to think these vile girls should be named and shamed?

[LadyBuzz]

There have been 4 serious sexual assaults in the last 2 weeks in the small city where i live which is generally quite sleepy and quiet.
In the local news paper tonight it has been reported that 2 of these attacks are complete fabrications and the girls in question have been arrested for it.

AIBU to believe that they should be named and shamed for this. The 2 women who have really been assaulted must be going through such a traumatic time at the moment and to have this made a mockery of must be a kick in the teeth for them.

I am amazed that anybody would make something like this up!

[mathanxiety]

In every single case of rape that does not involve some really disreputable male stranger snatching a vestal virgin as she brings calves foot jelly to the poor of the parish on a Sunday afternoon, dragging her into the bushes, and treating her brutally, the assumption of police, prosecution and juries is that the accusation has some ulterior motivation.

It is not so long ago that men were legally entitled to rape their wives. In fact the idea that a married woman could be raped by her husband was unthinkable to legal minds.

The chances of any woman's claim being taken seriously are already slim to none, basically because of the assumptions that rape is about sex, and that men are entitled to sex when they feel like it, from which flows the assumption that women 'ask for it' and therefore there is no culpability on the part of the rapist. It is the media salivating about these particular women who could damage women's chances further, not whatever they themselves have done (and I think any woman who does a thing like this needs help and not the wrath of the town or the DM).

Women's stories of rape will always be doubted. This is fuel on the fire, true, but it is only so because some editor has taken the story for reasons of his (?) own and decided to run with it. And the story only flies because people are willing to swallow such tripe.

[havinhoops1974]

something like this happened near where I live the story was far fetched and then turned out to be a hoax the whole area was cordoned off for days, pretty much been forgotten nowc I think tbh naming and shaming gives shocking behaviour more attention than it deserves.

[MrsDanverclone]

I agree with grovel. Woman like these do damage the chances of genuine victims of rape, having the courage to report the crime, being believed and getting justice.

As the OP mentions, 2 other women in this area are victims of sexual assault, how many people are starting to doubt their story because of the 2 women who made up allegations.

[TandB]

No, I don't think they should be "named and shamed". Not least because I am a bit sick of our justice system being treated as some sort of sideshow for tabloid-obsessed gossip-mongers. Reporting is often spectacularly inaccurate and almost always heavily biased. I would be more than happy for every single criminal trial to take place under strict reporting restrictions until there is a conviction.

Furthermore, while false rape/sexual assault allegations are relatively rare, they do happen and people are aware that they do happen. Highlighting high-profile instances will only serve to make people think they are far more common than they are which will have a huge impact on genuine victims who are struggling with the decision as to whether to report or not, and potentially on the likelihood of a jury convicting a genuine offender.

Having worked on more than one case where there has been a provably false allegation, I think it is a horrendous, life-destroying thing to do to anyone, but in those cases the complainant's personal circumstances were very far from being "normal" and naming and shaming would not have helped anyone.

[grovel]

mathanxiety, you make good points but surely one of the reasons there are so few convictions is that the police/juries etc know that accusations can be false because of examples such as this. These women have damaged the chances of other women seeing justice done. That makes them wicked, not just silly.

[MrsDanverclone]

YABU because it would be very detrimental to victims of rape or sexual assault thinking about reporting to the police.

But I can totally understand the OP, about not being able to comprehend how someone could make up something like this. This is a small city, these woman will be outed, its a small community, people talk. Then when they are convicted, they will also be named.
I hope they can live with themselves.

[mathanxiety]

'If intercourse did take place and the question is just 'was it consensual or not', then it's basically one persons word against anothers. And mud sticks.'

In a nutshell, that is why there should be no naming and shaming. Where is the line between a 'he said/ she said' case and a false accusation, in the eyes of the general public?

'From what I can gather one of the girls accused a particular person after consensual intercourse'
WHO DECIDES WHETHER SEX IS RAPE OR CONSENSUAL? I am shouting on purpose here because that statement of yours is so incredibly unbelievable LabyBuzz.

'As a couple of people have mentioned if you are accused of a crime of this nature it can have a massive impact on your life.'
I really do not understand why you started this thread. An accusation of rape is one thing and a pair of girls making up stories and wasting police time is another surely? Lots of men are accused of rape. A tiny, tiny minority of reported rapes is prosecuted and a tiny proportion of this small number gets prison time.
The vast majority of rapes go unreported and therefore un-prosecuted, and therefore the number of real, actual rapists out and about in society far outnumbers the number of rapists either accused or behind bars, and yet here you are wringing your hands about the effect of a false accusation of rape on the accused. Why?

