Are this bride and groom being unreasonable?

[TidyDancer]

Upcoming wedding, children are welcome. Quite large scale do.

One couple are being invited minus their DCs however, because they are very badly behaved. They have run amok at a wedding earlier in the year that the B&G of this wedding were present at. They have also done similar at other social gatherings.

The parents do not discipline their DCs. The mother refuses to because (and she does admit this) she is worried the DCs won't love her if she tells them off. The father is handsoff and defers to the mother on all childrearing issues. This has been the case since they were small children. One is now 10, the other 7.

The parents are angry the DCs have been excluded from this wedding and are thinking of confronting their friends. B&G did not want to have a childfree wedding, but they really do not want the drama and disturbance that accompanies this family with the undisciplined DCs. Other guests that have been present for the behaviour before have actively thanked the B&G for taking this step.

Who is unreasonable? The B&G for excluding the DCs, or the parents for kicking up a fuss about it?

[foslady]

Oops - forgot to add, totally with bride and groom......

[foslady]

I had an obnoxious child at my wedding - and I'd planned mine to be totally child friendly. Even though the marriage failed, I still feel a bit twitchy when I remember said child standing right next to us at the alter, stamping her feet and rattling a bag of quavers whilst parents just left her there (she wanted to be with her daddy, our best man......., especially when her parents got married I stayed in the lobby entertaining my child missing it all.......and don't even get me started on both their reception and mine.....

[MissM]

I was! I've tried and tried over the years to be chilled about it, but I can't quite manage it.

[pinkyredrose]

MissM that's awful ! I would've been so upset!

[5Foot5]

The parents are angry the DCs have been excluded from this wedding and are thinking of confronting their friends.

Bring it on! The B&G have done the right thing and if confronted should (calmly) tell the truth.

[MissM]

When we got married my then two year-old niece screamed and rolled on the floor throughout our vows. My SIL and brother didn't take her out, and I have never quite forgiven them. We'd written our own vows and it was really important to me that everyone heard what we had to say, and most people didn't.

Your friends are brave, but completely in the right. If people's kids can't behave then the parents have to either take responsibility not to let their bad behaviour affect others, or take the consequences.

[Bogeyface]

Tidy how did the bride get on?

[bubalou]

Maisiejoe - I didn't have a problem with parents putting their children in the crèche as I spoke to them all in person when I gave out the invitations - or I called them when I sent it out.

They were all very reasonable & completely fine with it, no issues at all. I was quite clear that the options were to put them in the crèche or not bring them - more than fair I think. We paid for a crèche, paid for their meals & a children's entertainer in the evening. If they kicked up a fuss I would have no problem telling them to leave them at home - especially as almost all weddings I have been to in last 5 years have been child free.

[Proudnscary]

Tidy - that's great because otherwise the bride could end up being demonised if friends aren't honest about why these kids aren't invited and make it clear that they agree with the decision.

[MrsMelons]

I think this thread has the most NBU I have ever seen (all bar one in 7 pages?).

I have no idea what I would do in this situation but quite possibly just invite the parents for the evening as IMO that bit is for the grown ups anyway so may have made it easier.

We had a child free wedding other than immediate family mainly for numbers as it would have double the guest list but also because I wanted people to enjoy the day without lots of kids running around.

My friends has DCs that have a tendancy to break things as well as any house rules and I tend to invite her to meet up with us at MacD's or a play area rather than at my house. I do have to exclude them if I have gatherings at home as it is way too stressful. If she asked I would have to tell her but so far she hasn't realised. All our friends do this with her and her DCs though.

Well done to the B&G for having the balls to do this although they should have spoken to them before sending the invites out.

[Iactuallydothinkso]

I certainly echo the sentiment that the bride and groom have balls and tits of steel! Hurrah for them! It will probably be awkward for them though.

Had a similar situation for the last few years. Large group of friends, one family would not tell their kids off for anything, none of the rest of the kids liked their company, they were rude and obnoxious and had no manners at all and the parents condoned it. We just stopped having parties, nobody could face telling them, very opinionated parents too so we all just stopped having parties. Now we do it in secret! It's pathetic really but easier.

[SlightlySuperiorPeasant]

TANBU. Good for them.

[TidyDancer]

Proud, yes I would back my friend up. The children's behaviour was so unbelievable the last time around that I'm surprised this has not come up in the interim.

Bride is speaking to parents tonight. Groom is working, or would be there too.

[maisiejoe123]

Only had a small wedding myself and no children because litererally I had to keep guests to a bare minimum. However what would you do if a relative or friend's child refuses to go into the creche?

I suspect most parents would eventually agree the child could come into the wedding if they promised to behave.... and then of course they dont!

You wouldnt be there to sort it out and I expect any ushers would not feel comfortable grabbing a screaming child and insist they went into the creche!

I did attend a wedding where during the cermoney (which was particularly important to the B&G) no children were allowed into the chuch. They could come to the reception but not the church. They told all their guests that they would not be allowed in well in advance, took some flak from some guests who thought they were of course the exception but they were firm. Only a smallish wedding so I think its easier to control but its the 200+ guests that could prove a bit of a nightmare because there are always one or two!

