the course of action that would cause most trouble. From the potted history that the op has provided, the only way the op couldn't have forseen the outcome, was if the op was a little tipsy or drunk too so his reasoning was cloudy.

[toweraboveyou]

I didn't choose to have a confrontation with him. I assumed he was joking as he is a man in his 50s and it's a seat in a car. Plus, as I said, I was already in the car and had been for a little while.
If I had moved and let him get his own way because he had a tantrum, what example would that have set to my DS?

[diddl]

OP didn´t choose to have a confrontation though, did he?

The FIL did.

I agree that they should move out of the house.

But OP should still see FIL, who has threatened him, because he lives in his house??

Is trying to pull someone out of a car an assault that can be reported?

And he didn´t stop MIL getting a lift home-unless he physically forced her to walk with him.

[FeistyLass]

MidnightScribbler, that's what I don't understand.
If the FIL is always an arse, then why choose to have a confrontation about it over a car seat when you're in someone else's car, at the end of someone else's party? By all means call him on his behaviour but not when he's drunk and you know the outcome is going to ruin everyone else's night.
Also, I'm really surprised at people thinking it's ok to avail yourself of subsidised housing whilst cutting off the person who provides it. If he's so awful, you move.

[diddl]

He sounds like a twat-compounded by the fact that he is providing you with a house.

So, it doesn´t sound to me as if your wife is supportive.

He can still see the children-only if he actually beats you up he can´t??

What is your opinion of them being subjected to such an obnoxious bully?

I assume that as he has threatened you, you´ll be having nothing to do with him anymore.

But I am thinking that as long as you all live in "his" house, he will feel entitled to visit as & when he pleases.

[MidniteScribbler]

He sounds like a right prick.

But I have to ask, since you know what he is like when he's drunk, why did you choose to try and make a point about the car seats while he was intoxicated? Surely it would have been easier to just switch and avoid the confrontation?

[FellatioNels0n]

Good Lord, he sounds like a nightmare. I do not envy you at all; having to tolerate people like this as part of your extended family must be incredibly stressful. I have a few distance family members who can be a bit of a handful, to put it diplomatically, but luckily I rarely have to see them, (weddings and funerals only really) and I would NEVER set foot in a pub or a club on a night out with them.

It's pretty difficult to avoid them if they are your wife's parents though. How does your DW feel about him? Personally I would not be EVER wanting to socialise with someone who gets like this. I hate people like this. Just hate them. I really feel for you.

[MadamGazelleIsMyMum]

YANBU. What does your DW think? Does she think he is unreasonable? I'd be severely limiting the time you spend (if you cant cut it out completely) and looking for alternative housing asap, so you were not beholden in any way.

[trustissues75]

Oh my God!!! What a vile man. YANBU. One bit.

[feministefatale]

We are two kids and two parents and live in a two bed. Downsize. try and get council help if you have to but you are letting your children down by continuing to let this man in their lives.

[AdoraBell]

Sleeping I can see why you think the OP should not need to uproot the family by moving, but someone who is a control freak - and the FIL sounds like he is- will see their ownership of the OP's home as a tool.

An example, my FIL gets angry when my OH goes on holiday because he feels he has no control over him if he's not at home/work. That gem was relayed to us when we were living in our own home with no connection to the ILs at all, no financial interest in the property, no family company, no related jobs requiring coordination or changing schedules, in fact no reason at all. OH was 45 at the time, and his father hasn't changed one bit in the last 12 years, because he doesn't regard himself as being unreasonable.

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

What an arse.

I would do everything possible to get out of his house.

[sleepingsatellite18]

Regarding people thinking you have to move - is that just a power issue? If its purely so that he loses a "hold" over you I don't think you need to move. Downgrading and uprooting children just to make a point?
Or is it because you think he would kick you out if you stayed away from him? If he kicked his daughter and grandchildren out then he clearly proves himself.

I would just avoid him as much as possible, and if confronted tell him it's because of his behaviour.
Family events will be harder but just minimal communication.

[Salmotrutta]

His position in the car is completely irrelevant.

He sounds like a drunken eejit.

Clouds - the OP does not have to put up with this .

tower - find a way to move. Then tell him he needs to seek help for his drinking and spoilt ways.

[FeistyLass]

Obviously his threats were completely unreasonable but I was brought up to always offer the front seat of the car to someone older, and even as an adult, I would still offer MIL the front seat. I'm wondering if your FIL was taught the same. In which case, your refusal to move would have been a big insult.
I'm not excusing any of his behaviour or any of the awful history but just a different perspective on why the seat issue became a flashpoint.

[CloudsAndTrees]

He sounds like a twat, and until I read your second post I was ready to say that you are not obliged to see him, or speak to him, so don't.

But as you have chosen to become dependant on this man, then you have to put up with him.

[MummytoKatie]

You need to get out of that house. Whatever it takes.

Do you really really need 3 bedrooms? Can the kids share? Does your wife work? If not, can she start? If so, can you / she do more hours? Can you cut your spending?

Whilst you are beholden to him you are stuck with his behaviour. Once you are not then you can decide, as a couple, if you want him in your life at all and if so, to what level.

Your children should never have to witness this.

[toweraboveyou]

DW has been supportive. Last night, she told him that if he finished his threat he'd never see the kids again. We won't hear from him again now for a few weeks when we will be expected to have forgotten and excused his behaviour. I'm not willing to. He was extremely spoiled as a child and has never grown out of it.

[TooExtraImmatureCheddar]

What did your wife think? I would be mortified if my dad said/did anything like that to DH. But I love my dad and wouldn't want to sever ties with him. However, he has never been anything but nice to DH, so it would be very out of character. If this sort of behaviour is in character for your FIL, then I think your wife needs to give her relationship with her father some serious thought.

And yy to trying to move out and not being beholden to him anymore!

[MerlotAndMe]

Sorry i see u have said u cant. but as i knew well in my relationship , money is power to these types. u owe him RESPECT and he is going to have it!! it is his DUE.

[MerlotAndMe]

Agree with pps. move out. dont give him power over u. p

[MerlotAndMe]

Wow. he is a bully and a narcissist. most normal people will back down if the sense other people dont understand the depth of their anger but other perspectives cant penetrate a narcissists forcefield of self righteousness/importance.