Airplanes and reclining seats

[MrsCampbellBlack]

So on flight with infant daughter on lap and woman in front keeps reclining her seat leaving us with very little space to even breathe. Not surprisingly DD gets a little ahem upset and screams loudly - god so loudly! Woman in front does lots of tutting.

Stewards asked her to put seat up but she reclines it as soon as they go away.

So am I mad to think she was being incredibly inconsiderate or is it just part and parcel of plane travel.

Other passengers utterly charming and Airplane staff agreed she was a nightmare but nothing they could do.

[Butterbur]

It was twat, in fact.

[BrainSurgeon]

Oh

In that case I have two possible explanations: either the MNHQ radar is broken and doesn't pick up all the 'twat's, or, they picked up a difference in context - I was using the term generically without actually calling a specific poster a twat, did you actually direct the word at one or more posters?

[BrainSurgeon]

(apologies for the repeated "actually")

[Butterbur]

Nope I said there were some selfish t*s on here, meaning the "I've paid for my seat and I'll incline it if I want to" brigade.

[DragonAlley]

I think there'd are some selfish twats on here too. The "I've paid for my seat so I'll sit with my knees deliberately wedged on the back of the person in front and fuck about with their seat" brigade.

[MrsCampbellBlack]

Well lovely travel company rep (Exclusive Escapes - utterly fab) has been and is going to hopefully sort out better seats on return flight.

And tallulah. . . I don't think I ever 'moaned' about people disagreeing with me. Because that would be rude and I am not.

And many thanks Surreydad for your valuable contribution.

And this is my first ever AIBU thread despite being on here for ages and there have been deletions and everything

[eurochick]

Dragon tall people don't have much choice about where their knees go when strapped into an aeroplane seat... If they splay them they take up leg room from the people on either side.

[DragonAlley]

I wasn't referring to tall people but to the people who deliberately ram their knees in the back of the person in front to ensure they can't recline their seat. That is just as much selfish twat behaviour as reclining and not being prepared to compromise.

[Salmotrutta]

Apologies as I have only read a couple of pages - but I had the pleasure last week of sitting behind someone on a 2 hour flight who reclined their seat for the whole journey. Normally I live and let live but she did this even when the snack and drink was served - which meant that my tray was right up at my midriff so any maneouvreing was almost impossible. If I wasn't fairly slim I'd have been even more uncomfortable. The cabin crew said nothing to her and I felt there was little point saying anything as she had the right to do so but it was uncomfortable and annoying. I'm tall and flights are an endurance test anyway with some airlines.
She also helpfully kept stretching and flinging her arms back over her head rest so that I had to avoid a smack in the face.
And no, it didn't give me more leg room.

[Backinthebox]

The problem here though, going back to the basic issue, is that lots of people want to travel on the cheap, and the airlines have to get a lot of people on the aircraft to be able to lower their prices to keep up with the public expectation. When you bear in mind that the average punter likes to believe that somewhere out there you can buy a return flight on a $70million jet to Magaluf for less than half the price of a very average loaf of bread, you will begin to realise that the airlines have to jam them in very tight indeed. What it fundamentally boils down to is that the more you spend on your seat, the more space around you you will have. However, the aircraft manufacturers make a bogstandard reclining seat and just ask the customer airline how close they want them putting together. You want a non-reclining seat? That's non-standard and will cost more - and Joe Public is not going to pay more to fly with an airline that has the same miniscule amount of seat space but without the recline facility.

Unfortunately the only way it will change is if the airlines unilaterally start to charge a LOT more for their tickets, or if a lot of people voluntarily start paying for extra legroom or to travel only on carriers that cost more but have more legroom in their economy class. The sad fact is that the way people work is that they see a cheap flight or holiday, book it and then bitch about the fact that they got a cheap product and the other passengers were scum.

So there we go. As with all things in life, if you want a better seat/flight/bag of crips/whatever, it costs more money, and not everyone wants to or can afford to pay for it. I suppose we should all just be happy with what we've got and be considerate to those around us, but who's going to be the first to do that, eh?

[MrsCampbellBlack]

Backinthe box - fair point however my holiday wasn't cheap and I still think its just about basic courtesy but hey ho. However to upgrade to business class would have been an additional £2,500 which I felt was quite a lot for a 3 hour flight.

And in the years I've been travelling since having dc's this is the first time its happened so perhaps the majority of people are considerate.

[PlumSykes]

It's just very ill-mannered. Of course she had the right to tilt her seat, but good manners would have had her check behind her first. How ghastly to think that we can all do whatever suits, with no consideration to others, just because we want to.

I have the right to open up a thermos filled with highly potent, spicy food and eat it during a flight, while belching profusely, but I would not. Manners, see?