I would be very interested to see what myths you believe about rape.

[LadyBuzz]

one of them has been charged with wasting police time and perverting the course of justice.
The other was only arrested yesterday

[cory]

So far, are not these girls in the same position as the alleged perpetrators- i.e. they have been accused of a crime but not yet convicted?

[LadyBuzz]

I think i might need to clarify, In no way do I condone the rapists and I really hope that the men in question are caught and dealt with accordingly. also hope the women concerned get the support and help that they need to get through such an ordeal.

Maybe I should have worded my OP a little better, It perhaps should have said AIBU to not understand why somebody would make something like this up?

As a couple of people have mentioned if you are accused of a crime of this nature it can have a massive impact on your life.

From what I can gather one of the girls accused a particular person after consensual intercourse and the other made it all up, and wasn't even in the place she said she was at the time.

[slavetofilofax]

Mumbling Being falsely accused of terrorism would be pretty awful, but it's much easier to prove guilt or innocence either way, so I don't think it is as bad. A man will find it much easier to prove he isn't a terrorist than to prove he isn't a rapist.

Rape is different. It is widely known that it is hard to get a rape conviction because of evidence, so it is easy for people to believe that, even if there is no conviction, a rape could still have happened. If intercourse did take place and the question is just 'was it consensual or not', then it's basically one persons word against anothers. And mud sticks.

[TheQueenOfDeDead]

As others have said interesting that your ire is directed at women who have been accused of fabricating an attack

I don't ever think the name and shame approach is an appropriate one so YABU, beyond that how the women are dealt with if they did in fact fabricate the attack depends IMO on whether they accused a particular person or whether they simply claimed to have been attacked.

[mathanxiety]

Judging by many surveys commissioned by many interested parties over the years, rape is something women deserve in the opinion of very large sections of the population. It is not obviously beyond wrong to a lot of people whether they have half a brain or not is obviously questionable but in the case of rape there are many, many members of the public who think there must be two sides to the story. Very sad state of affairs.

[tryingtoleave]

I'm confused.

Did the women say they were raped or did they accuse a specific person of rape?

If it was the first, I would think there was something wrong with them.

If it was the second, and it was done maliciously, then that is fairly vile.

Either way, some sort of record should be kept, because I think people who do this often do it more than once.

[jade80]

I would assume because rape is obviously beyond wrong to anyone with half a brain. The OP is commenting on another aspect of the situation. It doesn't mean she thinks rape is fine.

[Morloth]

Well, it doesn't.

In fact the OP doesn't actually mention the rapists at all. It is really only about what these two women have done.

And people wonder why so many rapes are not reported.

It is wrong and illegal to falsely report a crime, but not as wrong as raping someone. So why the fuss about the smaller crime and not the bigger one?

[jade80]

Ah ok morloth. I'd imagine her response would be much the same though.

Slinking, but she didn't say the rapists weren't vile too. Presumably she felt that went without saying.

[SlinkingOutsideInSocks]

Another one who thinks it's extremely questionable that your ire and use of the word 'vile' is directed towards two women who made false accusations and not the aggressors.

They are vile. They should be named and shamed.

[Morloth]

My comment was directed towards the OP.

[jade80]

I hope they aren't just let off if it is true. They'll probably just get a minor ticking off though (lack of faith in CPS emoticon). Hmm, that's where we differ, I think there are people more deserving of help than their type.

[FreudianSlipper]

but they won't be just let off but they obvioulsy do need some sort of help i would rather they got that help than none at all

[jade80]

I know all that. I'm just saying that when it does happen, the false accusers should not be let off and viewed as 'poor troubled people who need counselling and help'. This has no reflection on my views about rape and the abysmal reporting rate and conviction rate. In fact their actions are even worse in light of the fact the crime the have lied about is rape.

[FreudianSlipper]

released ....

[FreudianSlipper]

because it does not often happen. its a totally different crime, it?s a lie, it?s a very bad lie but that is what it is and the law will deal with them. convictions for rape are very low we need as many women (or men) to come forward and report rapists to prevent these men raping again, if one women comes forward and his picture is realised more women are likely to come forward. not much press is given to rape convictions how many stories unless they have raped many women have you read about recently and how many have you read about women who have made the story up. this is believed to be around 5% of allegations yet gains a lot more publicity

[jade80]

That's not what I said. The sexual assaults are of course awful. The false accusations are also terrible as they will have an awful impact on the accused- mud sticks. Obviously one crime is worse than another, but that doesn't mean that false accusers should get a pat on the head and counselling. They should get a bollocking and some sort of criminal record.