To ask a universal credit question?

[BarcelonaBabes]

To get benefits when it changes, if you are part of a couple, will you both have to be working? I'm confused

[Sneezingwakesthebaby]

Oops cross post!

[vision123]

I have read the link [thanks CRUMPS]but it says nothing of working somewhere for nothing. [workfare]

[Mrcrumpswife]

Sneezing Housing benefit is definitely worked into UC. Its already inc on the calculators.

policyinpractice.co.uk/universal-credit/universal-credit-calculator/

This is the nearest you can get to a calculation. I cant think why they are being so cagey about updating entitledto.com so that everyone can find out just how they will be affected.

The calculator is only an estimate.

[Mrcrumpswife]

Vision thats because its in the small print. I will find you a document if i can but this whole system is constantly changing because they have already been warned it wont work so its a work in progress hence why local MPs havent got a clue about finer details.

[vision123]

Crumps... thank you.

Are my calculations above correct?

[Mrcrumpswife]

*Changes to the existing regime

1. We will introduce important changes to the existing conditionality and sanctions
   

regime to strengthen the link between people receiving benefits and meeting
their responsibilities.  

1. This will involve:
   

a. increasing the level of conditionality that is applied to some recipients;
b.  ensuring recipients fully understand what is expected of them by introducing
a claimant commitment;
c.   improving the sanctions regime so that it more effectively encourages recipients
to meet their responsibilities; and
d.  introducing Mandatory Work Activity so that some recipients will be required
to take part in full-time work activity for four weeks.

1. We will begin to make these changes in the existing benefits system and they
   

will be carried forward under Universal Credit, with adjustments as necessary.

1. Financial support will remain unconditional for people who we do not expect to be
   

able to work or prepare for work. None of the changes set out in this White Paper
change that basic principle.

I have copied and pasted the bit about conditionality for you but heres the complete doc on the link. Its the DWP so not newspaper gossip and speculation but may have changed as they dont know what they are doing. Its Letter d you want!

www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/universal-credit-chapter3.pdf

[vision123]

So if as a couple you work [one full time and one part time] and have a child aged 12 and you earn £369 a week together you will not be asked to work in poundland for free?

£19,188 a year.

[vision123]

People receiving Universal Credit but earning above the relevant threshold would
not be subject to conditionality. Those in work but earning below the threshold
would be in the conditionality group applicable to their circumstances.


GOOD DOCUMENT BUT WHAT IS THE : RELEVANT THRESHOLD;

Sorry for caps

[Mrcrumpswife]

I Have absolutely no idea tbh. The way i read it is that if you rely on financial support from the state by applying for UC then you sign the agreement and therefore become subject to conditionality and all of the sanctions they can enforce if you dont comply.

The only way around it would be is not to apply but that might be me being very pessimistic about this Government.

If the cut off point is 19,188 and they will leave you alone, it makes you wonder if you are entitled to claim UC if you earn that amount

I'm a cynical old git so ignore me!

[vision123]

mmmmmm just have to wait and see.......

[Mrcrumpswife]

I think that is their intention, pretty much the same as Privatising Schools and Hospitals, by the time we open our eyes to whats happening its too late and job done

[vision123]

It could be another poll tax though!!!!

[Mrcrumpswife]

Lets hope so but this whole country appears to be totally indifferent to everything. Maybe the choice of heat or food will focus everyone onto the streets. Something has to wake everyone up.

If i hear the phrase languishing on benefits once more i will scream.

[calandarbear]

I have to say, if the threshold was over £19,000 and we earned that I wouldn't bother claiming as we would be comfortable on that amount.
I have done some sums and as a couple we would have to work another 10hrs at NMW to reach that threshold so I hopefully if we are not switched over to UC until after September 2015 when my youngest starts school I will be able to stick to my plan of a 16hr job without claiming at all.

[wannabedomesticgoddess]

I think people dont really know what to do.

We can vote them out, but UC will already be in place.

What can anyone do?

[OptimisticPessimist]

If all of your children are 12 or over then as a couple you will be expected to earn the equivalent of two full time jobs at NMW, so 70 hours at £6.19. That's £433 a week. If your family earns £433 or more per week you will not be expected to look for extra work.

[PearlyWhites]

Vision, relevant threshold is earning the equivilant of the following at national minumum wage: 35 hours at nmw x 2 per couple(70 hours) or 35 hours add 24 hours if you have child age 1-12 (59 hours) or 35 hours if you have an under 1 That will give you no conditions.

[PearlyWhites]

You also only need to work the 35 hours if you have a dc's age 1 to 4 but you will have conditions ie back to work meetings etc

[PearlyWhites]

For a lone parent it's under 1 zero hours
1 to 4 zero hours but attend back to work meetings
5-12 24 hours
13 over 35 hours

Hours are not actual hours but the equivalent in national minimum wage

[Sneezingwakesthebaby]

Does anyone have any ideas what the back to work meetings between ages 1-4 will entail?

[lougle]

I don't think that's what barcelona was asking, was it? I think you're asking (but I might be wrong!) if a couple will have to be working to get benefits.

The answer to that question (but perhaps not the question you were asking ) is 'no'.

Universal Credit will be payable to all working age claimants. However, the ceiling for UC 'conditionality' is possibly going to be 35 hours at NMW for both earners if you have no children. If you have children, the age of the children will affect the number of hours one of you has to work, or seek to work. If one of you is disabled, that too will have an effect.

However, the ceiling is an either or ceiling. If one of you can get work that pays enough to lift you above the equivalent value of the 'conditionality', then the other will no longer be subject to it.

So:

2x£6.19x35=£433.30 per week.

But, if one of you earns £12.38 per hour, then you would only need one of you to work, because

1x£12.38x35=£433.30

If one of you were very lucky to be earning a wage of £30 per hour, then you would need only one of you to work 15 hours per week.

[lougle]

x posted with a few of you!

[OptimisticPessimist]

If it's anything like the current ones (I'm a LP on income support, and that's already a requirement) they're every six months, I go to the job centre and discuss my situation with my advisor and what I'm doing to prepare myself for work (so in my case I'm doing an OU degree and intend to learn to drive) and then she lets me know of any big employment opportunities (say a big store opening soon or similar) gives me a list of the back to work incentives and that's about it.

[vision123]

There will haVE TO BE lot of work in job centres going to keep up with all the extra work!!!

[Sneezingwakesthebaby]

Thanks optimistic! I wonder how often they will be on UC. More often I can imagine.