Nor would I floss my teeth, 'do' my toenails or de-louse my children on a plane. All allowed (so long as the nit lotion was under 100ml) but not terrifically sociable, or considerate.

[Backinthebox]

PlumSykes, you'd be amazed what people do on planes that they would not consider doing 'in the real world.'

[itsastrawpoll]

I don't really know where I stand on this because I never fly. Let's face it if you're a pauper like you lot are and the conditions are so horrible that you're bitching about what someone else does with their seat then surely you're better off staying at home.

Perhaps the anti-recliners should write to the airlines and request they remove the function to recline the seats though? Searching my memory banks here but from the deep dark past if I've flown and the person in front has reclined, then I've reclined my seat too. If everyone operated a reactive recline mexican wave, if you will, then surely there would be no problem? Cos the person at the back of the plan has tons of space anyway.

[bruffin]

"If everyone operated a reactive recline mexican wave, if you will, then surely there would be no problem? Cos the person at the back of the plan has tons of space anyway."

No they don't have huge space, the back rows seats don't recline. As I said above we got stuck in the back row all the way to miami (DH business trip but they kindly paid for me to go 6 foot 2 DH couldn't even sit in his seat and stwards would do nothing about it.

On the way back we made sure we were really early to get front row seats.
DH flew long haul last week for business and paid extra for premium economy for extra space so he didn't have this problem. He shouldn't have had to pay extra just to be able to sit in his seat he has paid for.

[wallstreet]

Sorry - don't see anything wrong with reclining. I'd rather the person in front didn't but it is perfectly acceptable etiquette to do it.

[glassescase]

It's simple really- buy a seat for the child. Just because you are travelling with children, the rest of the passengers owe you a pleasant flight.

[frillyflower]

"Sorry - don't see anything wrong with reclining. I'd rather the person in front didn't but it is perfectly acceptable etiquette to do it."

Yes, but it's not acceptable etiquette is it? It's very rude and inconsiderate. And completely unnecessary on a 2 or 3 hour flight.

I hate the fact people think it's OK to be so selfish.

[maryellenwalton]

Glasses, I have every right to travel with my children, and for them and I to be treated with consideration. Why do some people sound so bitter about the fact that folk dare to travel with their children? Comes across as pretty prejudiced towards the next generation. No one would accuse you of choosing to travel with your elderly parents and thus deserving what shitty treatment you got!

And why the hang up as to whether you have paid for the child to have a seat or not? Completely irrelevant. If my son is on my lap I have paid what I am required to pay in order for him to have the right to sit there

[cantspel]

I have travelled with my children ever since the youngest was 3 months old and never heard of this weird ettiquette of not reclining seats. Infact i have never given it any thought at all.
I am quite happy if the person infront wants to recline after all it is their seat, they paid for it and i know when i book that space will be limited.
Sometimes i may choose to recline my seat and sometimes i may not. My seat my choice.

[PinkFondantFancy]

Sorry I haven't read the whole thread but my general view is with wallflower-if the person in front of me has reclined, and a person with a child is behind me, what am I supposed to do? Maybe it is selfish but I don't see why I should spend three hours uncomfortable when I have the option to recline. Plus its impossible to sleep unless youre reclined-i know its only a few degrees different but the upright position feels as if it's beyond vertical. I can see why OP is annoyed, and my heart goes out to you being stuck on the back row but I think the annoyance is misplaced-economy is crowded and grim for everyone, that's not the fault of the person in front of you, sorry.

[glassescase]

Ffs no one said you do not have the right to travel with your child. And yes you have paid for him to sit on our lap. YOUR lap. YOUR child. Just because someone else chooses to recline their seat, does not make them prejudiced towards an entire generation. No one is BITTER, you just want to play the victim-"poor little me, I have to travel with my Baby".
If I travel with my elderly parents, they would not be on my knee, so I fail to see the connection there.
Pay for a SEAT and the child will have lots of room. No hang up. You get what you pay for.

[rosyvalentine]

YANBU at all! I hate, hate, hate when people recline their seats on short flights. Although they may well be entitled to do so, it's selfish and inconsiderate (in most cases). To those who have suggested paying for seats with additional legroom - I'm fairly sure that the seats with extra legroom are usually located at the emergency exit rows and small children or babies are not allowed to sit in those rows (or the front/first row) due to safety regulations so purchasing seats with extra legroom is not an option if you're travelling with kids.

[crystalglasses]

I'm amazed at the number of mumsnetters that think it is ok to recline their seats so that they invade the personal space of the person sitting behind. I thought it was just a few inconsiderate morons who did it. (Hesitated in writing this as no doubt someone will reported it to MNHQ for deletion).