[bubalou]

I know. We were very lucky - and organised. There was a separate marquee next to us where it was set up.

I did say on my invitations and was very good friends with or family to those with the children that I let them know their options clearly.

1, They let their hair down if they want & leave the kids with some1 else at home

2, They bring them & they go in the creche during the ceremony.

There was no third option.

We paid for a specialist, qualified creche all CRB checked etc with activities for all ages. I had a cousin who was a little shit and he was 6 at the time so I stated all children under 8 had to go in there.

I don't regret it - beautiful quiet ceremony was perfect.

[maisiejoe123]

I have seen creches set up but its the tricky children who refuse to attend a creche and scream the place down who end up sitting in the front row of the ceremony causing havoc.

Why are people so selfish in letting their children cry during weddings and ruin it for the rest by doing nothing. For goodness sake sit at the back and take them out the minute they start. But they dont do they..... And dont get me started on the people who let their children wander up and down the aisle!

[bubalou]

Their wedding their choice.

I had lots of family & friends with small children so I didn't want to exclude them from my wedding - 5 years ago now.

I also 'snobby or not I don't give a shit' did not want crying all the way through the ceremony which I had seen at a few weddings. So me & DH paid for a 'creche' during the ceremony. The staff were all checked / nursery staff / qualified etc and they played games - had a soft play area set up - painted plates etc & did crafts.

It was great - yes it cost about £300 but in the grande scheme of things that we paid for was nothing. The ceremony went so smoothly & all the parent commented on how great it was.

I went to a close friends wedding 7 months later - they had decided not to book the creche - she had her sister in laws kid crying almost all the way through!!!! The mum didn't take the baby out until the organiser from the venue asked her to! Their video of the ceremony was ruined.

[maisiejoe123]

Many years ago a friend of mine only allowed children over the age of 12 to her wedding. There werent that many of her friends who had children this old but she thought making it a reasonable age would make it a more grown up wedding.

One of her friends turned up with a BF baby - said she couldnt possibly leave them at home. Planted herself in the front row (so the baby could see what was going on and had to be moved because that was where the direct relatives were sitting!) and then completely ruined the service by allowing the baby to cry, talked loudly to try and sooth it and generally make the vows and the serious service a complete right off....

I know BF babies are different but the bride was in tears so I think her friend was being incredibly selfish to behave like this and make it all about her.....

I know we will all say we wouldnt do that, sit at the back etc etc but there are more people out there like this than you think!

[Proudnscary]

They're not being unreasonable.

But I would never do this.

We have friends with awfully behaved kids (one in particular), we'd never exclude them - possibly lack of balls but overall I think I just couldn't hurt their feelings like that.

I don't mind a bit of chaos/drama/craziness/noise at weddings - even my own - so I can't see it bothering me unless they set fire to my dress or sat on the wedding cake or summat.

You say you support the bride's decision. Does that mean you will say that to the friend if she asks you or talks to you about this?

[Floggingmolly]

Only equalled by the kid's parents, Cantbelieve. They stood by and watched their kids trash one wedding party already, remember.

[Cantbelieveitsnotbutter]

I dont think they are being unreasonable at all, but my god theyve got some balls!!!

[OTheHugeManatee]

bottleofbeer Does she levitate near the ceiling? Projectile vomit whilst blaspheming, perhaps? Does her head rotate all the way round?

If so I can understand your concern

[bottleofbeer]

I know of someone with kids like this. I'm a pretty tolerant person of kids and their behaviour at times. I've got four of my own and there isn't a tantrum at the worst possible time or place I've not been the victim of .

But my word, these kids are something else. The little girl, ugh, there is something so obviously wired wrong that as horrible as it sounds, she makes me shudder. She's so conniving, manipulative and just generally horrible that I really don't want my own daughter anywhere near her.

The parents are sooooo self absorbed that YES to the point that if your children are that awful to be around you have totally failed. It's come up time and again within groups of friends who know them. You can see people feel awkward broaching the subject but at some point every single person who knows these kids have said something along the lines of "is it just me or is that child really difficult to be around?". It's never been about bitching, it's been about people tentatively putting wondering if it's odd to feel that way about a child and massive relief when they're told that no, it's not just them.

I had a child free wedding but even if I hadn't she wouldn't have got within a million miles of it. Sounds shocking doesn't it? but I just cannot articulate what it is about her. I find myself feeling genuinely concerned for the kids she comes across in her life and as she grows up.

[MamyPoko]

I don't see how it's a wake up call for the parents, or how they are suffering the consequences for their parenting decisions, if they are welcome at the wedding (and, I think, at the OP's future wedding) without their children.

Bride and groom are within their rights to take a stand, but if the fault lies with the parents, isn't this a cop-out? Don't invite any of them.

[Bogeyface]

Sorry, my first sentence got mixed up thanks to the ipad!

I meant that with regard to children behaving badly it isnt SEN that is the issue, but the parent.